Official 280 Sundancer Thread

What kind of things go bad due to sitting, I can look at the bellows - but can't really see any seals - I'll look for signs of leaking seals.
 
There's not much to check on a 2004 280 prior to purchase than you wouldn't for any other similar boat from other manufacturers. The 280 is a solid boat in terms of design and manufacture - it has had one of the longest life cycles within the Sea Ray line-up at over 9 years.

I would pay most attention to the engines and outdrives for sure as they are most likely to be where you spend some money on this boat, esp if it wasn't maintained properly.

Below is a partial list. Other 280 owners please add/comment.


Engine/Mechanical/Engine room
---------
Significant rusting under/near manifolds/elbows/risers - are they original? (They are near the point of having to be replaced if original.)
Original IAC valve? (common problem)
Original Impellers? (hope not)
Extra Mercathode added?
Maintenance records, esp for outdrive servicing and winterization?
RPMs vs time (ECM logges amount of time engine ran at various RPMs) satisfactory?
Cylinder Compression OK?
Vacuflush pulling proper vacuum?
Condition of spark plugs? Motor Oil? Outdrive oil?
Water pump putting out proper pressure?
Trim pumps and tab systems operating properly?


Cockpit
----------
Condition of seats/leather
Light fixtures not rusting/oxidized? (common problem)
Window frame not rusting (common problem)
Canvas condition? Isinglass condition?
Original Carpet?
Any oxidation/rust around engine controls? Have controls been lub'd?
Moisture in the smartcraft guages?
Speedometer working (common problem)
Does the trim gauge work accurately? (common problem)

Cabin
--------
Leaks under fridge
Leaks in the shower drain
Sup pump compartment
A/C working? Properly holding freon?
Radio and sirius SL1 working? (Common problem)
Windows not leaking? (Common problem)
 
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VolNavy37922 said:
What kind of things go bad due to sitting, I can look at the bellows - but can't really see any seals - I'll look for signs of leaking seals.
Click to expand...

The first thing that comes to my mind would be various engine seals. This could be easily checked by looking for cloudiness in the oil and looking for leaks in the bilge. If the oil is brand new you may want to run for a couple hours and check again for some kind of cloudiness. A surveyor should check this and compression, etc. to determine any problems.

Engines in general don't respond well to sitting to long periods of time- more so when maintenance is not performed. Imangine driving a 2004 model car 500 miles a year..... Many of the maintenance windows on these engines/outdrives is at 100hr/or yearly intervals. Alot also has to do with how it was used. Was it bought in 2004, used 80 hours, then 4 hours a year the other 6 years? Was it used many times during the 6 years in short stints? This is where maintenance records will help you see patterns of usage. Unfortunately many shops do not note hours when doing service for some reason.

I think you are wise to be cautious but don't be scared away. I am sure there are many well cared for boats that don't get used as much as some of us do. This may be a great find. Just remember-survey, survey, survey. Not just the hull but the engines/outdrives too. These guys know what to look for and can help warn you of a potential problem or help ease your mind. As I said before once you see the boat you probably won't have much trouble determining if it was taken care if. If you are dealing with the owner I would find a casual way to ask how they used the boat if hours are not available on service records.
 
I think you have gotten a lot of good advice based on what people think will be issues. Here is what we learned when we bought our boat with 123 hours on it after 4 years of being in service.

In our case, the boat had sat out two seasons due to the owner being on one end of the country on a job assignment, and boat on another. The year before we bought the boat it had been moved up to New England and the PO had used it for one season.

Other than the batteries needing replacement there was nothing that had to be immediately done. I did a raw water pump impeller, sparkplugs, and annual zincs at the start of the season along with oil and gear lube changes.

However, by the end of the first season (another 120 hours)
1) the trim senders failed
2) bellows were due
3) serpentine belt due
4) cockpit carpet backing went
5) GPS failed (internal battery in the Raystar 120).

I think that if you are considering a low hour boat that as long as it was kept clean and neat, winterized as necessary, the mechanical systems had normal/reasonable maintenance, things will be fine. The first year though you should also expect all of the time related wear things, or things that should have gone wrong in the first four years but didn't will fail. This is especially true if you change the operating pattern as we did.

Henry
 
OK - few more questions. This 04 280DA I am looking at buying has 60 hours of saltwater use, 100 hours total. It was clamimed that it was rinsed and dry stored. The outdrive looked good - I am just so affraid the inside of the motor is all rusted (just my worry) what can I do to calm my fears - what to look for. I saw a small (looked like a rust spot) under the port engine. Also - I checked on a serveyor - but I'm thinking I'd be better off getting a mechanic and I'll check all the ac/gen/fridg . . etc and let the mechanic check the engine/outdrive . . any thoughts? A little more info - the current owner (not the salt water user) has only had the boat 1 year (claim to be upgrading) . . . As you can tell I'm not sold on the boat or the stories - but it looks pretty good.

Thanks for any help . . .
 
Do you know how many people boat in salt water... most. Fresh water rusts metal too.

