Buy American

JerryS said:
You go ahead and buy all of the cheap Chinese junk manufactured on the backs of people working for slave labor wages that you want. When I have the opportunity to buy products that help our people and our economy,that is what I am going to choose to do......You tell me what is wrong with that. Would you rather buy a bunch of crap from China and pay unemployment benefits, etc. to the people that you have put out of work?
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Jerry, I have to respectfully disagree with this part of your post. A friend of mine just returned from a trip to China (see post above) and what he told me he observed contradicts what you and many other Americans believe.

What he described to me were factories that are very modern, staffed by people who are very attentive to detail and interested in producing a quality product. They're paid about $100 a week which is a VERY nice wage for that area. The factories are clean, well designed, well lit, and the workers are happy. The $100/week wage they earn affords them a very nice lifestyle and, with a little time to save they can buy a car.

I'm probably older than most of you and I remember back in the '50's when "Made in Japan" meant cheap, plasticky, junky products that wouldn't last. It took Japan only about 20 years to turn that around to where "Made in Japan" started to mean high quality products.

Well Guess What? China is going to do that in less than half the time Japan took, and they're already well on their way. Where Japan made their factories and made the equipment to run them, China is buying that equipment to set up their factories and they're training workers to produce high quality products because they know this is what the world wants.

In a few years you won't be able to tell the difference between a high quality product made in China from one made anywhere else in the world....except for the cost. The one from China will be made by a worker who earns $5,000 a year vs one made in the US by a worker who likely earns $50,000 (plus all his expensive benefits).

It's sad to say but in many industries, Americans have priced ourselves out of the market. We're among the wealthiest countries in the world and enjoy one of the highest standards of living, but at what cost?
 
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JerryS said:
Mike – Hogwash!!! First, everyone inthe room knows the WWII story so I don't know why you are trying to dazzle us with your knowledge of history. The reality is that things have changed and capital is going to flow to where the cheapest labor can be found. That also means that when you buy those products, your wealth is being transferred. The statements about why don't you buy everything from your own family or state, etc. are also academic hogwash. The reality is that none of that nonsense is even possible. There are very few things that you can buy that are made in America and that is not going to change any day soon. You go ahead and buy all of the cheap Chinese junk manufactured on the backs of people working for slave labor wages that you want. When I have the opportunity to buy products that help our people and our economy,that is what I am going to choose to do. My home is not furnished with cheap Chinese junk and, it is not going to be. As just one example, we needed a sofa table so we purchased a wrought iron base made by a local artisan. The beveled glass top was made by a local glass shop. So, instead of buying several pieces of cheap crap, we chose to use our money to buy one quality piece and the decision helped to employ small business people. You tell me what is wrong with that. Would you rather buy a bunch of crap from China and pay unemployment benefits, etc. to the people that you have put out of work?


We indeed have become an information society. We tell the McDonald's clerk how many cheeseburgers that we want to buy to fatten our kids up so that they can be on medications by the time that they are eight years old. We then stick them in front of the TV so that their little brains can be bombarded with all of the ads for the things that they “must” have in order to be accepted into our society.


You have all kinds of bright ideas about how to make America competitive again which is great, but, the fact is that we cannot compete against slave labor wages. Go ahead and reduce the corporate tax to zero if you want to. How does that help? You said that it is a global economy. Goodyear, for example ,has a lot of their tires manufactured in China for sale in the US and other countries around the world. So, now you reduce their tax to zero so that they can sell their tires cheaper. And so, now you have lost a tax base to help pay the benefits for people that are out of work. And, you have made it less expensive for people in other countries to buy Goodyear tires. So, now Goodyear has more money to build more plants in China so that we can transfer more wealth to China. Great.


I'm not saying that we should be a protectionist society. I'm just saying that when possible, I want to support American jobs whenever I can. There are a whole lot people in this country that cannot find their a$$ with both hands let alone be an IT genius. I would much rather see those people employed than sucking off the government teet. It appears to me that you are just running your mouth to try to make everyone believe that you are some sort of know it all with all of the answers. I agree that there are a lot of government induced issues that should be addressed to help our businesses become more competitive. I, however, don't make the rules. I just try to do the best that I can based on what the reality is. And, that is to try to support my fellow Americans.

