Gifford's shooting

[lacook]

So late last night, early this morning I broke down and watched some of the coverage. Until the interview of the parents of the little girl. I watched that father break down, and I had to turn it off. Yes Public Execution, maybe even stoning, I am sure I could throw the first stone! I only could wish he would make it to other inmates that would kill him for us, but he is so high profile he will be guarded and in solitary confinement.
I have never been for banning guns, guns dont kill people, people do. I just think that when the Right To Bear Arms was written, times were simpler. People were of good morals, and had faith and values and respect. There was still enough Quaker and Purtain Religion in their backgrounds. Is Gun Control the solution. I do not know any more. I just know that this lunatic didnt steal a gun he bought it, and even legally. Going back to a very old saying: An Ounce of Prevention is Worth a Pound of Cure. What is the Prevention? I dont have the answer.

 

[comsnark]

<<dribble snipped>>

A nut case is a nut case.

To make more of this than "nut case shoots people who didn't deserve it" is a symptomatic of other issues we have as a society.

 

[comsnark]

An Ounce of Prevention is Worth a Pound of Cure. What is the Prevention? I dont have the answer.

If only 0.01% of the population are whackos, and 99.99% are ok. . .if you have a population of 300 million, that means you have 30,000 whackos running around.

 

[Redhook98]

Love the way this is has become about Right vs Left. (sarcasm) What it is is plain and simple. He was a nutjob. Politics have NO place in this and I am sick of seeing the blame being put on Palin. Remember when Pelosi also had "targets" for whom she targeted to get their votes for Obamacare? It's a silly argument that is being blown out of proportion.

Lets keep our heads people. It is not because of Beck, Maddow, Palin, O'Reilly, Matthews, Schultz or Limbaugh that this happened. It is NOT political. It is because of one unstable nut that wanted to make a "statement".

 

[keokie]

Comments that radio talk shows promote this kind of violence very evidently come from people who did not listen to talk radio, but believe they know what it says.

I have listened to talk radio of all kinds for 20 years. I never hear anything that would promote this.

And as far as "our rhetoric" leading to this.... HIS rhetoric is what has been crazy and outrageous.

 

[wish2fish]

If someone there had a CCW permit there would likely have been less carnage!

 

[Redhook98]

Comments that radio talk shows promote this kind of violence very evidently come from people who did not listen to talk radio, but believe they know what it says.

I have listened to talk radio of all kinds for 20 years. I never hear anything that would promote this.

And as far as "our rhetoric" leading to this.... HIS rhetoric is what has been crazy and outrageous.

Exactly! +1 :thumbsup:

 

[lacook]

I dont see where laming blame is going to fix a freaking thing. Right left here there what does it really matter? It doesnt. This exetremly unstable man bought a gun legally and used it. Injuries, death, murder, mayham, carnage, this young person slipped through the system that cracks. You cant tell me someone some where didnt know he was a threat to mankind. Profiling goes on all the time. This very unstable person should never been allowed to have a gun. Yes he could of stole one, or bought one illegally. That isnt the case though is it, he bought it legally. Of course we can say WHAT IF, till Pigs Fly and the Cows Come Home, it isnt going to change a thing. We all have to agree some kind of change needs to be made. These types of shootings and killings are way to common.

 

[JediJD]

A nut case is a nut case.

To make more of this than "nut case shoots people who didn't deserve it" is a symptomatic of other issues we have as a society.

Well put.

 

[floriduramax1]

A nut case is a nut case.

To make more of this than "nut case shoots people who didn't deserve it" is a symptomatic of other issues we have as a society.

Wow! It froze somewhere as I totally agree with you!

