"one of the most challenging times ever seen in the history of the marine industry."

[SeaRM]

Re: "one of the most challenging times ever seen in the history of the marine industr

All this pedantic talk about the cost of boats and profit and overhead and cost of material is giving me a headache. If a boat is priced too high, people simply will not buy it. If it has poor quality, people will tend to leave it alone and look elsewhere. No matter how you try to rationalize costs.....it is what it is. If a boat cost too much for you, move on for the love of Pete and find something you can afford. Brunswick will lower the price of their boats only if they don't sell. In these times of economic trouble, no one is selling LOTS of boats but Searay is proportionately keeping its market share so the price of a new 48SD ain't going down....sorry.
Just my $.02.

My point outlined in better terms - very well said. To suggest that the manufacturer should be forced to price their product anything less than as profitable as possible is right out of Hugo Chavez's book. Start doing that and see how much they plow into development of pod steering, or whatever else makes a cool boat cool.

 

[First Born]

Re: "one of the most challenging times ever seen in the history of the marine industr

All this pedantic talk about the cost of boats and profit and overhead and cost of material is giving me a headache. If a boat is priced too high, people simply will not buy it. If it has poor quality, people will tend to leave it alone and look elsewhere. No matter how you try to rationalize costs.....it is what it is. If a boat cost too much for you, move on for the love of Pete and find something you can afford. Brunswick will lower the price of their boats only if they don't sell. In these times of economic trouble, no one is selling LOTS of boats but Searay is proportionately keeping its market share so the price of a new 48SD ain't going down....sorry.
Just my $.02.

I like the way you think Frank. I could not help but read that and think that should be the same logic people use for everything in life. If you don't like something move on, if you don't like the way something is run...move on...etc. If you think you can run something better, create it and have at it. That is the reason there are options or different models out there. There is no way to make everyone happy no matter what you are selling. There is no reason to get on a box and continue to talk about how much you dislike something, just move on to something you do like... ok my rant is over. -- Wesley

 

[Turtlesboat]

Re: "one of the most challenging times ever seen in the history of the marine industr

I think Wesley needs to be moderated. He's fallen victim.

 

[comsnark]

Re: "one of the most challenging times ever seen in the history of the marine industr

Well true. . .they are trying to maximize profit. For "luxury items" in a time of recession (or whatever state we are in) that is difficult.

Their current strategy, it appears, is to reduce production and have normal price increases. Which is a second hit on "volume" (after the normal economic effects). But of course, the goal is not volume. The goal is profit.

 

[Turtlesboat]

Re: "one of the most challenging times ever seen in the history of the marine industr

All I know is that i've been waiting for this change of events for 10 years. I have been working and saving for 10 years. I did the same thing about 10 years ago too. So no one ruin it for me. Now repeat after me, The economy WILL crash and I WILL get good deals on everything I've been holding off on.

 

[Four Suns]

Re: "one of the most challenging times ever seen in the history of the marine industr

Wesley,

We are talking about Sea Ray boats...

You lose the Easter egg hunt today?

 

[fc3]

Re: "one of the most challenging times ever seen in the history of the marine industr

Don't forget another great big cost -- regulation.

A few years ago, a small boat builder was up for sale. I knew one of the guys who was bidding for the business. It could have worked out for him. He knew manufacturing, polymers and the like. He needed some advice about boats and was talking with another friend. The main problem with the deal was that the owner of the boat company would not include the facility that housed the boat building operation. The building was small, primitive, and needed upgrading, but the site had an EPA grandfather and they could use the necessary chemicals. Any other site would have raised costs to prohibitive levels. Because of the EPA grandfather, the seller wanted a huge amount of money for the site. And so... no deal.

Best regards,
Frank

 

[First Born]

Re: "one of the most challenging times ever seen in the history of the marine industr

Don't forget another great big cost -- regulation.

The building was small, primitive, and needed upgrading, but the site had an EPA grandfather and they could use the necessary chemicals. Any other site would have raised costs to prohibitive levels. Because of the EPA grandfather, the seller wanted a huge amount of money for the site. And so... no deal.

