420 SD vs Tiara 4300 Sovran - help me decide.

[DF470DA]

Scott- you certainly have a lot going into the decision, so let me throw one other difference you may want to give some thought to. Coming out of a traditional Sundancer, you are used to the "open air" space between the top of your windshield and the edge of your bimini top. That allows you to communicate easily with anyone on the dock, a passing boat - without leaving the helm. When you go to the 4300 Tiara (which is a tremendous boat) with a closed cockpit, you will notice a bit of a closed in feeling, as I did moving from my 380DA to our current 470DA. With the 420DB you will still have that ability to talk or yell instructions, request feedback etc., again from your driving position. Just something I thought I'd share as it is a difference I myself am still getting used to. DOn't get me wrong, I love the enclosed bridge and lack of eisenglas to deal with when rain comes in, or worse it's a cold evening and stretching that glass is a real effort, but I do miss the ability to basically just converse when I'd like to even with something as simple as my dock mate next door.
The 4300 will def give you a more stabile ride in big water, but the bridge boat gives you that great transom to galley open area that works so well when the guest count is up.
Spend a little more time in the closed cockpit…have your wife walk outside up on the bow and see what you think when you want to say something instructive as in maybe anchoring or un-tying etc., it just may be difference enough to push you one way or the other…good luck buddy, either way you're getting a great boat….

 

[sb in gp]

Have you actually been on the 43 you are negotiating on? If not that could really throw a wrench in the mix. There's items on salt boats that if even just cosmetic I couldn't live with unless there was someone like me who me who owned it. Corrosion and rust on things would drive me absolutely crazy.

I have not been on the 4300 that I am negotiating on. I have knowledgeable boat friend who is going to tour it on Monday and run the engines. I've been on other 4300s though. Before I closed I would certainly tour the boat and have it fully surveyed.

 

[sb in gp]

Scott- you certainly have a lot going into the decision, so let me throw one other difference you may want to give some thought to. Coming out of a traditional Sundancer, you are used to the "open air" space between the top of your windshield and the edge of your bimini top. That allows you to communicate easily with anyone on the dock, a passing boat - without leaving the helm. When you go to the 4300 Tiara (which is a tremendous boat) with a closed cockpit, you will notice a bit of a closed in feeling, as I did moving from my 380DA to our current 470DA. With the 420DB you will still have that ability to talk or yell instructions, request feedback etc., again from your driving position. Just something I thought I'd share as it is a difference I myself am still getting used to. DOn't get me wrong, I love the enclosed bridge and lack of eisenglas to deal with when rain comes in, or worse it's a cold evening and stretching that glass is a real effort, but I do miss the ability to basically just converse when I'd like to even with something as simple as my dock mate next door.
The 4300 will def give you a more stabile ride in big water, but the bridge boat gives you that great transom to galley open area that works so well when the guest count is up.
Spend a little more time in the closed cockpit…have your wife walk outside up on the bow and see what you think when you want to say something instructive as in maybe anchoring or un-tying etc., it just may be difference enough to push you one way or the other…good luck buddy, either way you're getting a great boat….

This is not that big of an issue for me. On my 320 I installed rigid plastic above the windshield for clarity, and I never take it down, so I'm used to the closed in feel. Thanks.

 

[sb in gp]

I should add, one more piece of information to the pool. The Admiral likes the 420 DB because of the space, and lighting in the salon. That may be the trump card.

Scott

 

[bmac]

It usually is......

I should add, one more piece of information to the pool. The Admiral likes the 420 DB because of the space, and lighting in the salon. That may be the trump card.

Scott

 

[JV II]

Transporting a Tiara 4300 from FL is going to cost you a whole lot more than $10,000.

 

[Bryank]

Transporting a Tiara 4300 from FL is going to cost you a whole lot more than $10,000.

I transported my 410DA from Florida to Lake Erie for $6500. The arch didn't have to come off nor did it have pods, so that will likely add a bit.

 

[JamesT]

Early on in my search, my decision was between 450/470 Sundancer and 4300 Tiara Sovran. I fell in love with the photos of the 4300 Tiara, but when I finally boarded one this past October, we took it off our list...mainly because the cabin salon felt too tight and "cut up" for our taste. Seeing as how you've already been on one, you know the layout but you might want to familiarize yourself again (with your wife) on both boats you're considering and you might save yourself a lot of time. I've never driven a 4300 so I can't speak to its ride, but the bow appears to be more capable and Tiara's reputation for quality seems to be uncontested even by competitors. But with that bow and with the glass enclosure, I'd be concerned about visibility and bow rise during acceleration on the Tiara where you won't have that issue on a Sedan Bridge, or even a Sundancer for that matter.