 

[Searaybio270]

We can’t say we weren’t warned about shooting

We cannot walk away from this one.
We cannot blame one nutjob for the shooting of 19 people Saturday in Tucson, Ariz., and wash our hands of it.
We cannot pretend that this is only about him and not about us.
Worst of all, we cannot say we were not warned.
For more than two years, sensible people have been pleading with their fellow Americans to tone down the rhetoric, to quit with the demonizing, to end the fear-mongering.
In what kind of country, the sensible people asked, do political leaders across the board not condemn a sign at a rally that reads: “We left our guns at home — this time”?
In what kind of country do people show up at presidential speeches with guns on their hips?
In what kind of a country do callers to radio shows routinely smear those with whom they disagree — beginning with our president — as “traitors” and “un-American,” while pandering hosts say only, “Thanks for the call.”
If we continue this way, the sensible people warned, something will happen.
And now something has happened.
U.S. Rep. Gabrielle Giffords, an Arizona Democrat, was meeting with constituents outside a supermarket Saturday — a “Congress on Your Corner” event — when a young man walked up, aimed a gun at her head and started shooting.
As we wrote this, Giffords was fighting for her life in a Tucson hospital. Six people were dead. Twelve others were wounded.
What drove the killer, who police say might have had an accomplice? Was it the reckless rhetoric of our times? As of yet, we don’t know. Maybe, though improbably, politics had nothing to do with this.
Only in time will we know if the killer was among those who threatened Giffords with physical harm last year when she voted in favor of President Obama’s health-care reforms. We may never know whether he was the one who shattered the windows of her Tucson office. And it’s entirely possible that he was not among those — the many — who threatened her with death after she spoke out against Arizona’s harsh new immigration law.
But would any intelligent person be surprised to learn otherwise?
The safe observation for us to make now — you will hear it from others all week — is that the angry and irresponsible talk that might lead an unhinged person to pick up a gun is common across the political landscape, from right to left.
But that simply is not true.
Overwhelmingly today, the fear-mongering and demonizing flow from the right, aided and abetted by cable TV and talk-radio hosts. They may represent only the irresponsible fringe of conservatism in America, but they are drowning out the thoughtful voices of the vast majority of conservatives.
Giffords, as she showed by meeting constituents outside that supermarket, dared to believe that Americans can disagree with each other without turning on each other.
Maybe that was a mistake.
http://www.suntimes.com/3220146-417/giffords-cannot-tucson-ariz-saturday.html

Yes, its a "cut & paste" but it says exactly what I am thinking. Maybe we all can learn a lesson from this tragedy.

This is also a cut & paste from my daughter's facebook page: I am disgusted with the tragic deaths in AZ. F***ING crazies thinking their religion, God or anything else gives them a right to kill people. TURN OFF FOX news, Beck, etc and educate YOURSELF about politics and that our differences make us great. Question yourself, your values and don't push them on anyone else!

It is a fact that our differences make this a great country. Lets stop hating each other and start condemning those who continue to fan the flames of division in this country.

The below is from an article I found on line. There were several but it is to say that what you posted from the left can be found on the right. Instead of posting what is right and wrong - you took the stance of a liberal instead of saying we (Americans) have had it.

Rather, many on the American Left said the horror could be traced to the malign influence of American conservatives; members of the Tea Party; right-wing pundits Rush Limbaugh and Glenn Beck; former Alaska Governor Sarah Palin; and Fox News.
That was the narrative of culpability spun in the immediate aftermath of the shootings by some leading liberal commentators and Democratic politicians -- despite warnings from religious leaders, lawyers, academics, ethicists, reporters and historians that such a rush to judgment only further deepens the partisan divide in America, and further poisons its discourse.
Within minutes after the attempted assassination of Giffords -- indeed, at a point when it was still erroneously believed in many quarters that she was dead, and the identity of her shooter was not publicly known -- some commentators, absent any credible evidence, were already busily laying blame for the atrocity in political terms. Nobel Prize-winning economist and New York Times columnist Paul Krugman blogged at 3:22 p.m. ET Saturday: "We don't have proof yet that this was political, but the odds are that it was."
Pima County Sheriff Clarence Dupnik, a Democrat, also found a political element in Saturday's bloodshed. Dupnik argued that the "vitriol" of the country's harshly polarized political climate was partly to blame, arguing that unbalanced individuals are uniquely "susceptible" to vitriol. Dupnik added, in an interview with Fox News' Megyn Kelly: "We see one party trying to block the attempts of another party to make this a better country."


Asked by Kelly if he had any evidence Loughner was in any way influenced by political "vitriol," Dupnik offered none. "That's my opinion, period," he said.

