Boat & Power selection question

[gcracker]

Hi All,

I have been a sailor for many years and have owned several sail boats ranging from 26 to 41ft. The Admiral and offspring are not sailors and have no intention of learning how to sail etc and we have compromised on getting a gin palace (cruiser)

There is quite a lot of selection and variations in the power class vs. sail and I need some help determining what combinations work best and would appreciate your thoughts, insights and experiences in this area.

The Admiral has agreed to a boat in the 31ft to 34ft range but no larger as she would like to be able to helm the boat on her own and would not feel comfortable docking anything bigger so size is resolved. However, we are not sure which of the following would be better choices of boat. 2007 310, 2007 330, 2006-2008 320 or 2006 340 any insights here?

We have been looking at Sea Rays in the 2006 to 2008 vintage and we like them all asthetically but are having trouble determining the power we want. There is both good and bad with both stern drives and v-drives and I would like your thoughts on both. What I have learned so far is this;

Stern Drives: Better acceleration, better fuel economy, higher top end but more costly on the maintenance side. Also there are variations of Stern drives offered i.e. Bravos I through III and Sea Cores. I have not and am not considering Axius

V-Drives: Slower both accelartaion and top end wise, lower fuel economy but somewhat cheaper to maintain especially if running in salt and brackish water. However any major problems are $$$$$ problems.

How much of the above is accurate and are there any other trade off decisions to be made? What really is the differences between the various stern drives and are some known problems vs. others? in terms of engine sizes i.e. 6.2, 7.4, etc what would be considered better picks for each of the boats above?

We plan to keep the boat in a marina on the jersey shore probably brackish water, and we plan to use in the area (salt water) with occasional longer range trips to MD, SC, and possibly FL. There are only 3 of us and we would take 2-4 guests out occasionally but is intended to be our home away from home.

There are so many different configurations that it makes your head spin so would appreciate help from anyone that can help me simplify my decisions using the right selection criteria.

Thanks in advance :thumbsup:

 

[tbirdvet]

Well, a lot can be said. I like I/O's but if you are planning on salt water use perhaps V drive would be best (although engine room will be very tight vs I/O). I looked at 310 and 330 and took the 330 primarily because it had a gunnel that you can use to get to the sides and deck (in addition it had walk thru windshied) and also more seating in cockpit. I like the 2008 and newer due to the DTS throttles. That being said any of the models you noted would be very nice.

 

[fwebster]

I have an observation:

You are retiring from sailing. Your decisions concerning this power boat have thus far been made using sailing as a reference point. One thing you have likely not considered is that, for all intents and purposes, a proper powerboat will go where you want it to, irrespective of the wind. It really doesn't matter how much fiberglass is sticking out in front of the helm, you can still put the boat where you want it to go. Therefore, the 31-34 ft. choice is artificially smaller than you can easily handle.

If you do intend to cruise the distances you mention, then the 311-34 ft boat is too small to get you the range and equipment you most like desire in a power boat. Specifically, gas engines will limit your time between fill ups, your range and will siphon big $ from your cruising budget.

You likely need to be looking in the 40-50 ft range...................

 

[gcracker]

I have an observation:

You are retiring from sailing. Your decisions concerning this power boat have thus far been made using sailing as a reference point. One thing you have likely not considered is that, for all intents and purposes, a proper powerboat will go where you want it to, irrespective of the wind. It really doesn't matter how much fiberglass is sticking out in front of the helm, you can still put the boat where you want it to go. Therefore, the 31-34 ft. choice is artificially smaller than you can easily handle.

If you do intend to cruise the distances you mention, then the 311-34 ft boat is too small to get you the range and equipment you most like desire in a power boat. Specifically, gas engines will limit your time between fill ups, your range and will siphon big $ from your cruising budget.

You likely need to be looking in the 40-50 ft range...................

