Texas Deep Freeze = Cracked...something on 2016 Mercury 4.5L Alpha

[Espos4]

Gotta love the “ignore” feature on this site!

 

[JimG]

Why did it go into limp home mode? Is there water in your oil? If so, it will look like tapioca and the bearings will soon be gone. You've fixed the blown frost plug and that has substantially limited the water flow. Your bilge pump may be able to handle it as your raw water cooling is not pressurized. You could install a 2nd pump to handle any excess and as a back-up. Not perfect, but you don't have to tell you guests that your boat leaks. This is not going to get any worse. One of the catalyzed liquid steel products could reduce or divert an external leak from the electricals. Meanwhile, you could list it in Craigslist and Boat Trader for $5,000 off, say $25,000; default on your loan and let the bank deal with it; park it in a bad neighborhood; or, donate it. Call the local marinas and offer it at your bargain price; they have parts at cost, surplus labor and could flip it. You could hire a mechanic by the hour on the condition that you would do the repairs together and you would be the helper. A friend without calluses built his own house with this arrangement and got a good result.

Now there's some real sound advice! NOT!

 

[techmitch]

Why did it go into limp home mode? Is there water in your oil? If so, it will look like tapioca and the bearings will soon be gone. You've fixed the blown frost plug and that has substantially limited the water flow. Your bilge pump may be able to handle it as your raw water cooling is not pressurized. You could install a 2nd pump to handle any excess and as a back-up. Not perfect, but you don't have to tell you guests that your boat leaks. This is not going to get any worse. One of the catalyzed liquid steel products could reduce or divert an external leak from the electricals. Meanwhile, you could list it in Craigslist and Boat Trader for $5,000 off, say $25,000; default on your loan and let the bank deal with it; park it in a bad neighborhood; or, donate it. Call the local marinas and offer it at your bargain price; they have parts at cost, surplus labor and could flip it. You could hire a mechanic by the hour on the condition that you would do the repairs together and you would be the helper. A friend without calluses built his own house with this arrangement and got a good result.

 

[Arminius]

If the oil is good, JB Weld should hold it till a primo used 5.7 comes along. I put a permanent pressure gauge on the reblt Alpha 1, Gen 2 drive water pump and only see 8 psi at 3000 rpm. Shocked, I inspected the impeller I'd just put in. The engine's auto style "pump" only circulates the lake water. This is newish, uncontaminated cast iron and brazing, inert gas welding, or chemicals would have a good chance of sticking if you have access. On a high end ski boat forum, the debate was over the discount on sale for a cracked block boat. I'm just suggesting that the options be explored before jumping into a project that may not work out. http://www.clubsearay.com/index.php?threads/seawater-pump-pressure-gauge.97281/#post-1128900

Then this guy on YouTube fixed internal leaks with block sealer. He rigged a temporary heat exchanger out of a truck radiator in order to circulate and heat the block sealer on a raw water engine. The oil was clean when he finished although we don't know how long his repair lasted. Course, our marine engine only sees 10 psi as opposed to the pressure at which an auto radiator cap vents.

Checking dates in his "Comments", it seems to have held up after 2 years. Technologies I am not familiar with include metal-stitching and TIG welding in Jay Leno's garage.

 

[Arminius]

Dewinterization. Turned the blue handle and put the plugs back in. Runs sweet with the muffs on. Block does not leak.

 

[scoflaw]

You did see post #97 right?

 

[techmitch]

If the oil is good, JB Weld should hold it till a primo used 5.7 comes along. I put a permanent pressure gauge on the reblt Alpha 1, Gen 2 drive water pump and only see 8 psi at 3000 rpm. Shocked, I inspected the impeller I'd just put in. The engine's auto style "pump" only circulates the lake water. This is newish, uncontaminated cast iron and brazing, inert gas welding, or chemicals would have a good chance of sticking if you have access. On a high end ski boat forum, the debate was over the discount on sale for a cracked block boat. I'm just suggesting that the options be explored before jumping into a project that may not work out. http://www.clubsearay.com/index.php?threads/seawater-pump-pressure-gauge.97281/#post-1128900

Then this guy on YouTube fixed internal leaks with block sealer. He rigged a temporary heat exchanger out of a truck radiator in order to circulate and heat the block sealer on a raw water engine. The oil was clean when he finished although we don't know how long his repair lasted. Course, our marine engine only sees 10 psi as opposed to the pressure at which an auto radiator cap vents.

