Guns and Boats

sporters78 said:
alway shoot to kill :)
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Actually, you never, ever want to say that you shot to kill the bad guy. If you do make that blunder, the bad guy's attorney (or the attorney for the bad guy's estate) will eat you up in court with the many questions about "why didn't you just try to wound him by shooting him in the leg or arm? Are you such a cruel person that you decided right there and then that my client deserved to die? Who gave you the right to be the judge, jury and executioner of my client? "

If any of you ever finds yourself in the situation where you are defending/explaining your actions of shooting someone, you should ALWAYS say something to the effect that you felt you were forced to shoot the person to prevent him from continuing with the actions that forced you to make the decision to shoot him in the first place, and that you were only trying to stop him to protect yourself and others around you."

That takes the "bad guy" tag off of you and places it where it should be....on the bad guy.

GFC
 
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no one said to say to "shoot to kill" LOL, but always do,maybe you should look up florida law first. also take a concealed carry class to easy to miss a arm or leg, you put your shots in the chest.
 
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If I can't beat some sense into you with the 12" big rig tire checker the .38 ss snub may get it done. Hope I never ever have to use either. Would not be a pleasent day
 
Woody said:
What's the shot on a grizz with that 44mag, head, shoulder or do you just hope to sting them anywhere to back them off. Do they back off? Do you handload for them?
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I do handload. Most of the time if they get too close a few shots over the head scares them off. But if one is charging, any shot you can do. Most of the time they do a bluffing charge in which they come your way, and grunt, then back off, all the while you are ready.

I have been charged by browns (same as griz) and black bears. I have only had to shot at one (brown) and he turned quickly and left the area.

There is one requirement in Alaska. You must remove the front site. So when the bear shoves it up your <edited> it won't hurt so much!
 
I am going to disagree with GoFirstClass in that if you are ever find yourself involved in a shooting, keep your mouth shut. Don't say anything other than "I want my lawyer".

You have just been through an traumatic, and very stressful ordeal. You may be in shock. You may even second guess yourself while talking to the cops. You may leave key details out or remember something incorrectly. The cops will figure out what happened and now your version of events doesn't match up. You lied to them.

Plan on spending the night in jail until your lawyer can get you bailed out. He's the only person who should be talking to the cops on your behalf.

Check out this presentation by Professor James Duane about the pitfalls of talking to a cop.

[YOUTUBE]i8z7NC5sgik[/YOUTUBE]
 
AKBASSKING said:
I do handload. Most of the time if they get too close a few shots over the head scares them off. But if one is charging, any shot you can do. Most of the time they do a bluffing charge in which they come your way, and grunt, then back off, all the while you are ready.

I have been charged by browns (same as griz) and black bears. I have only had to shot at one (brown) and he turned quickly and left the area.

There is one requirement in Alaska. You must remove the front site. So when the bear shoves it up your <edited> it won't hurt so much!
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Is that what they do if they're already full? :lol: I've had a few experiences with black bears, they're good at putting on a act, we got one behind every tree in N. WI but I know that those grizz have a different temperament.
 
Woody said:
Is that what they do if they're already full? :lol: I've had a few experiences with black bears, they're good at putting on a act, we got one behind every tree in N. WI but I know that those grizz have a different temperament.
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If you are with a friend, then all you have to carry is a .22. If charged or chased by a bear, shoot your friend in the legs and you can get away scott-free...............:thumbsup:
 
AKBASSKING said:
If you are with a friend, then all you have to carry is a .22. If charged or chased by a bear, shoot your friend in the legs and you can get away scott-free...............:thumbsup:
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....and those that don't like firearms should never go with some one that can run faster than them.:smt043
 
No handguns on our boats up here. Handguns are restricted (some prohibited) so they are not allowed to be carried in public. Prohibited guns are not even allowed to be owned without special authorization. Regular rifles and shot guns are ok though.

I am not much of a gun guy, although I hunted when I was younger, but if I were to have a gun on my boat it would be a shotgun. My experience with handguns is limited to target practice, but I think even experienced handgun owners may be challenged to hit a bad guy in a pressure situation, and within the confines of a boat it will be a pressure situation. There is an interesting story about a gunfight between a cop and drug dealer in an elevator- six shots fired, two hits...one in the foot and one in the leg!

If I am looking to scare off an idiot, the presence of the shotgun would be pretty dramatic, but with little kids on board, the greatest danger to them would be our own gun moreso than any would-be bad guy. I'll take my chances with the Louisville Slugger!!
 
bajturner said:
No handguns on our boats up here. Handguns are restricted (some prohibited) so they are not allowed to be carried in public. Prohibited guns are not even allowed to be owned without special authorization. Regular rifles and shot guns are ok though.

I am not much of a gun guy, although I hunted when I was younger, but if I were to have a gun on my boat it would be a shotgun. My experience with handguns is limited to target practice, but I think even experienced handgun owners may be challenged to hit a bad guy in a pressure situation, and within the confines of a boat it will be a pressure situation. There is an interesting story about a gunfight between a cop and drug dealer in an elevator- six shots fired, two hits...one in the foot and one in the leg!