Frank if it were up to me I would love a 40ft cruiser but the wife (note original post) has never handled any boat in close quarters and is dead serious about learning to handle the boat and she has put her proverbial foot down as to max length. On the upside for me there is interest and willingness so I am happy to sacrifice 2 or 3 seasons on a smaller tub and upgrade when she is comfortable

 

[fc3]

What Frank said.

Having a boat in the size range you specified, I have to admit that the purchase was a mistake. I should have gone a few feet larger and diesel power.

In the 11 years I've owned this boat, which I purchased new, I had ONE propulsion issue that was caused by a faulty exhaust system gasket. The gasket allowed a small amount of raw water to damage the exhaust valve seat on a cylinder. The cylinder's compression was still well within spec, but "in spec" isn't good enough for me, so I had the heads rebuilt. I did the work myself so it was very inexpensive to do it. I believe the total cost was less than $600 ($175 per head and $200ish for gaskets) The V-drive Sea Ray has never been hauled out prematurely because of mechanical problems. She has never left me stranded. She has never been towed.

On the other hand, in the 12 years that I owned my previous single engine stermdrive boat, which I also purchased new, I can recall at least three drive rebuilds for about $500 each and one complete drive replacement for about $4,000. (Remember this was over 10 years ago when gas was under $1.30 so you need to consider inflation. Then there was the leaks that required the engine to be pulled out to service the transom plate, a few haulings to replace drive bellows or shift bellows, etc. I also remember at least three summers (1995 I think, 97 & 98) when the boat had to be hauled early because something in the stupid sterndrive failed and the repairs ran through rest of the good weather. The 1998 gimbal bearing failure was when I finally had enough of the accursed stern drive and bought Just Ducky.

Recommend a sterndrive boat? No. Emphatically no. Fuel is cheap compared to multiple tows, lost time, aggravation, aborted vacation plans, and repairs which are expensive. Diesels are less tolerant of sloppy maintenance than gas engines, but if you maintain them properly, diesel inboards are definitely the way to go.

Regarding the close handling issue of a 40+ footer, I have two words for your wife: bow thruster.

 

[gcracker]

thanks for the input on the drives very helpful.......

as for the wife, she really has never learned any kind of seamanship, she can hold a heading in open water but thats about it........

her father was a big boater sail and power, his nickname was Captain Bligh, you can probably imagine what boating as a kid was like for her and its taken me forever to get her back on the water let alone interested in boats........ nuff said

 

[compensation]

Having made the leap from sail to power myself, I have a couple of observations. Like Frank W said, your perspective is from a sailing point of view, so here are some points to ponder:

A powerboat loses a lot of interior space to the engine(s) and other machinery that most sailboats under 60' don't have. In some cases over half of the boat length can be given over to machinery space. But, all that machinery is somewhat compact, so you are not losing additional space to mast, rigging, sail storage, etc.

Powerboats are much beamier than sailboats. This can mean that pipe berths and quarter berths give way to real beds. It can mean stand up heads with separate stall showers.

Power boats are much more maneuverable than sailboats. If you (and your wife) drive a twin screw inboard boat you will be amazed at how easy it is to handle. - I have a standing challenge to all my friends who are intimidated by big powerboats. I can teach anyone, who is motivated, to dock my boat in less than 30 minutes.

 

[Turtlesboat]

I had a 280 and jumped to a 450, I can tell you that handling the 450 is FAR easier than the 280. It's not even a comparison. Not only is the ride so much better, but I can get into places in bad conditions that I would never dream of in my 280. Having owned I/O's and now inboards, i'll never own an I/O again. So much maint compared to inboards. Having owned gas and now diesel, i'll never go back to gas.

6 hours with a captain, and your wife will be a pro on a big inboard diesel. I know it's not what you want to hear, but it's the truth.

 

[rcknecht]

First, If you plan on keeping it on the Jersey Shore, it has to be inboards... The maintenance of IOs is not worth it.

You have to consider your budget when you buy a boat...

If you plan on using it as second home, go big, big as you can afford... Buy an older boat that is bigger rather than a newer boat.

