So what is wrong with this for sale diesel 400DA?

douglee25 said:
I don't think Dave was suggesting going solely on a prior survey to base his purchase. I believe he was just asking to obtain the information to determine whether or not something was significantly wrong with the boat to warrant his own personal survey (please correct me if I'm wrong Dave). If the dealer contacted the owner and the owner agreed to share prior information about why the transaction fell through, it's not a breach of contract. I don't think anyone suggested breaching contracts or pissing off brokers or surveyors. Hell, you could ask to see the manuals/information on the boat and you'd probably run across an old registration card. Last time I checked, using the phone book to find someone's phone number wasn't unethical.
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douglee25 said:
Doug
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You are absolutely correct Doug. There is nothing unethical about asking a question of the results of the previous survey to the broker or the surveyor. If they refuse to discuss the subject, that’s fine. Move on. Nor do I consider it unethical to ask a broker to contact the former prospective buyer and have the former prospective buyer contact the new prospective buyer to discuss if the former prospective buyer would be interested in selling their survey. I have had it happen to me and did not find it in the least bit unethical or unprofessional. The broker approached me and asked if the new prospective buyer could call me to discuss the boat and possibly purchase the survey. The boat needed some engine work that I do not have the mechanical expertise to do. The new prospective buyer did. I paid for the survey and in doing so, the survey was my property to do with as I saw fit. To me it was a way for me to cut some losses.

Any clause in a contract between 2 parties can be waived if the agreed upon by both parties unless the clause is a statutory requirement and to remove it would violate the law. I know states laws differ. Real estate law in VA for example requires any defect made known during an inspection be fully disclosed by the seller to any prospective buyer without the buyer having to ask. I think it is called full disclosure and a real estate agent will lose their license by failing to do so. I do not know if that law extends to boating sales or not.

My experience with brokers has been a mixed bag at best. The good were very, very good. The bad just plain sucked and unfortunately in my case, the bad seemed to outnumber the good about 3 to 2. As in any business, the bad tastes remain long after the good ones fade.

When times were good and I was in the buy mode, my Rolex was not gold enough, a 40 footer wasn’t worth their time and your current boat is your problem. When times were not so good and I was in the buy mode the broker kept steering me to one and only one boat. I finally ended up telling this kid, either show me the whole range of what you have for sale in this size or show me your boss. Your call. The reasonably prudent buyer has to ask what is going on her and why am I, the CUSTOMER, being treated like this? What is so right or so wrong about this boat that a salesman will not show me anything else?

On the flip side, I have had brokers who had former prospective buyers on file and no problems calling them and asking if I could talk to them and went out of their way to see that I was comfortable in their world as I was the one who was looking to buy.

I know who I am and am not going to approach when I decide to purchase my next boat.
 
On this 1999 400DA, the broker gave me the contact info for the hull surveyor too. I emailed him asking if we could purchase a copy of his hull survey. He emailed me back a couple of days later, apologized for the delay, said he spoke with his prospective buyer and yes it was OK to buy a copy of the survey. He wanted 1/2 the costs of the original survey.
 
ImpulseIII said:
I have a copy of the survey for Impulse III that I will sell you for $25.00. Now that's a deep deal !!
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Nice discount from what you paid for the survey! Would you consider selling Impulse III for the same discount?

Best regards,
Frank
 
E-mail me with an offer.:grin:.....I also have some waterfront properity in Oklahoma I can let you have for next to nothing! :thumbsup:I am such a sport!!:smt101
 
From what we are seeing, the problem with selling a boat right now is, unless you are serious and need to sell, it's not going to happen. Why? Because there are sellers out there who are desperate, dropping their price like crazy. So if you are a casual seller, forget about it, keep your boat, try again at a future date.

Frank, to give you and idea of what I mean, we have talked to more than one broker with a diesel 410. Asking is usually around $200K-$219K. Serious sellers are letting them go for $160K or less. Per the surveyors we are talking to, boats under $500K simply are not selling right now.

Plus with the price of diesel now exceeding gas the "I want a diesel for economy" buyers are rethinking their decision to go diesel.
 
