Please HELP - Need to see, touch, feel a 450 Dancer WILL MAKE CASH DONATION

[Maybe A Dancer]

Hello Forum,

Well, I've been doing my research and have narrowed down my choices to a 1995 - 2005 450 or 460 Sundancer, galley to port.

Many on CSR have been very helpful, including Frank Webster, who has been a wealth of information.

The problem is I have yet to actually see or set foot on one, and am quite willing to travel to do so.

For some unknown reason, all the boats currently under consideration are well north of the Mason-Dixon line, and here I sit between Tampa & Ft. Myers in Punta Gorda, FL

I am hopeful that a knowledgeable member here on the Forum would accept my generous donation to cover their valuable time, fuel and operating expenses for a couple hour sharing of information.

I'd even help wash her down upon return.

Perhaps someone knows someone who would be interested?

BEST!

RWS

 

[bbwhitejr]

So sorry you are “late to the party.” Frank sold “your” boat a few months back and it was in PCB, FL…..

Bennett

 

[Maybe A Dancer]

Bennett, you are so right about this.

I am Frank's equivalent on the Trojan International series and I also provide an informational Trojan International website.

I am in the process of posting some info and photos this week. Take a look and you'll know where I am coming from:

www.trojanboat.com

click on the photographs link

BEST !

RWS

 

[techmitch]

This one is very close to the mason Dixon line. You may want to PM @SeaNile to see if he is interested.
http://www.clubsearay.com/index.php...-for-sale-fresh-water-its-entire-life.105434/

 

[Maybe A Dancer]

We have been talking/emailing back and forth.

His vessel is one of my favorites.

It shows well and has gotten tremendous upgrades this past year.

He will likely have her sold before I pull the trigger, however she is listed at $140,000 and I will have to handle a couple of things right off the bat to make her turn key for me, plus close to $10,000 in shipping.

Seanile has been very forthright and helpful, and who knows, we may yet make something happen together.

Unfortunately I really don't want to be upside down on day one and I am not one to make an insulting offer.

I think that boat will sell well before my post hurricane season November purchase date.

BEST!

RWS

 

[370Dancer]

Bennett, you are so right about this.

I am Frank's equivalent on the Trojan International series and I also provide an informational Trojan International website.

I am in the process of posting some info and photos this week. Take a look and you'll know where I am coming from:

www.trojanboat.com

click on the photographs link

BEST !

RWS

Rich Mastery do your engines?

 

[Blueone]

Unfortunately I really don't want to be upside down on day one and I am not one to make an insulting offer.
RWS

I think you just did insult the price. In another thread you said you want a “Bristol” 1996 -2000 450. You either want a perfect boat or you’re a nascar fan?… you are in a tough position in this boat market…. Upside down suggests you are in the past market with most indicators now.

 

[Maybe A Dancer]

Yes, the Yanmars came from Mastry, Brent Masgig was the factory rep and they were professionally installed by Bill Nelson at York Road Marine on Pine Island, FL

RWS

 

[Maybe A Dancer]

I've never been to any NASCAR event, but back in 2002 I did see some cool stuff when I had business with the City's Utilities department and got to see firsthand what could REALLY BE SEEN with the new joystick operated security cameras mounted all around Daytona International Speedway.

That aside here's my math:

let's take a boat, not any specific boat at .............................................140,000

let's replace the swim platform from swimplatforms.com, crated & shipped $6,119
let's replace the cockpit softgoods at say, what about.............................. $7,500
Now add in shipping at close to............................................................. 10,000
.......................................................................................Subtotal $163,619
i have no costs for surveys, haulouts, etc in there as they don't belong.
Now for the kicker, Boat lives behind my home. I have a fixed bridge with a center support. There is an S turn on both sides, creating a blind spot. At times of hill tides, water crosses the approach to this bridge from seaward, creating a strong sideways cross current. It's not unusual to find an unwary or unskilled boater hit the center span (has wood covering it) or to be pushed into the other lane.

Add in a wind to this and it can be like bumper cars with these inexperienced boaters.

The blindness of the turn is the other problem, as you cannot see if someone is in or encroaching on your lane until you are into it. I have on a few occasions had to abort my approach, as the turn / blind spot revealed a boat where it should not be. Not a problem with my 13' beam diesels as I can back out of most anything. With the 50' long 450, the bow will be farther forward from the helm, aggravating the blind spot issue. More of the boat will be ahead of me before I can see past the blind spot For this reason I will add a bow thruster to help me get the hell out of the way during these situations.

