2005 280DA holding tank

[melida]

Hi to all.
My boat is equipped with direct overboard discharge system option with macerator no holding tank, no gray water.
Just 8-10 liters in the vacuum generator an when I turn the key in head it pumps from under the hull to sea.
I want to have a holding tank and how can I convert my system, the holding tank's place in the engine room is empty to fit it.
I hope to hear from you soon.
Thanks in advance.

 

[Henry Boyd]

Melida,

That sounds strange. Can you take and post a couple photos of the engine area, particularly the starboard side? That will give us an idea of why there is tank and where things are located.

Henry

 

[melida]

Henry, sory for late answer
I'm gonna put the pictures at the weekend since I shoul go to marine to take photos.
the former owner of my boat is influenced to buy this option from the local dealer to take his more money.
This option is in the parts manual pdf on page 83 with the headline

VACUUM FLUSH HEAD W/ DIRECT OVER BOARD INTL.
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[Lazy Daze]

I don't know what size holding tank would have been used on your boat... Henry, is it 28 gallons?

http://www.sealandtechnology.com/productpages.asp?pid=35

You could buy this as an assembled piece and just drop it in. This is actually a pretty easy install. The hardest part would probably be running the lines for the pump-out (if you want that) and vent. But, even that is not hard.

Run the out hose from the vac to this tank. Re-route the thru-hull discharge up to this new pump (it's a T-pump, not a macerator... similar function, though). Move the 12v from your current macerator to the tank-mounted T-pump.

You could buy the tank w/o the T-pump and use your current macerator.

Henry, am I missing anything? All-in-all, it's a pretty straight forward thing to do. I took out both my vac set-up and my holding tank over the winter. It was much easier than I was anticipating.

 

[melida]

Thanks a lot Dennis,
This is the just what I need and normally standard in the 280.

 

[Lazy Daze]

No problem.

When you get to the boat, I'm interested to see those pics, too. If for no other reason than to see a 280DA with a diesel in it!:grin:

Boy, with a single engine and no holding tank, your engine bay must feel absolutely cavernous!

 

[melida]

youre right single engine no holding tank no genny and the water tank is above the fuel tank so there is only batteries on the left side

 

[Lazy Daze]

I had heard that the European models had a single berth on the stbd side of the engine, but I have never seen one. :lol::grin:

 

[Presentation]

youre right single engine no holding tank no genny and the water tank is above the fuel tank so there is only batteries on the left side

No water heater?

 

[techmitch]

"Volvo Penta KAD300 turbo diesel + kompressor + after cooled" Is that turbo and super charged? How many HP is that? Also, Looking foward to seeing some pics.

 

[Henry Boyd]

The holding tank is 28 gallons. Here are some pictures of our 280. First is the vacuum pump.

The black hose closest to the hull is from the head. The hose attached to the pump goes to the holding tank.

Next pic is the holding tank:

The hose from the pump goes to the white elbow on the top of the tank at the mid point. The black hose coming out of the forward end of the tank is for the pump out. But you could attach the macerator pump inlet to this point as well. You would also want to run this line up above the water line level before exiting the hull. You may also need to add a valve before the through hull if your boat is not equipped with a seacock.

The corrugated white hose and the smaller white hose wire tied together are from the water tank. The white hose closest to the hull is from the vent. The vent filter is behind all of the hoses on top of the tank. It is a removable charcoal filter in a piced of PVC about 50mm diameter x 300mm long.

Note there is a CE approval on the tank system.

Hope this gives you an idea of what to do.

Henry

 

[melida]

yes supercharged and turbo charged 285 HP and 525 NM torque. Beginning from 1500 rpm kompressor open and at 2500rpm give hand to turbo charger. Wlth C5 size prop planing at 3000 rpm but because of weight issue I use 2size smaller C3 props so cruises @3500rpm and wot 4000rpm.
Also there is water heater port end of eng room

 

[Henry Boyd]

"Volvo Penta KAD300 turbo diesel + kompressor + after cooled" Is that turbo and super charged? How many HP is that? Also, Looking foward to seeing some pics.

Kompressor = turbo charger

after cooled = intercooler

Superchargers are mechanical driven pumps for compressing intake air and sometimes fuel. Turbo chargers do the same but use waste exhaust gas to spin the turbine. The intercooler lowers the temperature of the compressed gas to improve the thermodynamic efficiency of the processes.

I thought these were mutually exclusive, or are you saying the supercharger works at lower rpm and the turbo at higher? That must do away with the turbo lag caused by the time between steping on the gas and the turbo spooling up to speed.

Henry

 

[melida]

Henry,
My engine has both kompressor(German name)=super charger and turbo charger seperatly. Kompressor is front right side of the engine and the turbo is at the rear right side between them there is the air intake (air filter). Beginning from 1500 rpm air goes to kompressor and when rev comes 2500 komp stops and air goes to turbo and then to the aftercooler and then the air goes to meet-with the fuel.

 

[melida]

Here are some old pics of my engine and and the port and sboard side of the engine room. There you can see the kompressor and turbo charger and the space where the holding tank would be and the bracket covered the vacuum generator is the place for the cockpit table.
All comments appreciated.

 

[Henry Boyd]

Melida,

I don't want to side track things with a discussion about the engine, do you mind if we table that for the moment and limit discussion to addition of holding tank? I do want to get back to it after we are done with this, ok?

First I have some questions about things I can't see from the pictures, or questions realted to what I did see.

First, it looks like your fresh water fill and and fuel fill are on the port side, is that correct? US boats have water fill and waste pump out on starboard, as well as the vents for holding tank and fuel tank (may not apply for diesel).

The picture below shows this arrangement:

.