Best regards,
Frank

Sounds like both parties made the right decisions for them...or I guess the buyer that decided to not put up the money could go around complaining that the boat owner cheated him out of the opportunity to make it work or he could look at it as an opportunity that passed and move on with what other successes he has had in life. Not sure which boat builder you are talking about but that would be my thoughts on the situation. :huh:

Great Easter Gary...thanks for asking...although I did lose the water balloon toss this year...but like everything else I am taking it in stride.

Back to the challeging times ever seen in the boating industry...I love talking boats...

Wesley

 

[bluebelly]

Re: "one of the most challenging times ever seen in the history of the marine industr

Reading the posts from everyone on this thread about dealer/manufacturer profits and business practices and the conjecture that is contained within is entertaining. I cannot believe that peoples' general knowledge about economics in a capitalist world has come down to envious rants about a boat should not cost "so and so", and is a price really "fair" for a boat when it costs so much less then selling price. Come on people, is that really what we want for us in the US???? If these manufacturers cannot make enough money then we will end up like Russia.... as in everyone has tons of money to spend but they have no goods to purchase because there was no incentive in the past for anyone to manufacture anything. Being a millionaire in that country is meaningless.

 

[Skip]

Re: "one of the most challenging times ever seen in the history of the marine industr

I love the post about "greedy mortgage idiots"
My zip code just hit the top 100 for foreclosures in the country. No "greedy mortgage idiot" puts a gun to anybody's head and makes them sign some idiotic 3/1 ARM that they can't afford. Stupid people made stupid assumptions about the appreciation of their real estate invesments, income level, etc., and when the market turned, were once again too stupid to lock in a fixed rate loan...assuming their credit would even allow them to.

All to the good, because I will buy one of these 1-2 year old repo homes for 50% of the cost new, clean it up and rent it to one of the many military families in my area who spend 2-3 years in beautiful northern Virginia before moving on.

And if it does not work out it is all on me.
I know, it is that pesky individual responsibility thing.

And the moronic $600 the gummint is going to send me for having two kids, so I can stimulate the economy?? Split between college funds and my fuel tanks on the 420DA.

Although, speaking of college funds, I am loathe to spend 30K a year per child to have them sit and listen to some liberal jackass blather on about how screwed up the US is...but that is the subject of another post. My wife went to West Point. Maybe that will work for the boys. I'd rather raise Spartans than liberals.

regards
Skip

 

[JV II]

Re: "one of the most challenging times ever seen in the history of the marine industr

If these manufacturers cannot make enough money then we will end up like Russia.... as in everyone has tons of money to spend but they have no goods to purchase because there was no incentive in the past for anyone to manufacture anything. Being a millionaire in that country is meaningless.

You are simply wrong.
Apparently Russans buy a tidy number of Sea Rays.
http://owners.searay.com/sea_ray_living_article.asp?chaid=67870&tab=5&
Probably at MSRP, maybe more.
In the three times that I've been in Russia I've seen no shortage of anything to buy from within and outside Russia. There are more Mercedes, Land Rovers, and BMWs on the road than I've seen in the US or European cities. They import all the good stuff. Their problem is not finding ways to spend their money, it is trying to stay alive keeping it.

 

[jrirvine1]

Re: "one of the most challenging times ever seen in the history of the marine industr

Jim,

I'm not sure how one guy working on a Saturday for about 5 hours and getting $200 is losing money... I supplied all the bricks, sand, and morter...

Um, ok, but your orignal post said he was building you an enclosure for $200, not just supplying labor. But that is still too low if you understand all that is included in our labor burden today - assuming you are operating as a legal enterprise.

Skip, do you really think all people that are having their home foreclosed upon, as a result of these crazy loans are just stupid and irresponsible? There is a concept referred to as predatory lending, with laws made to try and prevent it.

 

[keokie]

Re: "one of the most challenging times ever seen in the history of the marine industr

What do you mean by predatory lending? Nobody ever forced me to borrow money. No sarcasm intended. Why would a bank purposely make a loan that could not be repaid? I think many banks and individuals over-estimated the strength of the market. Now it is time to pay the piper. It is sad. I do have compassion them. But forcing those who used better judgement to pay for those who did not shows disdain for the wise. That is not very compassionate.

