Baltimore

[Mike HHH]

My son-in-law is a BPD detective who spent most of the last two days standing in riot gear letting "peaceful protestors" throw bottles, bricks, barricades and other items usually part of free speech, at him -- as the useless mayor legitimizes the actions of these fools. But don't worry, the handful of taxpayers left in Maryland will get to pay to rebuild what was destroyed and recharge the EBT cards. If you do want to cheer one person's actions. Look up the video of the mom in the yellow sweatshirt who saw her son on TV and promptly went out, found him, and smacked the snot out of him in front of cameras and dozens of cops.
I had a client call today to say that he wanted to view a boat docked in Canton, I had to remind him that traveling through any part of Baltimore probably wasn't a good idea for the indefinite future.

 

[Do Over]

Have you seen the footage of these gang mentality thugs trashing their own city? And you call the police Morons? Takes one to know one I guess...

Hope you seriously need one some day and they are busy at the time.

I have my reasons for agreeing with the "morons" statement......I won't be posting them on an internet forum....have a great day.

 

[Craigalan]

My wife wants to run for office. Her platform? A magical place called Cannibal Island. The mayor? Charles Darwin. Things will take care of itself. I'd vote for that!! Bold solutions 2016.

 

[dpmulvey]

I'm gonna grab another cold one, curl up in my recliner and wait for the real fun to start.

Woody just cracked the door a bit. Now let the fun begin.

Orville Redenbacher's gonna make a ton on this one!!! :smt043

 

[dpmulvey]

The police need to start responding to deadly threats with deadly force. Some dead thugs will bring the rioting to halt quickly, I bet.

Worked for Rudy in NYC!

 

[Searaybio270]

I live just north of Baltimore in Harford county. I can tell you from watching the TV it makes me sick what is going on. We now have an Alert in Bel Air as the school kids are posting what they are going to do when they get out of school.
The role of the police like service people is to protect all people. What happened to Gray is bad. But did he cause it? Maybe had he not done something wrong first time and the second and then got caught we wouldn't be here today. Kind of like Mike Brown - don't steal, push someone around and the rest never happens that day.
the Mayor was wrong on the curfew and holding the police back from doing anything. Can't wait to see what tonight brings. Probably more rioting, more news and who knows maybe Big Al the Kiddies Pal, Sharpton.

 

[Ray Ray]

Dr. Martin Luther King Jr. Synopsis on Riots

"I'm absolutely convinced that a riot merely intensifies the fears of the white community while relieving the guilt.... And I feel that we must always work with an effective, powerful weapon and method that brings about tangible results. But it is not enough for me to stand before you tonight and condemn riots. It would be morally irresponsible for me to do that without, at the same time, condemning the contingent, intolerable conditions that exist in our society. These conditions are the things that cause individuals to feel that they have no other alternative than to engage in violent rebellions to get attention. And I must say tonight that a riot is the language of the unheard. And what is it America has failed to hear? ...It has failed to hear that the promises of freedom and justice have not been met. And it has failed to hear that large segments of...society are more concerned about tranquility and the status quo than about justice and humanity...."

-Dr. Martin Luther King Jr.


Although I come to this site to discuss and learn about boats, Sea Ray boats in particular, I'm often captivated by these sidebar conversations that drift so far to the left and so far to the right it truly boggles my mind. What's going on in Baltimore is completely senseless, but it didn't start with a riot!

I offer Dr. King's quote above for consideration by all. I do this in an attempt to prod folks to merely consider the provocation and reason of a person's behavior, not simply the act, but the true impetus which causes a person to act, while performing deeds both good and bad. There is ALWAYS a reason people choose to act....you and I may not agree with those reasons, but the actors do not really need our agreement, approval or justification for their actions.

There will justifiably be consequences for the senseless destruction of public and private property, and the equally senseless causation of physical pain and suffering, and there should be. But let's not lose focus on the primary reason so many people chose to act or behave in such a destructive manner in the first place......let's first consider the condition of the people whose actions in response to their personal daily plight, many others are so quick to condemn.

That being said, can we talk about boats again?

 

[Steve500dancer]

I will bet that 9 out of 10 of the "protestors" don't even know the dead guys name. They are not protesting. They are "OPPORTUNISTS" looking for an oportunity to steal and destroy the community. If you really believe that they give a ****....you are very sadly mistaken. You don't protest anything until you know the facts....you don't place blame until you know the facts... you don't burn down buildings and assault police officers unless you are a thug animal on welfare that doesn't have to be at work the next day. It is what it is....we need to stop worrying about calling it what it is because of idiots like Jessie Jackson or the crooked Rev Al Sharpton. This country lacks the balls to call a spade a spade...no different then letting Muslims destroy their country and ours because of Religious Freedom. What a pathetic crock of ****.