Just what is it that you are doing to support business in America?
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jason78 said:
I bought a new Tahoe this year for my wife that was built in Texas. Sure, it had some imported content but the majority was US. Just bought a bunch of American Olean floor tile that was made in the USA, prehung door, Vanity Cabinet, a bunch of drywall all made in the USA for my bathroom remodel. Just replaced all the windows in my home with windows made Made the USA and paid a local Small Business owner to install them. <br>
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I buy American Made whenever I can. As has been posted before, many things simply cannot be found unless imported. I have always had a habit of looking at all the selections and buying the Made in USA version (if it exists) even it it costs a couple bucks more.
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JerryS said:
Mike, I made that decision before this thread was started. And, I made that decision based on what I saw on the Norcold company website.
You obviously saw that I posted their statement: "Quality, integrity and reliability are built into each unit proudly made in America by an American-owned company"
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The sobering reality is that a new "normal" has to emerge. As North Americans we have enjoyed, in many respects, an unrealistic standard of living for a long time (as have many others around the world). A sense of entitlement has resulted, often to ridiculous extents. Living the American dream (and I don't really differentiate between Canadians and Americans here) is viewed as a right rather than a priviledge you need to work for and earn. The entire population of the world cannot live the way we do. But they want to! As traditionally lower-class parts of the world raise their standard of living, others will fall to maintain an unavoidable equilibrium.

The only way to maintain the status quo is to continue to have certain societies that are opressed. This is still happening in China, Taiwan, India, Thailand, etc. now, but the signs of change are obvious.

It doesn't matter where you buy from, things are going to change.
 
Gofirstclass said:
In a few years you won't be able to tell the difference between a high quality product made in China from one made anywhere else in the world....except for the cost. The one from China will be made by a worker who earns $5,000 a year vs one made in the US by a worker who likely earns $50,000 (plus all his expensive benefits).

It's sad to say but in many industries, Americans have priced ourselves out of the market. We're among the wealthiest countries in the world and enjoy one of the highest standards of living, but at what cost?
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I also went thru the "made in Japan" era. One of the things that will change is the $5K a year salary, just like it happened in Japan. Wages will go up and when it gets to the point where the labor rates are too high, then manufacturers will seek a new country to source their products. (Very little of our products are made in Japan these days and the Japanese also outsource to China.) Who will that next country be and when will it happen is anyone's guess but I am thinking it will be India.

Dave S
 
bajturner said:
The sobering reality is that a new "normal" has to emerge. As North Americans we have enjoyed, in many respects, an unrealistic standard of living for a long time (as have many others around the world). A sense of entitlement has resulted, often to ridiculous extents. Living the American dream (and I don't really differentiate between Canadians and Americans here) is viewed as a right rather than a priviledge you need to work for and earn. The entire population of the world cannot live the way we do. But they want to! As traditionally lower-class parts of the world raise their standard of living, others will fall to maintain an unavoidable equilibrium.

The only way to maintain the status quo is to continue to have certain societies that are opressed. This is still happening in China, Taiwan, India, Thailand, etc. now, but the signs of change are obvious.

It doesn't matter where you buy from, things are going to change.
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That is the lie we are being fed.

Is anyone so naive that they think slave labor and cheap manufacturing have not been available through out history? We always kept that ruin from our door step with tariff and tax policies that kept manufacturing and jobs in OUR country. The world has not changed, we have changed our policies to allow this disaster to happen. It has always been an alternative, but for most of our countries history we had the good sense to not allow it to happen. I think we all need to take a hard look at WHY this is happening and who is profiting from it. The American middle class is certainly NOT benefiting from this change in policy.
 
320Bob said:
Bought two new GMC SUVs in the past 13 months, ordered a new boat made in Nashville GA with an engine and drive made in Lexington TN, and if I can sell my house, purchase a brand new one built in Scottsdale, AZ.
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Thank you Bob! My family can eat tonight.
 
Great lakes pirate said:
Thank you Bob! My family can eat tonight.
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I have NEVER owed a foreign made car and I never will.

Even at great personal peril (the admiral wanted a Mercedes GL 450 or a BMW X5) but I just couldn't bring myself to sell out, even for her.

She got a full loaded Ford Edge that is still the envy of her little group of foreign driving friends (Lexus, BMW & Mercedes). Never been in the shop for more than an oil change, more comfortable, faster and handles better than all theirs. Its every bit as nice inside and out and I didn't have to sell out. She is ready for a new car now and its going to be a Lincoln MKT or a Ford Explorer.

Just a side note, a couple of the gals already switched to American made. One got a Cadillac SRX and the other got a Lincoln MKX.
 