From reading your posts, the first thing that popped into my head was, you haven't taken a look at enough boats. You need to sit down, list out a bunch of boats to go take a look at, then go look at them. You can learn a lot about a boat by looking at other same model boats. Sometimes you don't know what something can or should look like until you see a bunch. Once you have like 10-20 under your feet, you'll feel much more comfortable about what you are looking at and you'll be able to spot one that's taken care of quicker.

I never listen to stories, I just look. I don't care why he's selling it, I only care what i'm buying. It's easy to make up a story, much harder to hide the way a boat was used. Did he take care of it? is it clean? does stuff work? does the gelcoat shine?

Even if you do see something "wrong", what does that mean? how much will it cost to fix? stuff will break on a boat. You fix it and go boating.

I'm a big believer in boat Karma. When you step on a boat, what do you feel? Do you get excited? are you ehhhh? I love going on boats, I've been on hundreds. I always have to ask my self that question. Then think about why you feel a certain way as you're walking through the boat. Does that boat WANT me to take a picture of it? Do I feel comfortable being on it? Can I see myself on the boat? When I open a hatch, how does it make me feel? do I go "NICE" or do I think to myself "WTF". If you go on 1 boat, you're not going to have a frame of reference.
 
TurtleTone said:
...the first thing that popped into my head was, you haven't taken a look at enough boats. You need to sit down, list out a bunch of boats to go take a look at, then go look at them. You can learn a lot about a boat by looking at other same model boats.
Click to expand...

This is your best advice yet. This might be a great boat and it might be the one you end up buying...but don't get emotionally attached to it. There are a TON of boats to choose from in this market. The only way to feel comfortable is to compare with other boats.

Get a marine survey done, don't have a mechanic look at it. A surveyor will know about the engine too and can tell you if there is salt water damage. An auto mechanic may not be able to tell if there is salt water damage.

You might consider starting a new thread in the General discussion area. Although you are looking at a 280DA, your questions pertain to all boats and you will get a lot more advice from a wider range of members in the General area.
.
 
re: raw water cooling... in salt...
We're salt water peeps here. My neighbor has a 1994 21' Monterey with a raw water 5.7 volvo (it's still a cast iron detroit). It hasn't been rebuilt nor has it been flushed every time out and it has never had a problem. They've use it a 'ton' too!
There's always the option of converting it to a closed cooling system that's easy to do and not very expensive...
Find a dealer for the 'San Juan manufacturing' kits... they're great.
 
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Hi:
Really enjoyed reading your comments on what to concentrate on when looking at the 280 Sea Ray -2004 model year.
I am currently in negotiations to purchase my first ever Sea Ray - It will be a 280 - (model year 2007) coming from the Great Lakes.
Owner claims is has never been in salt water.
What should be my biggest concern to look out for?
Rene & Linda
 
On a boat that new there shouldn't be any problems. I would ask for the maintenance records and make sure all of the periodic fluid changes and other checklist items have been timely done. Be sure to hire a good surveyor and be there in person for the inspection and the sea trial. You will learn a lot about the 280's systems by watching the surveyor.
Good luck and let us know how you make out.
 
Pending a good surveyor report next week, I'll be taking delivery of my 2004 280 Dancer. But I have been told there is no owners manual for the boat. Does anyone know where I can download one (or buy one if needed). On the searay site they only have the owners supplement manual.
 
Thanks 280 Sundancer - but I have that. That says it's the "supplement" and several places it points to the "280 owners manual" for details. For example, on page 28 it says "Air conditioning and heating system information can be found is section 8 of the Owners Manual". This supplement doesn't have a section 8. So there must be a complete Owners Manual - and I was trying to find it.
 
The Owners Manual that comes with the boat is in two parts. One part is General Information that is generic to Sea Ray sport cruisers. The other part is the 280 Owners Manual Supplement. This has informarion specific to the 280 SA including the wiring diagrams.

Because many of the boat systems are installed systems from manufacturers other than Sea Ray (Cruisair, Vacuflush, Mercruiser, etc.) there is no comprehensive owners manual. You need to cobble one together from all of the variuos pieces. Even then you will find yourself frustrated by the lack of information. That's why CSR is such a great resource.
 
Any idea where I can locate the part one then, the manual that has the General Information that is generic to Sea Ray sport cruisers?
 
The manual listed for the later year 280's will apply to yours....try 2008. There is also a generic Sport Cruiser manual covering 97-04 listed under the '02 or '03 280. I actually found the '01 supplement to be more concise than the '08....go figure.
 
PM me your email, I have 2002-2005 parts manuals in PDF.
 
I just got word that the SmartCraft Gauges are not working on the 2004 280 Sundancer that I'm looking at. Any clues as to why none of the gauges work. And Also - could this be a clue to possible major electrical issues?
 
Would need more information, are all SmartCraft guages not working, what version of SmartCraft guages do they use?
Either way it is a yellow flag that you would need to investigate further or have the surveyor look into for you.
 
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