 

[dpmulvey]

Dr. Martin Luther King Jr. Synopsis on Riots

"I'm absolutely convinced that a riot merely intensifies the fears of the white community while relieving the guilt.... And I feel that we must always work with an effective, powerful weapon and method that brings about tangible results. But it is not enough for me to stand before you tonight and condemn riots. It would be morally irresponsible for me to do that without, at the same time, condemning the contingent, intolerable conditions that exist in our society. These conditions are the things that cause individuals to feel that they have no other alternative than to engage in violent rebellions to get attention. And I must say tonight that a riot is the language of the unheard. And what is it America has failed to hear? ...It has failed to hear that the promises of freedom and justice have not been met. And it has failed to hear that large segments of...society are more concerned about tranquility and the status quo than about justice and humanity...."

-Dr. Martin Luther King Jr.


Although I come to this site to discuss and learn about boats, Sea Ray boats in particular, I'm often captivated by these sidebar conversations that drift so far to the left and so far to the right it truly boggles my mind. What's going on in Baltimore is completely senseless, but it didn't start with a riot!

I offer Dr. King's quote above for consideration by all. I do this in an attempt to prod folks to merely consider the provocation and reason of a person's behavior, not simply the act, but the true impetus which causes a person to act, while performing deeds both good and bad. There is ALWAYS a reason people choose to act....you and I may not agree with those reasons, but the actors do not really need our agreement, approval or justification for their actions.

There will justifiably be consequences for the senseless destruction of public and private property, and the equally senseless causation of physical pain and suffering, and there should be. But let's not lose focus on the primary reason so many people chose to act or behave in such a destructive manner in the first place......let's first consider the condition of the people whose actions in response to their personal daily plight, many others are so quick to condemn.

That being said, can we talk about boats again?

Looks at bait.

Sniffs bait.

Nudges bait with nose.

Swims away.

 

[Ray Ray]

I will bet that 9 out of 10 of the "protestors" don't even know the dead guys name. They are not protesting. They are "OPPORTUNISTS" looking for an oportunity to steal and destroy the community. If you really believe that they give a ****....you are very sadly mistaken. You don't protest anything until you know the facts....you don't place blame until you know the facts... you don't burn down buildings and assault police officers unless you are a thug animal on welfare that doesn't have to be at work the next day. It is what it is....we need to stop worrying about calling it what it is because of idiots like Jessie Jackson or the crooked Rev Al Sharpton. This country lacks the balls to call a spade a spade...no different then letting Muslims destroy their country and ours because of Religious Freedom. What a pathetic crock of ****.

By "the dead guy" I'm sure it's safe to assume you mean Mr. Freddie Gray. While I agree that those creating havoc in the city could be categorized as opportunists, they cannot and should not be considered in the same thought as peaceful protestors. They're two separate groups.

Further, some of what you state is just untrue (you may personally believe it, but that doesn't make it true). People protest all over the world without having all the facts, they go with what they think they know....blame is placed without any actual and full knowledge of facts, and if everyone who assaults a police officer is to be considered "a thug animal on welfare that doesn't have to be at work the next day", then there are many, many folks in this country outside of Baltimore, MD that deserve your outrage.

"If your concerns about violence are limited to property damage and looting, and you have... never shed two tears for the history of institutional violence, murder, colonialism, segregation, lynching, genocide and police brutality against peoples of color, your words mean nothing; they mean less than nothing. Your outrage, in such a case is grotesque, an inversion of morality so putrescent as to call into question your capacity for real feeling at all. So long as violence from below is condemned while violence from above is ignored, you can bet that the former will continue--and however unfortunate that may be, it is surely predictable. If you'd like the former to cease, put an end to the latter, and then I promise you, it will." --Tim Wise.

...I'm just calling a spade a spade.

 

[Woody]

I should clarify my ‘morons with a badge’ comment. I wasn’t calling the entire law enforcement population morons….just the ones that are. We see the results of their actions often enough and it shouldn’t be ignored.

Remember the 80/20 rule? Unfortunately the 20 in law enforcement makes the 80 look bad. Millions and millions are paid out across this county in settlement of justified cases brought against the law enforcement community. Sometimes we don’t like to talk about things…but where there’s smoke there’s fire.

So how about Freddy? Did he really add anything to society or his community?….I doubt it, he was a drug pusher. Will any one miss him?…Some family and friends I suppose. Freddy was not a very important individual in the whole scope of things, while he was living anyway, maybe that‘ll change with his early demise. What is important is that he’s dead after an interaction with LE when he shouldn’t be.