Pack66Dad said:
That is the lie we are being fed.

Is anyone so naive that they think slave labor and cheap manufacturing have not been available through out history? We always kept that ruin from our door step with tariff and tax policies that kept manufacturing and jobs in OUR country. The world has not changed, we have changed our policies to allow this disaster to happen. It has always been an alternative, but for most of our countries history we had the good sense to not allow it to happen. I think we all need to take a hard look at WHY this is happening and who is profiting from it. The American middle class is certainly NOT benefiting from this change in policy.
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I'm with ya Packdaddy!!!!!!
 
Pack66Dad said:
I have NEVER owed a foreign made car and I never will.

Even at great personal peril (the admiral wanted a Mercedes GL 450 or a BMW X5) but I just couldn't bring myself to sell out, even for her.

She got a full loaded Ford Edge that is still the envy of her little group of foreign driving friends (Lexus, BMW & Mercedes). Never been in the shop for more than an oil change, more comfortable, faster and handles better than all theirs. Its every bit as nice inside and out and I didn't have to sell out. She is ready for a new car now and its going to be a Lincoln MKT or a Ford Explorer.

Just a side note, a couple of the gals already switched to American made. One got a Cadillac SRX and the other got a Lincoln MKX.
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This really depends on your definition of "foreign"!

I for one, struggle to define it. My GL 450 was made in the U.S., as is the smaller sibling the ML and BMW's X5. Many Lexus RX's are built stateside too.

In the meantime, your wife's Ford was assembled in Ontario, and her friend's Cadillac could very well have come from Mexico.

I realize that at the end of the day any vehicle with a blue oval or a crest & wreath on the grill are "North American domestic", but I still say that these lines at best, are VERY BLURRY!
 
RollerCoastr said:
This really depends on your definition of "foreign"!

I for one, struggle to define it. My GL 450 was made in the U.S., as is the smaller sibling the ML and BMW's X5. Many Lexus RX's are built stateside too.

In the meantime, your wife's Ford was assembled in Ontario, and her friend's Cadillac could very well have come from Mexico.

I realize that at the end of the day any vehicle with a blue oval or a crest & wreath on the grill are "North American domestic", but I still say that these lines at best, are VERY BLURRY!
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Agreed. I would still rather buy a car assembled in Canada and have the profits go back to a US company to reinvest back in all of the plants they do have in the US than buy a Toyota bolted together in Tennesse and have all that money in profit go overseas never to be seen again- at least until our government borrows it back from them for entitlement spending back here.
 
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I even struggle with that! We can buy stock in Toyota and share some of those profits, but the salaries of the line workers in Ontario & Mexico aren't paying my neighbor's mortgage. (the same neighbor btw, who hate Mercedes, but was thrilled about my purchase of a Mexican-built Ford)

I'm confused.
 
RollerCoastr said:
I even struggle with that! We can buy stock in Toyota and share some of those profits, but the salaries of the line workers in Ontario & Mexico aren't paying my neighbor's mortgage. (the same neighbor btw, who hate Mercedes, but was thrilled about my purchase of a Mexican-built Ford)

I'm confused.
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It can definitely be a hard decision. Not to say I have not broken my own rule of thumb before. I used to work at the BMW plant where the X5 was built (as a contractor). At least at the time, probably most of the componets came from US Suppliers. The engines did come from Germany and as I recall so did the transmissions. I still think you need to look where the profit is utlimately going. Whenever we transfer our money to another country without receiving an equal amount back in some way, shape or form, there comes a cost at some point. That is where our trade defecit hurts us.
 
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If you follow the Stassel plan.....we will be calling up China when we need more tanks, guns and ammo, also :huh:....for a multitude of reasons....the U.S. is currently getting it's collective a** kicked in an alarming amount of the manufacturing world.....we, the citizens, need to pull together, figure it out, and fix it now...even if it means foregoing another round of golf.....if we ever, seriously, have to defend ourselves we will need to be proficient in manufacturing, in addition to, exchanging information......I was in Vietnam, I remember well, that feeling, when someone is shooting at you, with a serious intention to f*** you up.....try getting China on the phone then....
 
I totally agree with the fact that the profit from foreign autos go to foreign countrys. I have heard thousands of times about my FOREIGN auto was built in this country but i think it just a way to try and justify that purchase. This country should also put a tax,tariff,surcharge what ever you want to call it on any auto,or auto part that comes to this country on a ship
 
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