Automotive compound

H

hblock72

Active Member
May 11, 2009
248
Salisbury, NC (High Rock Lake)
Boat Info
2007 185 sport w/wakeboard package
Engines
4.3 TKS
Question for the experts: Can an automotive/paint rubbing compound be used on gel coat? I always use Meguires marine polish and wax, but I've got one small scratch that is going to need something more abbrasive and I have some automotive rubbing compound on hand and was just wondering if I could use it. If not I'll get some Mequires power cut compound. Thanks.
 
A couple of years ago, I tried to use some Meguiars compound that I had used on a car after wet sanding to bring out the shine. I tried it on a small spot on my 175 and it did not work at all. In fact, it left the white gelcoat with a yellowish tinge and did nothing to help the oxidation. I then used a Meguiars product for marine use and it took it all away and cleaned up the area. So based on that little test, I'd have to say no the automotive compounds don't work right with gelcoat...
 
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Agree with GUNN i tried meguires diamond cut this spring andf it didnt do much at all,I have been working in bodyshops for 37 years and when i hit it with buff magic it shined beautifully.
 
I actually emailed Maguires on this topic at the beginning of the season and they said you cannot use auto on boat--the chemical components are different.
 
Well then what the he!! Have I been doing?
I've used automotive compound (3M Extra Cut Compound) for about 5 years and am very happy with the results. Works so well I almost don't feel the need to follow it up with a glaze. Now I don't have any experience with "marine" compounds but always felt it's a marketing ploy.
I think automotive will work with some obviously being better than others.
Also coming from a bodyshop guy.
 
Both automotive and marine compounds come in differing grades from fine to extra cut. The difference is in the surface and gelcote is much harder than lacquer. That would be a reason you would want to consider a marine formula over an automotive formula.

Additionally some of the marine formulas have a diminishing value formula . . . the product cutting ability is strong at first and diminishes its cutting properties as it is worked on the surface with buffer. I would definitely recommend the diminishing value compounds.

With all that said one could still use a correct formula of auto/marine compound on a fiberglass/lacquer.
 
My first post here so be gentle if I mess anything up etc :)

I registered to ask some questions, but found this thread which is a subject I know well. Since I have spent some time detailing and refinishing paint (years ago professionally but mostly as a hobby more recently) and previously had a business where we were distributors of Meguiars and other similar products I have learned a few tricks.


First I tried a search on Meguiars website for diminishing abrasive and found this
No Products Found

Sorry the item you are searching for cannot be found. Please try again.


 I know that doesn't mean they do not have products with such properties, or that they are not available etc, but just that even the manufacturer does not feel it is a property that needs to be searchable.

Now I believe wifi got it right, and add to this that most all abrasive compounds (products with an abrasive grit of some kind in the mix) will have a diminishing value due to the abrasive itself wearing down. Note most is not the same as all.

The real trick is to be able to select the proper product for the job at hand. Obviously a well maintained go fast with custom paint will not require the same process or products that a 25 yr old neglected hull will.

That is half of the hard part (technique is the other) as without actually using the products, and experience of working on different surfaces there is really no way to know the answer and you are forced into trial and error.

As an example an earlier post referenced a great product called Diamond Cut which has nearly no abrasive and is mostly heat activated and designed specifically for clear coat paints. It will work on painted stripes and such like the imron used on newer Formulas etc, but will take forever on the modern gel coats. It is good for small touch ups and clean up work etc, but for the typical oxidation most see it is just not the right product.

A heavy duty product will produce the best results on the most oxidized boats, but I have been seeing that they also are misused due to their fast cutting ability and the amount of product they do remove. Something few seem to realize (even the pro's or they just ignore it) is that there is only so many mils of gel coat on your boat, and if you continue to remove it every year it does wear down and the gel gets thinner.

Just grabbing the heaviest most abrasive compound you have is not always the best answer, and to truly refinish properly you need to clean, remove heavy scratches and oxidation, and then polish the surface. Then in the years to follow you will have much less to remove and will need a less abrasive product to just bring back the high luster or shine.

I just did a boat recently that besides having a few poorly repaired areas with paint that was thinned out from previous buffing it had some areas that the gel was getting pretty thin as well. It was only 12 years old so someone was over doing it for a while.

So the trick is getting it just right and finding the right products and processes that work for the boat your doing.

On my 20+ yr old boat (I have it for approx 12) I can use a med cut compound and follow with a decent glaze or polish because it has not been allowed to get too oxidized since I have had it. Sure there are still a few places on the top sides that need a little more attention from the sun beating etc, but even the blue colored hull sides do not require more than med cut or micro polish paste.

And much as this can be confusing I have found that the guys who just pay their marina to detail their boat have it even tougher as now they are paying BIG money to someone who's main interest is finishing quickly to do a job they do not understand. Some get a oxidized job with a shiny sealant, while others get their gel sanded down every yea.