Otherwise, all things being equal, I would not need the thruster. So now I add a thruster into the equation (currently waiting for a price from Floridabowthrusters.com) but let's just take a stab at $15,000 installed.
Now I'm up to $163,619 + $15,000 = $178,619

It's not the boats fault, nor the sellers fault that I have the bridge issue or shipping costs, but there is 25,000 additional required for me to be happy and safe.

If this boat were closer, or less $$$ perhaps a deal could be made. I am well aware of the price range but much like my own boat, the reality for 25 year old boats is what it is.

The good news is that there is very little depreciation cost involved

BEST !

RWS

 

[Blueone]

I've never been to any NASCAR event, but back in 2002 I did see some cool stuff when I had business with the City's Utilities department and got to see firsthand what could RELLY BE SEEN with the new joystick operated security cameras mounted all around Daytona International Speedway.

That aside here's my math:

let's take a boat, not any specific boat at .............................................140,000

let's replace the swim platform from swimplatforms.com, crated & shipped $6,119
let's replace the cockpit softgoods at say, what about.............................. $7,500
Now add in shipping at close to............................................................. 10,000
.......................................................................................Subtotal $163,619
i have no costs for surveys, haulouts, etc in there as they don't belong.
Now for the kicker, Boat lives behind my home. I have a fixed bridge with a center support. There is an S turn on both sides, creating a blind spot. At times of hill tides, water crosses the approach to this bridge from seaward, creating a strong sideways cross current. It's not unusual to find an unwary or unskilled boater hit the center span (has wood covering it) or to be pushed into the other lane.

Add in a wind to this and it can be like bumper cars with these inexperienced boaters.

The blindness of the turn is the other problem, as you cannot see if someone is in or encroaching on your lane until you are into it. I have on a few occasions had to abort my approach, as the turn / blind spot revealed a boat where it should not be. Not a problem with my 13' beam diesels as I can back out of most anything. With the 50' long 450, the bow will be farther forward from the helm, aggravating the blind spot issue. More of the boat will be ahead of me before I can see past the blind spot For this reason I will add a bow thruster to help me get the hell out of the way during these situations.

Otherwise, all things being equal, I would not need the thruster. So now I add a thruster into the equation (currently waiting for a price from Floridabowthrusters.com) but let's just take a stab at $15,000 installed.
Now I'm up to $163,619 + $15,000 = $178,619

It's not the boats fault, nor the sellers fault that I have the bridge issue or shipping costs, but there is 25,000 additional required for me to be happy and safe.

If this boat were closer, or less $$$ perhaps a deal could be made. I am well aware of the price range but much like my own boat, the reality for 25 year old boats is what it is.

The good news is that there is very little depreciation cost involved

BEST !

RWS

Welcome to boating….. none of it makes financial sense. Your problem is how much of your money are you prepared to throw away
Size and age matters maybe look at something smaller and newer.

Or …. This is my neighbors boat… just hit market last week. He bought a 550.
Fresh water ….. would be a nice ride to home
https://www.boattrader.com/boat/2002-sea-ray-460-sundancer-7997471/

Damn….. there you go …..sold in less then 6 days. He was asking $189k and it’s a bit tired

 

[Maybe A Dancer]

wow, THANK YOU for the link.

This is a nice boat.

The problem for me is the hardtop version of the 460 is the radar will not always clear the fixed bridge to my home.

I have looked through the Sea Ray archives and have been unable to determine for certain if a non-hardtop 460 will have adequate clearance to the arch.

BEST !

RWS

 

[370Dancer]

Yes, the Yanmars came from Mastry, Brent Masgig was the factory rep and they were professionally installed by Bill Nelson at York Road Marine on Pine Island, FL

RWS

Small world. Rich used to come fishing with us down in Rum Cay. Another member here repowered his 370 Dancer with Yanmars, and then drove it on it's keel from Ft. Lauderdale to Trinidad! He picked his days, and said really it was only 100 miles max between islands. Drove it back up to USVI, where it probably still resides. I've lost touch with him.

 

[Maybe A Dancer]

small world indeed!

these Yannies have been proven to be very reliable. The only failure I have seen in 15 years was one hose(my bad) and one engine starting solenoid, whereby I replaced BOTH with the old fashioned Ford fenderwell mounted style.

SIMPLE IS BETTER !

Best!

RWS

 

[Stee6043]

NADA shows an "average" 1996 450DA being worth $127k right now.