Checking dates in his "Comments", it seems to have held up after 2 years. Technologies I am not familiar with include metal-stitching and TIG welding in Jay Leno's garage.

 

[Arminius]

You did see post #97 right?

MerCruiser invented a one point drain system where all the consumer has to do is turn the blue handle in the Fall and turn it back in the Spring. This guy didn't turn the blue handle!

 

[Arminius]

Camco criticized, Ricardo Marine:
Customer Review

RicardoMarine
1.0 out of 5 stars Un-favorable... very un-favorable!
Reviewed in the United States on October 30, 2012

This is a repeat of my 2012 review. Please read the entire review.
NO...... I cannot support the use of this product given how most users interpret it's intended use for the raw water cooled Marine Engine!
The kit description does indeed use the word "Winterizer"! We associate "winterize" with freeze protection. Furthermore, we will find/see web hosted videos showing these products being used in a misnomer fashion that may put the owner's raw water cooled engine at risk of freeze damage. (please read on)

In my opinion, the manufacturer (of these or similar products) would be wise to provide full disclosure and details that fully explain (a.) the Raw Water cooled I/O and I/B engine T-stat housing, (b.) the sea water "by-pass" porting, (c.) and explain to the user that most all sea water (raw water cooled engine) is being directed towards and out the exhaust system. (sea water = antifreeze when the kits are being used)
As it is, the user may inadvertantly believe that when he/she sees kit supplied antifreeze exit the exhaust, that his/her engine will be filled with "un-diluted" antifreeze, and that their engine will be protected against freeze damage.
This is not true!

Let me explain:

With any Raw Water Cooled Marine I/B or I/O engine, only a portion of the supplied sea water is required for actual engine cooling demands, compared to that which a sea water pump is capable of supplying (for both engine and exhaust demands).

The "porting" within the T-stat housing allows for a proportunate division of sea water.
.... The engine circulating pump charges the engine block with the amount of coolant (sea water) required via T-stat's open position. In other words, the T-stat holds back coolant on an "As Needed" or "On Demand" basis.
.... The greater balance of coolant (sea water) is being sent to and out the exhaust system.

In simple terms; this means that more sea water (antifreeze when the kit is being used) is actually sent to and out the exhaust system, compared to what actually enters the engine block/heads. (until we reach engine loads that require greater cooling demands).
This is pretty much the case with any Raw Water Cooled I/O or I/B marine engine.

The warming up of the engine in order for the thermostat to open prior, is also a misnomer, and in particular when these kits are introducing the antifreeze during low RPM and no engine loads.

Now we connect up the Camco Kit antifreeze container:

Again...... keep in mind that during this rather short operation/duration, only a portion of the limited 4-5 gallons of Camco Kit antifreeze actually makes it's way into the engine cooling system. The greater portion of the Camco Kit antifreeze is going right on out the exhaust system (just as the sea water does)!

The user must understand that when he or she sees antifreeze exit the exhaust, this is NOT an indicator that un-diluted antifreeze made it's way into and out of the engine block and cylinder heads. Any antifreeze that has made it's way into the engine block has likely become diluted from the residual seawater!
If the user is not educated regarding this........, then he or she may be left with a "False-Positive", so to speak!

As said... by the time he or she finishes up, any Camco Kit antifreeze that DID make it into the engine, may have now become diluted by the residual engine block sea water.
However, if we begin with a completely drained engine block, the liklihood of antifreeze dilution is greatly reduced.

These kits are intrinsically an OK idea if in the hands of a professional Marine Mechanic. The Marine Mechanic will likely drain everything afterwards anyway.
However, in the wrong hands, and when the user is lacking the understanding of the above info, it can leave them with freeze damage come spring time.

For those who insist on using these kits, probe your drain ports and drain completely afterwards, and you should be OK.

OEM service manuals will typically suggest that we completely drain the engine components of all sea water during the winterizing procedure.

The need for the rust inhibiting properties of antifreeze (during the lay up) are greatly exaggerated, IMO. The amount of rust/corrosion that could occur during the lay up are paled by comparison to that which occurs during the normal season's usage.
If you're after that "feel good" feeling, then do it, but drain again afterwards.
Otherwise, winterize according to your OEM manual.

Remember.... just plain air will not freeze, expand, and crack our expensive cast iron components.
117 people found this helpful

 

[douglee25]

It's a totally valid point. I never trusted in the 'warm up technique'. I always drained the block and hoses, removed the thermostat, then pumped the antifreeze through.