Ahhhh ..... the beauty of not having to sell. Diesel may be more expensive but when you consider that my old 340 ,cruising at 24 knots burned about 32-34 GPH (I think) and my 410 at the same speed burns 21-22GPH and then consider the things like second head, 2 staterooms, more live aboard capabilities, better "crappy" weather handling, and more cockpit space for Gary to spill beer etc, I'm a happy camper.
I can wait for a market turn around.
 
The nice 410's are still bringing money north of $185K, as far as more expensive boats go, our dealer has sold 2 48DA's, a 52DA, 2 47DB's and a 55DA in the last 60 days, so what is selling and what is not is probably market or location specific.

There also seems to be a lot of interest in small to mid sized diesel boats.....370DA's 380DA's 400DA's 400DB's 410's and 450's..... if they have Caterpillar or smaller Cummins engines. The buyers are owners of mid sized gas boats who want to move up and reduce fuel consumption. People in our area are not waiting on the election, fuel to get cheaper, the economy, etc. They are using their boats regularly and when a nice diesel comes on the market, they don't stay available long.
 
There is a 97 here priced at $187K...broker owned, took on a trade, states he will take a lot less.
 
Broker owned will, they made there money on the trade. Most selling that boat will take less. But one must get into negotiating first. And that starts with looking at a boat. You cant buy a boat over the phone without seeing it.
 
We looked at this one, liked it, helm too short for me. Nice boat otherwise. They took it in on a trade for a new Sedan Bridge Silverton and you are correct, per the dealer the only way they could do it was with help from Silverton on the sale.
 
fwebster said:
The nice 410's are still bringing money north of $185K, as far as more expensive boats go, our dealer has sold 2 48DA's, a 52DA, 2 47DB's and a 55DA in the last 60 days, so what is selling and what is not is probably market or location specific.

There also seems to be a lot of interest in small to mid sized diesel boats.....370DA's 380DA's 400DA's 400DB's 410's and 450's..... if they have Caterpillar or smaller Cummins engines. The buyers are owners of mid sized gas boats who want to move up and reduce fuel consumption. People in our area are not waiting on the election, fuel to get cheaper, the economy, etc. They are using their boats regularly and when a nice diesel comes on the market, they don't stay available long.
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I'd have to get a really nice 410 or 460 damned cheap to make up for the beating i would take selling the 330 in this market. There's nothing wrong with Just Ducky and I've never had a moments problems with her, but she's a gasser, so I'd like to trade. But there's nothing wrong with her, so it's hard to justify taking a beating on selling her unless I can get an equally excellent boat cheaply.

Hey! Maybe one of those "gas engines are great" guys wants to make a sensible offer on a pristine 330DA?

Best regards,
Frank C
 
fc3 said:
I'd have to get a really nice 410 or 460 damned cheap to make up for the beating i would take selling the 330 in this market. There's nothing wrong with Just Ducky and I've never had a moments problems with her, but she's a gasser, so I'd like to trade. But there's nothing wrong with her, so it's hard to justify taking a beating on selling her unless I can get an equally excellent boat cheaply.

Hey! Maybe one of those "gas engines are great" guys wants to make a sensible offer on a pristine 330DA?

Best regards,
Frank C
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+1, which is where we are. The more we look at and use ours the more we like what we have for the $$$.

Another way of stating my point is this. If you really want to sell a boat right now you will need to move A LOT on your price. For example, the 450 I mentioned earlier originally started at $219K...no calls. The dealer dropped it to $209K...no calls. He again dropped it to $199K, no calls...he then dropped it to $187K and I called. I watched him gradually drop his price and I finally called. Same for the 1999 400DA. Started at $219K...dropped to $159K so I called. Turns out the 400 seller is very motivated and needs to get out of the boat.

If you are one of those types who wants to move to another boat (usually bigger) and you are not willing to take a beating on the sale of yours, it's not going to happen right now.
 
Greg,

Here is another data point for you.......a 2003 410DA with 3126 Cats, an aft enclosure, with only 187 hours in like new condition just sold for $249K in NW Fla. The boat was on the market 6 weeks.

Confirms my opinion that the nicer boats sell soon for decent money and what Mr. Maier said yesterday, properly priced Sea Rays sell in a reasonable period of time.
 
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