How far do you plan to take your boat? If you plan on doing long trips then a Diesel boat is a must... With a diesel boat you have to deteremine how much you plan to use the boat, and do a cost analysis... For most people, they don't use there boats enough to justify buying a diesel boat.

Of the boats you are looking at... I would go with the 340, as it is the largest boat you are looking at... I would also take a look at an older 370, 380, and 410... The 410 with diesels is a very efficient boat, much better than a gas 340. If you really want a lot of room, buy and aft cabin, like a 380 for 420 AC...

 

[searay40dad]

I had a 280 and jumped to a 450, I can tell you that handling the 450 is FAR easier than the 280. It's not even a comparison. Not only is the ride so much better, but I can get into places in bad conditions that I would never dream of in my 280. Having owned I/O's and now inboards, i'll never own an I/O again. So much maint compared to inboards. Having owned gas and now diesel, i'll never go back to gas.

6 hours with a captain, and your wife will be a pro on a big inboard diesel. I know it's not what you want to hear, but it's the truth.

well said and dead-on accurate.

 

[gcracker]

First, If you plan on keeping it on the Jersey Shore, it has to be inboards... The maintenance of IOs is not worth it.

You have to consider your budget when you buy a boat...

If you plan on using it as second home, go big, big as you can afford... Buy an older boat that is bigger rather than a newer boat.

How far do you plan to take your boat? If you plan on doing long trips then a Diesel boat is a must... With a diesel boat you have to deteremine how much you plan to use the boat, and do a cost analysis... For most people, they don't use there boats enough to justify buying a diesel boat.

Of the boats you are looking at... I would go with the 340, as it is the largest boat you are looking at... I would also take a look at an older 370, 380, and 410... The 410 with diesels is a very efficient boat, much better than a gas 340. If you really want a lot of room, buy and aft cabin, like a 380 for 420 AC...

1. Inboards it is check one decision off list :thumbsup:

2. Working the wife on bigger boat using scenarios in prior posts, we shall see.......... :smt021

3. For me boats are a fun way to travel distance, I have raced boats for many years, FastNet, Round Britain, Round the Island (LI NY) and the Nantucket Bucket. I have also sailed great distances Transatlantic 13 times and Round the world once (Whitbread round the world). I love it :grin:

However......... Im not entirely sure how much the Admiral and Ensign will want to do as they have never gone much more than day tripping (coastal)...... :huh: Have tentatively agreed that OC MD is ok, further out is unknown territory........

Must say that this is all good information and appreciate you all taking the time to help simplify my thoughts :thumbsup:

 

[Turtlesboat]

Well you seem to be ahead of the game in that you know how you want to use the boat. When I bought my 280, I wasn't sure how i wanted to boat. so I went with a sporty cruiser. It was fun, we had a blast, it was a great boat. But we outgrew it in one year. Not the size necessarily, but in how we wanted to use the boat. We wanted to take TRIPS and the 280 isn't built for long trips. It can handle it, but I had to keep my journeys close to fuel docks. The boat also wasn't equipped with the gear needed for the trips we wanted to take (radar, gen, autopilot, big water tank, fridge that would hold more than 4 TV dinners, etc...) so we stretched out the 280 for a few more years until we were comfortable in what kind of boat we wanted to go with. then we put the 280 up for sale and... it sat. It sat some more. boats were/are just not moving. It was for sale for over a year and a half. When it finally sold, I realized the most expensive part of owning a boat is selling it. Listen to FW, he knows boats and he knows boaters. If you're buying a boat now with the intention of moving out of it in the near future, you're in for a world of hurt. Pick the boat that will allow you to do the kind of boating you want to do right from the start. If everyone decides "boating sucks" then you bail on the boat and take your hit... well you're going to do that no matter what size boat you buy. If everyone loves it (because you picked the right boat for the kind of boating you want to do) then you dodged the expensive upgrade bullet that will not be small.