Adding 4th battery separately?

Pyrojodge

Pyrojodge

Well-Known Member
TECHNICAL Contributor
May 1, 2011
4,248
Lake Erie Ohio
Boat Info
1989 Sea Ray 340 DA
Engines
twin 454 Mercs
Greetings all,

I have been planning my stereo upgrade for quite some time and I plan on installing a Kinetic 1800 AGM battery exclusively for the stereo. I want to mount this battery in the same area/location in the cabin that the amp and the power supply will be located.

I have already purchased the following.

<Each item below links for more info about the item>


1. Kinetik Kips1245 power supply / Charger
2. Kinetic KHC1800 AGM Battery
3. Blue Seas 60 Amp Breaker
and other misc mounting hardware, battery tray, zip ties, terminals, and so forth.

My question is, do I have to run a round wire to my other bank of batteries or can I keep this one completely sealed off from the other bank. I plan on mounting the battery under the seat and the amp under the stairs in my boat. I want to keep the runs short to keep the logistics easy and also reduce lost voltage. What should I make sure I do and what to look for?

Thanks for you help and feed back.
 
Adding 4th battery seperatly?

Make sure 60amps is enough. My amp says 120 amp fuse. Also, your charger/converter needs to be able to handle the load. Mine is only 30 amps (for now) and my lights blink with the base while on shore power.
 
Hi Jason,

You can keep the battery completely seperate, the only thing with that to remember is obviously it will not receive any charge form the engines. You could get around this easily with a DC-DC charger, we have a very strong preference for these ove VSR's (smart solenoids) etc.

If your running your generator, then of course charge to it shouldnt be a concern as you are running the charger I prseume at that time.
 
Ken, the manual says 60 amp fuse with 4 gauge wire minium which is what it will have.
Ian, no generator but not worried about the battery going dead really. I think the 45 amp power source will be more then enough considering the volume I listen to music at and it will be completely separate from the main trio of batteries.

What about grounding or installing this battery inside the cabin. It is a sealed AGM so no out gasing. Any other tips on my plans?
 
No other tips Jason, what you are doing is seperate, so no leads need to be run back.
 
Thanks Ian I owe you one. Just didn't want to hook it up incorrectly.
 
IanBat said:
No other tips Jason, what you are doing is seperate, so no leads need to be run back.
Click to expand...

Just clarifying what I said a bit more Jason. Just ensure you keep that battery clean wired. By that I mean all wiring to whatever you are running off it, originates and terminates at that battery.

So all positive connections to the battery positive terminal, and all negatives return to the battery negative terminal.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD
 
IanBat said:
Just clarifying what I said a bit more Jason. Just ensure you keep that battery clean wired. By that I mean all wiring to whatever you are running off it, originates and terminates at that battery.

So all positive connections to the battery positive terminal, and all negatives return to the battery negative terminal.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD
Click to expand...

No worries there I have done lots of wiring but I didn't know if it was necessary to ground this to the boat (to the engines for example like the other batteries)? I plan on keeping it completely separate so I don't risk flashing cabin lights or draining my main bank of house batteries. I want to have it in two completely separate electrical systems.
 
Pyrojodge said:
No worries there I have done lots of wiring but I didn't know if it was necessary to ground this to the boat (to the engines for example like the other batteries)? I plan on keeping it completely separate so I don't risk flashing cabin lights or draining my main bank of house batteries. I want to have it in two completely separate electrical systems.
Click to expand...

Yes you need a ground. If you would like to have a completely different power for the stereo only how would you charge it? Run a 4 gauge wire to the AGM battery from the Negative of the batteries on the Motor.It will be used for grounding purposes only. Next you need shore power or a solar power to charge the battery. Get a charger for it and run off of shore power. Min 30 amp charge rate. Pro Mariner will sell refurbs on ebay cheap. Any Questions PM me
 
Michael, I have the kinetic power supply / charger for this battery that will be wired to 120v to maintain and assist the battery in its duties. So since it is separate charging system than the house bank is the ground still needed?
 
Pyrojodge said:
Michael, I have the kinetic power supply / charger for this battery that will be wired to 120v to maintain and assist the battery in its duties. So since it is separate charging system than the house bank is the ground still needed?
Click to expand...

The ground is not needed. As there is no ground, it is floating in the water.

Power has to complete a circuit, from the positive terminal to the negative terminal, the stereo in the middle is the load.

You are hooking a Seperate charger to it, as such the system is completely Seperate to everything.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD
 
The boat is a floating ground. Hence connecting your motor to your batteries on the negative side.

http://www.qualitymarineservices.net/Metal Boat Quarterly Article, DC-AC Ground Connection.pdf

Its required and for your safety and others near your Dock!
Also the heavier gauge like 4awg is perfect for grounding, tends not to pick up alternator whine, charging clicking, nav lights and other unwanted noises. Also check on your charger to see waht gauge is used to charge the battery. Resistance slows charge, heat slows charge as well. Also your fire extinguisher makes a great ground !! Just kidding any Questions PM me or ask here.Cheers. I designed and installed on old boat a complete charging system for the stereo. Pretty simple.
 
AC & DC are bonded together ??!!!

Since when.

They are two completely different electrical systems and are not bonded together.

The green wire on your AC alternating current system runs back through the electrical lead to the shore connection and runs back to EARTH from there.

AC alternating current, 3wires, Active, Neutral, Earth. When you use a Generator on land, correct practice is to have a stake driven into the ground and the earth wire connected to it. When you recieve a shock from AC, you are providing the shock.

The galvanic isolator in your boat is wired on the earth on the AC power and is only on the AC.

In a battery, it is DC. Direct current. The flow of current runs one direction from one terminal to the other terminal. When you run bus bars, it allows you to run multiple negatives back to the one source,


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Ok hands up, I have learnt something.......though I believe I am far from alone. Looking at the articles on google, and even Volvo marine.

Personaly, I would not have mixed AC & DC together as mixing those, scares the crap out of me.

But this article is plain English.

http://rjwsurvey.com/uploads/Grounding.pdf


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD
 
Ok on the hook the AC runs off of the generator. Look at your generator that big wire to the hull ground studs is your earth ground. He is looking to run the Charger/inverter off of 110 or generator to charge it. The charger is charging on the Positive terminal. Power is converted from 110/12v . The Battery only needs to be grounded. Amp can then be grounded at the battery providing the battery is grounded to the boat, other bank of batteries or engine. The amp ground wire should be no more than 18" to not pick up whine clicks or noise. Bigger is better in the ground world.

Next step is to put a switch in it, dont forget your volt gauge for your battery does come in handy after a few drinks in troubleshooting your stereo after you are listening to it all day. Also heat kills batteries and amps, so dont forget a fan! Cheers
 
IanBat said:
Ok hands up, I have learnt something.......though I believe I am far from alone. Looking at the articles on google, and even Volvo marine.

Personaly, I would not have mixed AC & DC together as mixing those, scares the crap out of me.

But this article is plain English.

http://rjwsurvey.com/uploads/Grounding.pdf


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD
Click to expand...

Ian,

Thank you for that find. It is a concise, well written article. I definitely learned something.

Bryan
 
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