 

[Ray Ray]

I live just north of Baltimore in Harford county. I can tell you from watching the TV it makes me sick what is going on. We now have an Alert in Bel Air as the school kids are posting what they are going to do when they get out of school.
The role of the police like service people is to protect all people. What happened to Gray is bad. But did he cause it? Maybe had he not done something wrong first time and the second and then got caught we wouldn't be here today. Kind of like Mike Brown - don't steal, push someone around and the rest never happens that day.
the Mayor was wrong on the curfew and holding the police back from doing anything. Can't wait to see what tonight brings. Probably more rioting, more news and who knows maybe Big Al the Kiddies Pal, Sharpton.

I can mostly agree with your sentiment. However, what happened to Freddie Gray was more than just bad. It should not have happened. Likewise, the Mike Brown incident and Ferguson, also should not have happened, not the way it did resulting in that kid's death and similar destruction of a community. These particular two incidents, and the many more like them that happen every day, are the result of bad policing, and the response to that by those who have been subject to bad policing on a disproportionate scale. Everyone who does something wrong, and/or has an interaction with the police, doesn't and shouldn't end up dead, plain and simple. Why is it that so many young, black males do? And that's definitely not supposed to happen to anyone already in police custody, under such questionable circumstances.

None of this is new, it's just news to some who choose to believe, for whatever reason, that it doesn't happen on the scale it actually does. To the contrary, some would rather believe that whole segments of society are "just that way" and are somehow deserving of bad policing. No one deserves that, nor do they deserve to be over-policed under presumed guilt on a daily basis. Being over-policed while doing absolutely nothing worthy of constant police contact tends to create feelings of mistrust and unecessary apprehension with a community.

Until you've lived that reality, you'll never understand the response of a people who are simply tired of seeing, hearing of, and feeling that type of pain......sooner or later you see a reaction to that, and here we are.

I'm not excusing even one act of senseless violence or destruction, but I can surely understand where some of the emotions that cause them comes from. Deal with the root cause properly, and we stop the nonsense.

 

[dpmulvey]

I will bet that 9 out of 10 of the "protestors" don't even know the dead guys name. They are not protesting. They are "OPPORTUNISTS" looking for an oportunity to steal and destroy the community. If you really believe that they give a ****....you are very sadly mistaken. You don't protest anything until you know the facts....you don't place blame until you know the facts... you don't burn down buildings and assault police officers unless you are a thug animal on welfare that doesn't have to be at work the next day. It is what it is....we need to stop worrying about calling it what it is because of idiots like Jessie Jackson or the crooked Rev Al Sharpton. This country lacks the balls to call a spade a spade...no different then letting Muslims destroy their country and ours because of Religious Freedom. What a pathetic crock of ****.

By "the dead guy" I'm sure it's safe to assume you mean Mr. Freddie Gray. While I agree that those creating havoc in the city could be categorized as opportunists, they cannot and should not be considered in the same thought as peaceful protestors. They're two separate groups.

Further, some of what you state is just untrue (you may personally believe it, but that doesn't make it true). People protest all over the world without having all the facts, they go with what they think they know....blame is placed without any actual and full knowledge of facts, and if everyone who assaults a police officer is to be considered "a thug animal on welfare that doesn't have to be at work the next day", then there are many, many folks in this country outside of Baltimore, MD that deserve your outrage.

"If your concerns about violence are limited to property damage and looting, and you have... never shed two tears for the history of institutional violence, murder, colonialism, segregation, lynching, genocide and police brutality against peoples of color, your words mean nothing; they mean less than nothing. Your outrage, in such a case is grotesque, an inversion of morality so putrescent as to call into question your capacity for real feeling at all. So long as violence from below is condemned while violence from above is ignored, you can bet that the former will continue--and however unfortunate that may be, it is surely predictable. If you'd like the former to cease, put an end to the latter, and then I promise you, it will." --Tim Wise.

...I'm just calling a spade a spade.

You are one sharp individual Ray Ray.

First you quote Tim Wise who makes a sh!t pile of money living as the nation's white antiwhite.... Then you pull a 180 and go immediately to a line I haven't heard since Archie Bunker went off the air.

Touche sir. Well played.

Will the real Tim Wise please stand up!

 

[islandhopper00]

Ray Ray, when "they" are burning down your back yard, I'd like to hear your take on it again. I wager you'd call the......police?

 

[Ray Ray]

dpmulvey: I've never heard of Time Wise before today, and don't really know anything of the guy. I tend to give people the benefit of the doubt until they prove themselves unworthy. In this case, I happen to understand and agree with the sentiment in his quote.

islandhopperOO: I actually grew up in neighborhoods at a time and space when Baltimore-ish issues were a daily event....South Bronx, NY, and didn't have to look far for these events in my backyard. I've seen and experienced first hand what bad policing can result in, and conversely have seen the opposite--good, effective policing, and its results in the exact same neighborhoods. When things are handled properly, issues are better resolved, and people have their day in court and are held accountable. That's the way it should work. You have to be alive to have that day in court, however.

