To pull or not to pull??

[Lugnutz]

I’m working on a 1985 300 Sedan Bridge with twin GM 350’s. I previous posted a thread about a heat issue on the starboard engine about two weeks ago or so. I replaced the risers and had the heat exchanger cleaned out and the heat problem is gone. I have spent the last two days working on both engines and they now run sweet. I bump the ignition keys first thing in the morning and the engines start right up. Life is good!!

I have moved onto other things on the to-do check list and other issues I have discovered and was hoping for a lil advice, opinions or ideas from the do-it-yourselfers crowd on here.

When we originally sea trialed the boat I noticed a significant amount of water was coming in through the stuffing box. I didn’t figure it would be a big deal to repack it. I tried to get down between the engines today to dig out the old packing and I have come to the conclusion that I am just not skinny enough to get down in there to use both hands without standing on my head and somebody holding my feet. If I remove the inboard exhaust manifolds on both engines I should have enough room to get down in there to work on it.

However, in the process of all this I discovered that the transmission output shaft seal is also leaking transmission fluid pretty good and both engine and generator seacock’s are seized in the open position. They look like the Spartan brand valves and I have found info on rebuilding them but I have to figure out how to get them out first and like the stuffing boxes, the space is limited.

So, here’s my dilemma, regardless of which way I go, it’s a significant amount of work. Do I remove the inboard exhaust manifolds or just pull the engines and be happy with the elbow room to work on things?

If you had to travel down the same road what direction would you go? :huh:

On a side note, the boat is sitting on a trailer. I don’t have an overhead gantry crane, but could probably make something to hoist the engines out or find somebody with a sky hook.

 

[dpmulvey]

I'd pull them both and go through the entire ER. Then you know all the problems seen and unseen are fixed to your satisfaction.

 

[Thornton69]

Good to hear you got them running good. I would have to agree with making elbow room if you have the time and access to a hook. Will give you a whole lot better view of everything else as well (hoses, oil pans ect.) Having someone holding your ankle sucks and may discourage you from addressing things that really should be addressed. You may want to do a quick compression test on them as well before hand to get an idea of cylinder condition before you pull them. Could save yourself the hassle of doing it twice.

 

[dpmulvey]

Missed the year first time. Fuel lines and hoses of that era are NOT ethanol resistant. Neither are carbs. As a matter of fact, no rubber product is.

 

[julietbravomike]

+1 for pulling them. I'm guessing you have Borg Warner V-Drives. If so, the output shaft seal is an easy change. I'd vote for using GFO packing. It doesn't take long to get them ready to pull. Be sure to check the engine alignment whatever route you take.

 

[dpmulvey]

How much do you want to put into her. We're great at spending OPM!!!

 

[Lugnutz]

I want it reliable is the key. I hate doing repairs twice and fighting with rusted corroded metal in confined spaces is not my idea of fun.

I know you guys like pictures so I have added a few if I did it right. The water bottle is a reference for space between things. It is pretty oily in the bildge and cleaning it is on the to-do list. The prior owner used RTV on the starboard engine valve covers instead of “real” gaskets. Grounding straps in the wrong location and missing hose clamps are already on the list too.

Picture links didn't work. I will try posting them again later as I am out of time.

 

[PMC]

How much do you want to put into her. We're great at spending OPM!!!

I'm reading this with the same thoughts. With the engines out, you might as well do a re-build.:lol:

I'm a proponent of DIY, but with limited access have you priced out the job to a mechanic?

 

[sdleo26]

Same here, if you pull motors, there is no end; it would be a crime not to do everything short of putting new motors in. I would give anything to have my motors out for a day, except go through the headache of pulling them I suppose... lol .That said I wouldn't pull motors to re-pack stuffing boxes; find a smaller friend or person to get down there, or pull manifolds. The frozen pick ups is another story; I would get those exercising ASAP.

 

[Woody]

You're going to find other stuff where room makes things a b!tch. I vote pull the engines and go through the engine room, you'll be set for years after that.

 

[Air O'Nautical]

If were talking DIY, you'll really get to know your ER and engines if you pull the engines.
Not to underestimate, it's a BIG job but very doable.
You will undoubtedly spend some good money on other things you'll notice while there out.

I wouldn't hesitate to yank mine (no jokes please) now if needed because, I've done it and know the process while re-powering my boat.