I could go on with others but won't. You are some what right. It is both sides of the media and those that control the media.
However, it didn't start there. It started in the Congress, the Senate and the White House. Not an atmosphere of hope and change but one of a culture of people who have forgotten that everything they say and do and fail to say and do is seen by everyone. Couple that we high unemployment, housing market failure, budget so out of whack at all levels it is no wonder Americans are fighting mad.
Leadership, true leadership doesn't allow those things to happen. Look at your own household. If parents are civil to one another, show respect and talk about getting through the tough times - children (the public) will see that as well. But let Auntie Pain in the butt (the Media) spin a different tune to those kids - well they lose hope, trust and reality of good and evil.

 

[wish2fish]

Yep, Olberman doesn't spew hatred! :huh:

 

[VTSeaRay]

A nut case is a nut case.

To make more of this than "nut case shoots people who didn't deserve it" is a symptomatic of other issues we have as a society.

Well said, this is all it is, pure and simple. Even his whacked out classmates (citing the guy with purple hair) found him scary and strange, and commented on how he scared his classmates with his outbursts and tack during class.

packer, take it to the holding tank, your kid has learned well from you.

 

[AKBASSKING]

Take him to Tombstone and find a tall oak tree!:smt038

 

[skibum]

You know, I completely avoided this thread because there really isn't anything I could say about some nut job going off.

We cannot walk away from this one.
We cannot blame one nutjob for the shooting of 19 people Saturday in Tucson, Ariz., and wash our hands of it.
We cannot pretend that this is only about him and not about us. We cannot pretend that this is only about him and not about us.

But Pack... I disagree completely with the entire quote above. I have no choice but to walk away from this. It was a single "nutjob" acting out. It was completely, totally, absolutely, 100% about him, and only him. I have nothing at all in common with this person with the exception that I also have a "distrust" for government. I'm %99.999999 sure that I will never display my distrust for government in the same manner as he did. So it really is about him, and not about me, or "us".

Worst of all, we cannot say we were not warned.
For more than two years, sensible people have been pleading with their fellow Americans to tone down the rhetoric, to quit with the demonizing, to end the fear-mongering.

The author and people like him need to get their heads out of their collective asses and realize that until they learn to BEGIN a discussion without assuming that everyone with a different point of view is not "sensible", they are doomed to never reach agreement with anyone.

 

[JimG]

If someone there had a CCW permit there would likely have been less carnage!

and was packing...
:smt038

 

[comsnark]

Note: I have said that we are dealing with a nut job. I believe that.

HOWEVER. .. the "violence rhetoric" to which Pack is speaking is a notable societal problem completely outside of the current incident, and merits discussion in the appropriate slightly darker and more smelly place.

I will buy some beer and meet y'all there in a few hours.

No. . I won't be wearing the Tutu tonight. Unless Gary shows up.

 

[VTSeaRay]

and that our differences make us great. /quote]

Value differences.... ALL DIFFERENCES... not just yours...

You need to clarify that point to your kid. You still have some instruction left to do with that one.

 

[skibum]

Note: I have said that we are dealing with a nut job. I believe that.

HOWEVER. .. the "violence rhetoric" to which Pack is speaking is a notable societal problem completely outside of the current incident, and merits discussion in the appropriate slightly darker and more smelly place.

I will buy some beer and meet y'all there in a few hours.

No. . I won't be wearing the Tutu tonight. Unless Gary shows up.

We agree? Do you feel ok? I feel ok. Just checking.

Don't feel like hanging in the smelly place tonight. Want to talk about boats instead? Or Football?

I'll bring some cigars and a platter of oysters.

If you wear the tutu, I'm bringing my neighbor's obnoxious, smelly nephew Freddie and telling him that you kicked his dog.

 

[LTD.330]

There was a guy there who was a CCW holder on scene with his firearm. Joseph Zamudio was next door in Walgreens buying cigarettes when the shooting started. He dropped what he was doing and ran toward the sound of gunfire. If I ever meet the guy, the beer is on me.

Here is an interview he did with Fox News. I love his mindset.

It’s telling that the Fox News chick was horrified that he had a gun.

http://www.foxnewsinsider.com/2011/...oughner-had-a-gun-and-he-was-ready-to-use-it/


Here is an interview Joe did with Geraldo:

[youtube]nUmmOWL05r8[/youtube]