But to answer your question of whether or not I'd call the police, sure, if necessary. But I'd expect them to uphold the law when they get there, and maintain a certain level of professionalism when they get there.....not shoot/kill everyone on site, especially the "suspicious looking" ones who don't look like "they" belong in the neighborhood. Depending on who shows up, that could be me.

Ever had that concern or thought go through your mind? Hopefully not, but please understand that many people do, all day, every day.

 

[islandhopper00]

Ray Ray, actually everytime I deal with the police, the thought goes through my mind. You see I'm a 6'2" 260lb asian man (sometimes with attitude). I've had my share of white cops beating on me.....for no good reason. BUT, no matter how right I think I may be, if the police is going to arrest me, I lay down put my hands behind my back, AND DON'T RESIST. Yes, I've been arrested a couple of times. I also realize the police need to look after their own well being, and don't know me from adam.
My message here is, if you don't act like an idiot, you'll have your day in court. My opinion of course, albeit from experience.

 

[2000SR380]

I have two good friends and an ex-brother-in-law in Law Enforcement. One of my Uncles worked as a CHP officer before he became a judge. I am sure that there are culture's where bad officers are rampant, and I am well aware that police force's nation wide are constructed of human beings with all the attached baggage. In the suburbs, we are taught to show Law Enforcement Officers respect, and do what they say. They have no idea if we are speeding because we like to go fast, or because we just robbed liquor store, and pushed the owner around, or shot the cashier. I am white and was brought up in a middle class neighborhood. I still have encountered my share of idiots with a badge. Spent sometime in "County", and have felony arrest record. But I sorted it out in court (Not boxing guys with guns)and have made it to 56 years old. Once we had a huge squirt gun war at the local High School, 20+ kids with toy guns, at night, dressed in black, or camouflage. The Police were called, responded with 4-Cars. Nobody got shot (with Lead). Try that I Oakland today!! Back in 1979 City Police had "reasonable expectation" they could handle whatever was going on and still have diner with their wife and make their son's Little League game on the weekend. That reasonable expectation is a gone distant memory.
The Police do need to take ownership of prejudice and incompetence in heir ranks. There is plenty of room for improvement. But, the flip side to that coin is parents, and criminals, need to take ownership of what they did to get the police attention in the first place, and work to correct and acknowledge that behavior. The vast majority of these "Police Brutality" cases are criminals, engaged in criminal activity, that do not do what the officers tell them to do when they are caught.

 

[CV-23]

Good citizens with legal guns good have prevented this! Oh that's right......no guns for good people in MD. It's pretty sad that every Democratic run city is a haven for the users and losers of society. It's a shame good people just get grouped in with them because the neighborhood they can afford to live in. Burning down the local CVS you need is pretty dam stupid but it's the stupid people doing it that don't live there! Feel bad for the honest people who just want justice for the whole community.....not the thugs.....they need the jackboot on the back of their necks!

 

[OldSkool]

So this one is split down the usual party lines. No progress on either side to move to middle. Woodyman did clarify his morons comment but the damage was already done. Scott countered first with other in support after him. RR comes in and WTF was that all about? We even got MLKjr, Charles Darwin, the popcorn king, Rudy, Big Al, and a host of others.

No need for my comment everyone knows my disdain for street thugs and support of the police when warranted.

Glad to be back after a few months away.

BTW pulled all the teak off OldSkool over the weekend and getting ready to refinish it. Got a 17" deep sea fish filet knife on the table for guy in LA. I'll post pictures it's complete.

 

[sibnai1]

The quote from MLK was very insightful, however, I hope we were not to take the message literally, simply because we do not live in 1960s America. I refuse to feel guilty for being competitive and trying hard and sometimes succeeding in 21st century America. When MLK made those remarks they absolutely were applicable to the times. Those remarks absolutely do not apply today. NO ONE knows all of the facts in this case.

Should Fred Gray have died? No! If the police were responsible for his death they should be held to account. We are after all, a country of laws.

Should Fred Gray have died? No! If the police were NOT responsible for his death they should be exonerated. We are after all, a country of laws.

Burning down a business that someone worked hard to build is criminal, destroying the neighborhood where you live is criminal and stupid, allowing individuals to manipulate your emotions while helping them destroy your neighborhood is criminal and stupid.

We are a country of laws everyone including the citizenry and the police have rights under the law. We have a process, the citizenry and the police are entitled to "due process", this process however does not endorse property damage or stealing property.

We are a civilized society with "due process" as hard as it is to remain civil at times it is what civil societies and civil peoples strive for. It does not matter how egregious your quarrel is, we are all entitled to due process, even the police!

Did Fred Gray get his due process? No he did not, he died before he could get his "due process"!!

That however, still does not give anyone in a civil society the right or a free pass to hijack our "due process" and damage property and steal and harm others.

We are after all, a society of laws!