If I am looking to scare off an idiot, the presence of the shotgun would be pretty dramatic, but with little kids on board, the greatest danger to them would be our own gun moreso than any would-be bad guy. I'll take my chances with the Louisville Slugger!!
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N disrespect intended, but you would change your mind if you were down here:smt009
 
LTD.330 said:
I am going to disagree with GoFirstClass in that if you are ever find yourself involved in a shooting, keep your mouth shut. Don't say anything other than "I want my lawyer".
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Actually you and I are on the exact same page. When I wrote the two posts above I was thinking in terms of the proceedings that take place after the initial investigations are concluded.

I've been in that same situation when I was a cop and was involved in a shooting. I was a firearms instructor and taught Post Shooting Trauma classes for the state. Part of my curriculum in the class was to emphasize that an officer NEVER, NEVER, NEVER, NEVER make any statements to his fellow officers beyond what might be needed for their safety (for example, if there were two bad guys and one got away, I would give a description of the one who escaped).

In my situation I knew it was an absolutely clean shooting. He'd taken a shot at me with a shotgun first, and I shot him. Because of the training I'd had I knew not to make any statements. My only statement was "this gun fired a shot and it hit that man."

I asked to be driven to the police station (I knew I was rattled and didn't want to risk driving) and when I got there I made one phone call to my attorney, then put myself in a room and started writing out a statement as fast as I could so I would not forget any details. Several other cops stuck their heads in and asked what happened (they always want to hear the details of anything "fun") but I refused to give any details at all.

My attorney arrived, we used my written statement to prepare a statement that we'd give to the investigators, and he took possession of my written statement. I never saw it again, and didn't need to because it was covered under attorney-client privelege and could not be made public.

The whole case was cleared up fairly quickly, the shooting was ruled justifiable, and I was exhonerated. I knew that would eventually be the outcome because it was such a clear case of self defense, but I also knew that "spontaneous utterances" have caused many people to go to jail. Once a spoken word is out there and heard by someone it can never be recalled.

So LTD, you and I truly are on the same page, I just didn't elaborate enough on that aspect when I was writing above.

GFC
 
sfergson727 said:
My firearm is a H&K 40 USP, with law enforcement trigger.
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Right there is what is going to bite you in the ass. Using a gun that you are not supposed to have and kill someone. Lawyers will have a field day with you saying 'you bought or modified a gun and were looking to kill someone'. Big no no, use a standard off the shelf gun without mods and at least they won't try and divert the court case in another direction.
 
trit21 said:
Right there is what is going to bite you in the ass. Using a gun that you are not supposed to have and kill someone. Lawyers will have a field day with you saying 'you bought or modified a gun and were looking to kill someone'. Big no no, use a standard off the shelf gun without mods and at least they won't try and divert the court case in another direction.
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So you are saying I shouldn't carry my new Glock 30 since I "modified" it by installing a newly released trigger safety:huh: http://www.siderlock.com/
 
GFC articulated his points well but what I would add to the other posts that a handgun is the better weapon to have on board as it is easier to conceal and easier to use in confined areas of the boat.

Just remember as in living on shore or as in CO where we had the "make my day law" shooting a person(s) should be your last resort and you must try and remove yourself from the threat if at all possible. Don't egg it on and you should be truly afraid that the suspect is going to kill or seriously injure you or a 3rd party on your boat.

If you are involved in a shooting whether on land or sea and it is eventually determined justified it will still be a bad situation that you wouldn't wish on anyone as the shooting is investigated.

Articulation is key and in law enforcement we had a saying that went " It is better to be judged by 12 than carried by 6" which means if you believe the threat is real then act upon it and as has been stated before NEVER carry a gun if you are mentally not prepared to use it.

Be safe and remember alcohol and guns do not mix.

Gerald (Retired CO County Sheriff) :smt024
 
after reading all the posts I see my concerns are not alone and some have already taken precautions. I don't have children on board and when we cruise it's only me and my wife. I have never been a big fan of carring a gun { although do to my job I carried for 20 years. } , but it seems we are in strange times. I think I would rather have the gun and not use it then not having it on board. After listening to your reply, it's all good food for thought.
 
I don't know if they sell it anymore but there was a shotgun enclosed in a waterproof tube called "Just In Case". Being on the Island of Longggg, all you need is a drivers license to purchase a "Long Gun". It might serve a purpose it has a pistol grip and a marine proof finish! Ex Puddle Pirate?
 
trit21 said:
Right there is what is going to bite you in the ass. Using a gun that you are not supposed to have and kill someone. Lawyers will have a field day with you saying 'you bought or modified a gun and were looking to kill someone'. Big no no, use a standard off the shelf gun without mods and at least they won't try and divert the court case in another direction.
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Can you enlighten us?
 
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