Sorry for the length, and if it sounded a bit like a rant at the end :) , but something is just not right when people are paying $20-30 a foot to detail their late model boat and it is not really nice etc.
 
Just to update you on my progress:

I had a fairly long scratch left on the side of my boat from a trailer tire blowing out and ripping the fender off my trailer. It wasn't deep and my fingernail would not catch in it, so I didn't feel I needed to fill it with gelcoat. I bougth some Meguiars One Step Compound and used it on my Makita rotary with a wool pad and after going over it three times it was still there. I ended up having to get even more aggressive and wet sand the area, then hit it again with the One Step Compound. Now you can't even tell where the scratch was. It turned out great. I figured after the One Step Compound, I'd have to use something like Color Restorer to finish it up, but It looked so good after the One Step Compound, I just applied a fresh coat of Flagship wax and I'm ready to get back out on the water. When I lay up for the winter, I'll go over the whole boat with some color restorer and another coat of wax. Thanks for the replies.
 
It is really great to hear you were able to get it done, and are happy with the results!!

Just curious if you have a pic of the damage that tire did?

I have been trying to get a friend to put some money into repairing his trailer, and just last week when I was helping him launch it one of the wheels came off during a slow turn. Thankfully the boat was already off it or it would have been really ugly and a lot more than just picking a wheel off the road.

I guess it will be a priority now :)
 
I would have to disagree with some of you. I use Turtle wax polishing compound and have gotten GREAT results. As with an any abrasive you have to be carful with it.

This



Plus this

6457_1.JPG


= a great shine!!!
 
AKBASSKING said:
I would have to disagree with some of you. I use Turtle wax polishing compound and have gotten GREAT results. As with an any abrasive you have to be carful with it.

This



Plus this

6457_1.JPG


= a great shine!!!
Click to expand...

There is nothing wrong with the consumer packaged products except maybe there being more expensive (smaller size packaging etc), and the only other drawback I can think of right now is that most are not in the heavy grit range and just take more time to get results (sure there are some that are more aggressive etc but there not the norm).

I have also found that almost anything marketed to the marine industry is just plain higher priced. This is documented with many products, but I like to poke fun at 3M as their the giant in this stuff, and they are known to have several different prices for the same exact product between their auto, industrial, and marine divisions (as well as a couple of the others as well). Sure they change labels and most times part numbers, but typically it these items are being made in the same plant, at the same time, and only the labeling machine at the end is seeing any changes, and oh the suggested prices as well.

One thing I cant seem to figure out is why Starbrite uses that PTEF logo, and if this product has anything to do with PTFE (what the brand name Teflon is made from)?

I remember using a PTFE wax a long time ago that was pretty good. Used it on the bottom of a go fast that was left in the water, and it did seem to keep it cleaner for longer than the regular stuff, but it was not any better on the top sides etc.

Back to the turtle wax compound. I have used that, have mixed it with other stuff, and probably still have some lying around etc, but since I have so many gallons of various Meguars products left over from the past I will typically just choose one that fits what I am doing.

One thing that I just can not seem to understand though is why the boat manufacturers keep making us have to work so hard to keep our boats looking good. Not all of them, but most of the production builders just seem to keep us busy from their cost cutting. When I see how much better the color stripe etc in Imron on a Formula holds up than the color in the gel on my SeaRay, or how some higher end builders like Tiara's gel just seems to hold up so well long term I just ask myself how much could the other guys be saving?

I know a lot of it has to do with regular maintenance etc, and was cursing my one neighbor when I did him a favor on his 10yr old walk around that he doesn't even hose off during the season, but it just seems some brands get oxidized more than others, and some produce reds and blacks that hold up better than others blues and greens.

I actually can not wait to see what all the late model boats look like in ten years with so many going to deep dark colors in the hull and many putting the color in the gel. I expect detailers will be busy in the future trying to keep them looking nice, and very likely more than a few body shops will be painting them as well.
 
Half Fast said:
+1 for the starbrite with the teflon. It used to say Teflon on the bottle, now it just says PTEF - but it definitely lasts!
Click to expand...

My question on this is why the change in the label, and is there Teflon or PTFE in it now, or was there ever?

I had first thought that they just got tired of paying considerably more for the product under the Dupont name, but never did find confirmation on this.
 
LennyD said:
My question on this is why the change in the label, and is there Teflon or PTFE in it now, or was there ever?

I had first thought that they just got tired of paying considerably more for the product under the Dupont name, but never did find confirmation on this.
Click to expand...

Same stuff and the cheapest place I have found to buy it is, (If you create an account the price is cheaper than shown)):

http://www.fisheriessupply.com/productgroupdetail.aspx?cid=133871&keywords=Starbrite+polish
 
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