More recently I just drain the block and hoses and don't remove the thermostat or add antifreeze. In and out quickly and no risk of freezing.

 

[Pirate Lady]

It's a totally valid point. I never trusted in the 'warm up technique'. I always drained the block and hoses, removed the thermostat, then pumped the antifreeze through.

More recently I just drain the block and hoses and don't remove the thermostat or add antifreeze. In and out quickly and no risk of freezing.

Yes to both these methods (when I was younger) now I pay the man $150. I just called BOATUS/GEICO about winter insurance. $25 rider IF done by a certified mechanic. Getting it just in case.

 

[Arminius]

Women are so practical! Occam's razor in the flesh.

 

[GypsmJim]

I always drained the block and hoses, removed the thermostat, then pumped the antifreeze through.

I did it that way for 20 years, and of course never had a problem. Mine was an older Mercruiser and it only had 3 brass plugs, thus it was a pita, unlike the newer models with many blue plugs.

Then, I discovered the "kit" and changed my method. My preference was to leave AF in the block, just for corrosion protection, right or wrong, necessary or not.

Anyway, I always added 1 extra step....I drained a few ounces from the block's stopcock (NOT a pita) and tested the contents.

I did it that way for 15 years and never did freeze anything. Of course my test data indicated I was good to well below zero.

I guess my procedure worked...

On another note, "paying the man" was never a consideration. The ONLY friend of mine that ever had a cracked block was after he had the dealer do the work. I don't trust anyone, and rightfully so....

 

[Pirate Lady]

I did it that way for 20 years, and of course never had a problem. Mine was an older Mercruiser and it only had 3 brass plugs, thus it was a pita, unlike the newer models with many blue plugs.

Then, I discovered the "kit" and changed my method. My preference was to leave AF in the block, just for corrosion protection, right or wrong, necessary or not.

Anyway, I always added 1 extra step....I drained a few ounces from the block's stopcock (NOT a pita) and tested the contents.

I did it that way for 15 years and never did freeze anything. Of course my test data indicated I was good to well below zero.

I guess my procedure worked...

On another note, "paying the man" was never a consideration. The ONLY friend of mine that ever had a cracked block was after he had the dealer do the work. I don't trust anyone, and rightfully so....

No choice, cancer and radiation makes any self maintenance difficult. Used to do it all, fortunately I can afford to pay the man. I love my mechanic, old grizzled guy, mean as a junk yard dog, fair prices and knows more about boats than anyone. I trust him.

 

[GypsmJim]

No choice, cancer and radiation makes any self maintenance difficult. Used to do it all, fortunately I can afford to pay the man. I love my mechanic, old grizzled guy, mean as a junk yard dog, fair prices and knows more about boats than anyone. I trust him.

Good for you. I used to have a guy like that as well. Unfortunately, I outlived him and the new generation of mechanics aren't nearly as good. I won't say "not competent". A better term is "not as caring" or "not as experienced".

 

[Pirate Lady]

Good for you. I used to have a guy like that as well. Unfortunately, I outlived him and the new generation of mechanics aren't nearly as good. I won't say "not competent". A better term is "not as caring" or "not as experienced".

This guy is a legend on our river and his prices are insane old school. $150 winterize engine and drive, $350 labor to replace manifolds and risers, etc. $80 install new hot water tank, not worth to do myself.

 

[Chip S]

Good for you. I used to have a guy like that as well. Unfortunately, I outlived him and the new generation of mechanics aren't nearly as good. I won't say "not competent". A better term is "not as caring" or "not as experienced".

My boat mechanic is young (late 20s) but was taught well and learned a lot. Everything he's done for me so far has been top notch. There are good, young mechanics out there, but like everything else you need to look a while to find them.

I've been going to the same car mechanic for 25 years. Once you find a good one, you stick with them. I'm just hoping I retire before he does.

 

[Arminius]

Last year's tale of woe brought to the fore. Record cold here in Seattle last night and snow in the mountains!

 

[douglee25]

I was originally communicating with the OP on fixing his boat in my shop. He stopped responding to text messages and PM's on the site. It says he hasn't been since here since April? Odd.

 

[Arminius]

I'd want to forget and move on too. Probably left the boat with its freeze cracked block in a high crime neighborhood and made a theft claim against his insurer.

The lesson of this thread is that you can't winterize your boat by sucking up anti-freeze through the muffs because 90% is routed through the exhausts and out the back of the boat. You gotta drain the block and the manifolds and then you don't need anti-freeze.