I assume you're going to be waiting a long time for that unicorn of a bristol 450 to pop on the market at below average retail. But it does happen from time to time I imagine...

 

[Maybe A Dancer]

THAT unicorn would have been Franks boat at the asking price of $137

I would truly have enjoyed running it from Destin to Punta Gorda.

It did not need a swim platform replaced or cockpit upholstery.

A simple $14,500 for FloridaBowThrusters and I would have been good to go.

Guess I'm just a year too late.

Plus, If I owned THAT boat I could almost be a minor celebrity.....

I am fortunate to have a dock behind the house that is long enough to accommodate both the 450DA in the water AND my 10 Meter on the lift as I don't know how long she will be on the market. The top of the lift mechanicals will then have to be upgraded to accommodate the 450.

RWS

 

[NotHerDecision]

What is your bridge height? The 460 will probably fit. I am happy to take you for a spin on the 460 if you want to come to Texas

 

[Stee6043]

THAT unicorn would have been Franks boat at the asking price of $137

I would truly have enjoyed running it from Destin to Punta Gorda.

It did not need a swim platform replaced or cockpit upholstery.

A simple $14,500 for FloridaBowThrusters and I would have been good to go.

Guess I'm just a year too late.

Plus, If I owned THAT boat I could almost be a minor celebrity.....

I am fortunate to have a dock behind the house that is long enough to accommodate both the 450DA in the water AND my 10 Meter on the lift as I don't know how long she will be on the market. The top of the lift mechanicals will then have to be upgraded to accommodate the 450.

RWS

You're convinced you need a thruster without having driven one first? Seems like a lot of cabbage to include in the pre-purchase budget without first giving it a try without?

And why the swim platform? With a davit like an H30 you can get just about any dinghy on that 450 platform. It's part of the beauty of the upper/lower platform setup. You can still traverse the platform even if you fully consume the lower portion.

Or budget an extra $2k and add an H30 extension if you really want that extra room....

 

[Maybe A Dancer]

The existing swim platforms on 2 of the boats under consideration have water intrusion: water + balsa = balsa mush

It's a no brainer to remove the waterlogged one set it in the dumpster and swap it out with one from swimplatforms.com in Phoenix, AZ, crated & shipped = $6,119

I agree 100% with everything that has been said about thrusters not being needed.

100%

My current 10 meter diesel has a 13' beam and her widely spaced shafts and diesel torque on the 4 blade VEEM wheels make docking a breeze, especially when one uses a bit of inertia. I always laugh when I'm asked at the fuel dock if the boat has thrusters.

The bridge issue is the only reason I need the bow thruster.

copied from above:
Boat lives behind my home. I have a fixed bridge with a center support. There is an S turn on both sides, creating a blind spot. At times of hill tides, water crosses the approach to this bridge from seaward, creating a strong sideways cross current. It's not unusual to find an unwary or unskilled boater hit the center span (has wood covering it) or to be pushed into the other lane.

Add in a wind to this and it can be like bumper cars with these inexperienced boaters.

The blindness of the turn is the other problem, as you cannot see if someone is in or encroaching on your lane until you are into it. I have on a few occasions had to abort my approach, as the turn / blind spot revealed a boat where it should not be. Not a problem with my 13' beam diesels as I can back out of most anything. With the 50' long 450, the bow will be farther forward from the helm, aggravating the blind spot issue. More of the boat will be ahead of me before I can see past the blind spot For this reason I will add a bow thruster to help me get the hell out of the way during these situations.

simply put, I can't avoid what I can't see. With all that extra boat ahead of the helm its different than with my 33' 10 meter.

I REALLY DO APPRECIATE ALL THIS INPUT HERE - TRULY.

BEST!

RWS

 

[Maybe A Dancer]

Appears the hardtop option with radar and a pedestal mount takes that option off the table, however the 460 WITHOUT the hardtop may work, however I've been all through the Sea Ray archives and cannot find anything on the height of the radar arch version without the hardtop.

the bridge clearance is 14'

I'd like a pucker factor of 6" so 13'6" is safe for me.

The 450 DA EASILY handles the bridge issue.

BEST !

RWS

 

[The Bill Collector]

Well, if you make it out to the upper left coast we can go out on Puget Sound... Bow thruster (Side Power 10hp), galley to starboard, Birdseye maple, custom davit system, custom SS fender holders cut into the forward bow rails, custom ss arch on top of the factory arch, washer/dryer combo, sound enclosure on the gen. and the list goes on. The first ride is free...