Another way to look at this is. When you are standing in line, reach into the wallet of the person in front of you and hand the money to the person behind you. The person behind you may appreciate it, but you are not being generous.

No tone or attitude intended. Just giving the point of view I was raised with and subscribe to.

 

[Dave S]

Re: "one of the most challenging times ever seen in the history of the marine industr

Who started this thread anyway??? :smt017:smt017

 

[ImpulseIII]

Re: "one of the most challenging times ever seen in the history of the marine industr

Some pot stirrer named Dave S. He should be blackballed from CRS!

 

[ImpulseIII]

Re: "one of the most challenging times ever seen in the history of the marine industr

I mean CSR....CRS is somethging we older guys get..It stands for Can't Remember S*IT....

 

[bluebelly]

Re: "one of the most challenging times ever seen in the history of the marine industr

You are simply wrong.
Apparently Russans buy a tidy number of Sea Rays.
http://owners.searay.com/sea_ray_living_article.asp?chaid=67870&tab=5&
Probably at MSRP, maybe more.
In the three times that I've been in Russia I've seen no shortage of anything to buy from within and outside Russia. There are more Mercedes, Land Rovers, and BMWs on the road than I've seen in the US or European cities. They import all the good stuff. Their problem is not finding ways to spend their money, it is trying to stay alive keeping it.

That is my point that Russians has to import all of their "good stuff" There is far more demand than supply for goods such as automobiles. If they had a robust manufacturing sector in the past such as the US, do you think they would be importing so much or would they be building their own? I am in the car business and every day I am in contact with 4 to 5 Russian importers and they will pay me $10000 to $15000 over MSRP for certain new model vehicles that have a MSRP of about $60000. They simply have more money then they known what to do with because they have a difficult time disposing of it. They cannot import fast enough to satisfy their demand. That is what I do not want for this country. Maybe this clears up my meaning of my post.

 

[Dave S]

Re: "one of the most challenging times ever seen in the history of the marine industr

Some pot stirrer named Dave S. He should be blackballed from CRS!

Geeeeshhhhh! :smt089:smt089

:smt043:smt043

 

[Fishnut]

Re: "one of the most challenging times ever seen in the history of the marine industr

Searay maybe lowering there prices.... but the whores at marine max are slow to respond. Yes whore is a bad word .... but when it comes to marine max it fits....

Searay put most of there eggs in marine maxs basket ...Now they pay the price. The tail is wagging the dog....

Rob

Yes indeed.

 

[jhild]

Re: "one of the most challenging times ever seen in the history of the marine industr

While we can debate the causes of today's economic climate forever, the point I tried to make when I posted this to begin with is now is the time to buy a boat if you can. The time will never be better.

I've been doing some boat shopping for the last couple months, and to be honest, I just haven't seen too many great deals. Maybe it's too early in the season here in the Northeast. Maybe the economy around here is doing better than in other regions. Maybe I’m not looking at the right boats. Who knows? But here’s what I’ve seen: Many dealers are offering Leftover Clearance specials, which are 15%-20% off the listed retail price. 20% off MSRP on last year’s model? That’s no fantastic deal. Sure it’s great to “save” $5K on a $40K boat, but it’ll still cost you $35K to get that boat on the water. Since the dealers are selling fewer boats, it seems they’re trying to increase the margins on the boats they do move.

Now take used boats. Keep in mind that many new boat buyers who financed their boat for 15 years because, “It’s only $300 a month!” are now upside down on their loan. (Gotta love that depreciation hit.) People are now doing 1 of 4 things. (1) Keeping their current boat – What the hell. It’ll be all paid for in only 132 short months! (2) Trying to sell it for what they still owe regardless of the market - Good luck with that. (3) Trying to negotiate a “great deal” on a new boat given a lowball trade-in offer and 20% off MSRP from the dealer. No bargains here, either. (4) Waiting to see what happens.

I hope prices eventually drop. When they do, I’ll be ready.