During my search I test drove two 45' boats with Volvo IPS pods (2009 Riviera 4400 and a 2014 Jeanneau NC14) and both boats took forever to come around in turns, so much so that I had difficulty jumping my own wake. (Zeus turned like a jetski on rails, but that's another story). Bow rise was high in both boats, but worse in the Riviera.

My research re resale value is that I found no significant difference between Tiara and Sea Ray in this size range.

Salt versus fresh? I've only ever boated in salt so can't speak to the difference. Everything but distilled water will corrode your boat...

Tough decision only you and your wife can make!! Good luck!!

 

[sbw1]

But with that bow and with the glass enclosure, I'd be concerned about visibility and bow rise during acceleration on the Tiara where you won't have that issue on a Sedan Bridge, or even a Sundancer for that matter.

The bow rise on the 4300 is a non-issue. Even sitting down at the helm, the water in front of you is clearly visible from the time you add power until you reach cruise speed. The windshields on Tiara are also pretty tall so you never end up looking through a windshield frame. Great visibility all around.

 

[sb in gp]

So the decision has been made. Going with a 420DB. I have to say that having all you great CSR people to bounce ideas off of and get advice was a significant consideration in my choice, so thanks for that and I look forward to continuing to learn. In the end the biggest factor was the space and livability of the DB. Fit our goals much better.

I've got an offer in on the boat that has been verbally accepted, so we're moving into the inspection phase. She's a 2005 with Cummins 480CE motors. I'm scheduled to have the surveyor on it next week. Spoke to Cummins today and got the engine records which show annual and continuous Cummins service, so that is good.

There is one thing in the records of one of the engines that I have a question about (I plan to post this in the Diesel forum too). When the port engine was a year old (160 hours) it started stalling and vibrating after running for 45 mins or so. It burned up 3 fuel pumps over a couple of months before Cummins figured out that the oil flow into the fuel pump was restricted by some thread shavings. Since that was fixed the motors have logged 450 more hours on them without any indication that there are issues. Would this issue from 2006 be of any long-term concern?

Thanks,

Scott

 

[techmitch]

Sound's like the port eng. ran lean for a while, how long, who knows!If compression test readings and oil sample test that are taken during the survey are ok and match the starboard eng. I don't think you have any thing to worry about.

 

[Alex F]

If I'll say that you've made a good decision it'll be understatement.

Good luck with the rest of the process.

 

[trit21]

You will not get a compression test from a diesel survey as they are most difficult to perform and don't tell you a whole lot of information at all. This is not a gas engine. You will get blow-by if you paid for it and I would be very leery about the way it is performed. Using the wrong restriction port on the breather and you numbers all way off. With that said, get lots of photos and post on boatdiesel for comments. Pay attention to the exhaust riser as an incorrectly engineered riser can lead to salt water being introduced to the exhaust side of the turbo. Read up on boatdiesel about some people having problems with the 480CE and dropping valves on #6 cylinder. I think (not sure didn't pay to much attention to it) that the problem was because of overloading. The engines need to turn over the rated RPM or at the very least to the rated RPM otherwise they are being overloaded and I do remember the forum saying these engines will not last long in an overloaded state. I know I am going to catch a lot of flack from this but be diligent with the survey and get lots of photos. So much is written on boatdiesel about this, take a look.

 

[JV II]

Good luck! Good choice.

 

[ZZ13]

Where is the boat?

 

[sb in gp]

Offer accepted on the 420. Sold the 320 by owner. Everything is coming together. Survey happened today and everything checked out. Should get the oil samples done next week.

The boat is on Lake Michigan, so I've got a spring trip to plan to bring it around the mitten.

Thanks everyone for help and advice.

 

[Carver370]

If she's in Grand Haven we will have to try to connect this spring. The 56 Hatteras I Captain is at North Shore there and I will be back and forth quite a bit in March and April.

 

[my3sons]

Offer accepted on the 420. Sold the 320 by owner. Everything is coming together. Survey happened today and everything checked out. Should get the oil samples done next week.

The boat is on Lake Michigan, so I've got a spring trip to plan to bring it around the mitten.

Thanks everyone for help and advice.

Congrats! and good luck with her

 

[sb in gp]

If she's in Grand Haven we will have to try to connect this spring. The 56 Hatteras I Captain is at North Shore there and I will be back and forth quite a bit in March and April.

Yes, in grand haven. Planning to bring her home around Memorial Day weather permitting.

 

[HUMPH]

Congrats, you will have a blast with her!