 

[Sundancer]

While it's easy to suggest pulling the engines and if you have time, sure go for it. The other side of the coin is it might be worth it to pay for the packing job. You can always get down in their with a mirror a small camera and a light and check everything else out. I know it's exciting to finally have it running and on the water, but you don't want to end up regretting getting on the water too early either. You've done enough with the boat now to understand it's condition and evaluate how you will feel out on the water if something happens. I'd love to do that on mine, but I don't have the facilities or time. I also don't see a need yet, although the dirty bilge is killing me! I've got my own tools for that, but it's hard to keep it clean and stay on top of it.

As for the fuel lines, I haven't touched mine and they are the original hoses from 1989. I trailer my boat, so it's getting exposed to more ethanol at auto fuel pumps than a moored boat. Ethanol appear in the late 70's and most manufacturers knew it was coming and were prepared for it. Check them, but mine are still in good shape. I was worried about it. The worst thing is every 4 or 5 years I lose a cap when the steel chain holding it on corrodes and breaks when I set them down gently. I need to start giving them a pull test each season I guess. I lost one at Roch Harbor last year and one at Priest Lake 7 or 8 years ago. I blame THAT on ethanol!

We're coming over in July! We'll be invading the Juan's with 5 or 6 boats from Eastern, WA! Watch out! Maybe we'll see you out there somewhere?

 

[Lugnutz]

I have a few receipts from the previous owner’s adventures with marine repair shops and the Port engine was replaced in 2010. He also mentioned that the engine just locked up while they were underway one day, when we were doing the sea trial. It looks like repair shops did most of the work on the boat, but I have a feeling that he is the one who used RTV on the valve covers instead of gaskets.

Both engines run really good and I have no interest in tearing them apart if/when I pull the engines out. I will do a compression test for a base line but I have no fear of finding anything wrong. Other than that I would probably clean, scuff and repaint them just to deal with a couple of rust spots and to make um look purdy again.

Same here, if you pull motors, there is no end; it would be a crime not to do everything short of putting new motors in. I would give anything to have my motors out for a day, except go through the headache of pulling them I suppose... lol .That said I wouldn't pull motors to re-pack stuffing boxes; find a smaller friend or person to get down there, or pull manifolds. The frozen pick ups is another story; I would get those exercising ASAP.

Repacking the stuffing boxes is not the reason for questioning to pull the engines. The main issues are the output shaft seal on the transmission and getting the seacock’s to function. There is very limited room to get to them and I was thinking it might be a ton easier to fix everything with the engines out and I had room to work. And I agree, the pick-ups are priority before it goes back into the water.

I'm reading this with the same thoughts. With the engines out, you might as well do a re-build.

I'm a proponent of DIY, but with limited access have you priced out the job to a mechanic?

I am already fixing some of the goofy stuff that was done at repair shops so having somebody else do the work for me doesn't sound too appealing.

Pictures didn't work again. Will try again tomorrow.

 

[Lugnutz]

Here ya go. The good the bad and the ugly.

 

[dpmulvey]

The question is this.....are you going to want to use the boat in 2015?

 

[KC_Sundancer]

Seeing the pictures I personally would pull them. The time spent pulling them will save that much if not more trying to work around them with what you want to do.
Makes properly replacing the seacocks and working on the transmissions so much easier.
Like others have said you can get other items addressed and clean the engines and engine room up nicely with them out. :thumbsup:

For ideas here's a few snapshots of how I pulled ours shortly after the purchase:

Built a frame out of 14 foot 4x4's and sistered 2x8's for the beam, chain falled them out,
pulled the boat forward on the trailer, lowered and hauled the engines to the garage with the ORV.
Different boat but same ideas would work.
A weekend project to have the frame built and engines out.

 

[Lugnutz]

Thanks for the info KC, looks like we are gonna pull them.
A couple of friends have told me they will jump in to help and the girlfriend told me that she is in charge of cleaning the bilge. Not gonna argue with her on that one.

 

[chrishick]

the girlfriend told me that she is in charge of cleaning the bilge. Not gonna argue with her on that one.

You need to put a ring on that finger. She's a keeper!!

 

[KC_Sundancer]

Thanks for the info KC, looks like we are gonna pull them.
A couple of friends have told me they will jump in to help and the girlfriend told me that she is in charge of cleaning the bilge. Not gonna argue with her on that one.

Glad you rounded up help and I'll second chrishick's "keeper" statement.
Good luck and please share some more pictures as you go eh!

 

[1956olds]

Get a power washer for her,and a gallon of bilgecote.May be an ideal time to get dripless shaft seals also.Check the blocks that are sandwiched between the seacocks and the hull they may need to be replaced before installing new seacocks or they will leak again sooner rather than later.