I can't tell if the through hull fitting has a valve on it. In the US it would be required by USCG for safety and environmental reasons. I can't imagine that there isn't one there, but different countries, different rules. If there isn't a valve there, I would recommend adding one if you do all this work for safety reasons.

The Domitec SeaLand page that Dennis gave you in the above link also has a lot of information on the theoretical requirements for adding a holding tank system. SO I will just limit this post to pointing out the places on your Sea Ray that intersect with the generalities of the SeaLand installation instructions.

If you are going to add a holding tank you will need to add a pump to get the waste out of the tank. The existing vacumm pump will not do this. The good news is that it looks like your boat has all of the wiring in place. In the head do you have a key switch and faceplate that says 'tank level' (or similar words) on it? It should be mounted on the sink base side, closest to the toilet.

If you do not, you will need to buy this part as well as it is both the gauge for the holding tank level, as well as the actuator switch for the new pump. I am hoping that you will as this switch also acts as the on/off for the toilet and is pretty integrated into the wiring, so SR may have installed it anyway. If they haven't, the hard part, the wiring appears to be in place. In our owner's manual we have wiring diagrams. If you did not get this in your owner's package you can download the manuals from SR, failing that one of us here can scan and email them to you. I'll be happy to do it, although someone with a boat closer to yours in age might be a safer bet.

In your fourth picture of the open space there are two plugs hanging down. One is for the tank volume indicator, the other is for the new pump. The existing pumps are wired with an additional wire that runs to a switch mounted on the through hull valve. This switch is open when the valve is closed. This keeps the pump from being accidentally turned on when the valve is closed and plugging up the hose. You may want to keep the switch feature, although not necessarily try to rig it to the valve.

You are going to need to create an above waterline vent opening through hull. In the picture above it is the small white through hull on the starboard side, beside the metal fitting.

I do not know how prevalent dockside holding tank pump out facilities are in Turkey, but you are doing all of this work, and it will be the easiest to install it now then it ever will be. Since the deck fitting will have to match, or be compatible with local pump out systems I would suggest you do local research on what you need. If there is no local system in place I would suggest then using whatever is the most common in other EU jurisdictions.

While we are on the topic of plumbing, the hoses look like plain old green stripe industrial hosing. They are not. They are special stuff and you want to buy them! These hoses are made specifically for human waste disposal systems, and do not allow odor to permeate through the material. The same applies to the white vent hose.

Installation is pretty simple, put in the deck fittings and plumb the hoses. Add the head switch control, drop in the tank and plumb to the deck fittings, connect the wires to the switch and tank level. Connect a hose between vacuum pump and tank, and finally connect macerator (or T pump) to a hose running back to hull through fitting. Another safety point; this hose should be routed to pop up above the water line level and go through a special fitting before going to through hull. The fitting whose name escapes me at this point, prevents sea water from being siphoned back into the holding tank when the valve at the through hull is open.

One last thought, our plumbing is based on our safety regulations. For example double hose clamps. While you can use the pictures we have given you as a guide, make sure that you follow all of your local regulations with respect to hose sizes, chafe protection, clamping etc.

OK there are the broad strokes to this project. Let us know how it goes.

Henry

 

[melida]

Henry,
First of all great thanks to you both past and this thorough explanations.
Sorry for the engine story, shouldn't been in this topic.
As same as your boat water fiil is sboard side in mine but neighter I dont have holding tank nor the waste out near the water fiil there is place but. fuel fill is at the port side.
According to website Dennis gave me I contacted them via email and today the local dealer called me so at the weekend they'll come and inspect how the holding tank would mount and others.
I have the key in head but since I dont have holding tank it always shows "power" when I turn on and vacuum gen starts to pump. Also it turn more than power position like emtying the tank but bothing there. ıt has the indicator holding tank level full to empty position.
I'm gonna tell you what the local dealer recommends and get some new pictures both eng room and my boat's.
Thanks a lot.

 

[Henry Boyd]

Great,

Good news on the key being place as it will save money and additioanl install time. This sounds very much like a 'plug and play' upgrade.

Henry

 

[Lazy Daze]

Great,

Good news on the key being place as it will save money and additioanl install time. This sounds very much like a 'plug and play' upgrade.

Henry

My thoughts, too. These tanks are so easy to install - It's just a matter of making sure the (2) outboard screws are in the right place. Everything else is just some simple plumbing. With the room you have in your engine bay, it should be easy.

If it was me, I don't think I'd even hook up the tank level indicators (unless... they may be tucked in the wiring harness on the starboard hull side).

It sounds like your macerator is already controlled by the key (I'm not positive - I was a little confused by what you wrote). You might find that the mounting holes in your current macerator match up with the holes in the new tank. If not, it'd be easy enough to just screw a piece of wood or Starboard to the tank, then the macerator to the wood.

Or, just get the new tank assembly with the T-pump already installed. Either way would work. Unless I'm mistaken, macerators will self prime to at least 4'. When I replaced my holding tank over the winter, I really only needed the tank. But, the price on the whole "kit" wasn't that much more so I got the whole thing, already assembled.

I'm curious about that engine set-up, too, with the supercharger and turbo!

 

[Henry Boyd]

Dennis,

He doesn't have a macerator. The plumbing goes out of the vacuum pump on the tank directly into the drink. It sounds like Sea Ray installed the key switch and display in the head, and the wires, because not doing it would have been more expensive. So the tank you found fits the bill for him.

I've put a test light on the plug for the (not installed) macerator pump hanging over my holding tank and the key switch in the head will energize the circuit. So it stands to reason that the tank level indicators would work as well. I'm with you though that if the tank does not come with the indicator sending unit he'd be better off with out it in the long run.

Henry