Thoughts and opinionson a few things?

P

ProfitOfDoom

New Member
Jan 7, 2010
188
Eastlake,OH
Boat Info
1987 268 Sundancer
Engines
454 Mercruiser/Bravo Three
First off could someone tell me what a 26' sundancer would get on mileage with a 454 and bravo 3 setup with dual props? maybe 3 mpg?
Now for your thoughts,OK Ive been looking at boats for a couple of months now and seen some I liked but since its winter time here and snowing I thought I would have more time and no one will be buying but I called on a few I had my eye on and they are sold,so people are buying and im ready to make a move so I can get the off season price cut.
I have a question about engines and when they need to be rebuilt and whats to many hours?
Im down to these 2 boats 1 is a 1987 26' sundancer with a 454 merc/bravo 3 with dual props with trailer for 9k and the other is a 1984 26' sundancer 350 with alpha 1 and trailer for 10k.
I have yet to see either boat yet in person and before I lay out that kind of money it will be surveyed,but im just wondering what is the better deal.
The guy said the 1987 sundancer.he put the brand new 454/bravo 3 in 1999,and was unsure how many hours was on it,but he said around 800hrs. I know it will depend on how he took care of it,but how long do you think it will be till it needs a rebuild or I start getting problems from a engine that has been in a boat for 10yrs "I didnt ask if anything has been rebuilt or anything im just assuming it hasnt" I cant buy this and then need to have it rebuilt this year, But I like the idea of the 454 over the 350 in the 26' heavy sundancer.
Now the other boat is a 1984 and the guy said he had a new crate 350 engine installed and totally rebuilt the outdrive in 2007,so this engine and out drive has only seen 2 seasons as well as had the interior redone in 2007. Now I like the sound of the new engine 2 seasons is practically brand new,so im thinking I should have alot more time before a rebuild or mechanical breakdown seeing how it is newer. But on the other hand it is probally working harder then the 454 and maybe put through more stress kinda eveing them out somewhat,it's just my guess any truth to this?
So I guess if you had the option what would you go for in this choice,say there pretty much the same boats,can probally get either one of the boats for the same money. There pretty much the same boat besides the powerplants and the years of the boats are off by 3 years. Both have trailers,gps,radios etc "the 1984 has a windlass,the other doesnt" but pretty much the same,What would you go for?
 
Profit, this is a tough one. The older boat with the newer engine/drive is appealing. The other boat has the larger engine and the beefier drive, but 800 hours is approaching the twilight of the lifespan of a gas engines. The magic number for marine gas engines is 1000hrs. This will vary in either direction depending upon how well it was cared for and how it was used - trailered or in-water stored?? When you go and take a look, take note of the overall condition of each boat and try to get a sense of the attention to detail paid by both previous owners. If the boat is dirty and neglected, it may be safe to say the engine was as well. Ask for service records or question the owner about his maintenance rituals.

As for "mileage," I'd figure somewhere btwn 1.5-2.5mpg, but there are likely other responders who could give you actual numbers.

Good Luck!
 
Yea it is tough,right now im set on the one with the 454,as I read somewhere that a 26' sundancer is a fairly big heavy boat and a 350 has to run harder to make it to plane,and most people said it does a much better job powering the boat especially if you want to tow some tubs around on occasion,But I dont want to go broke on gas cruising around either.
Im concerned but not a deal breaker about the mileage,because I dont go far. My other boat I had every outing was less then 10 miles each time round trip,Its not like I travel a great distance,but would like to have a idea what to expect with a boat/powerplant like this if anyone has a idea from experience.
My other question is now a boat with a engine like this "454 merc" what happens when they get to many hours,do they break down,or just lose power or what? I imagine you just get a rebuild on it right,its not like you have to buy a new crate engine is it?
What would a engine rebuild cost on average?
 
I'll offer my experience here. I have run early '80's 260 dancers with 350's with alphas, 454's with alphas, 454 Mag EFI's with Alphas and Bravo III's, and 502Mag EFI's with Bravo III's. They get about 2.0 to 2.3 mpg in all configurations. This has been measured over a lot of hours and precise instrumentation. The Bravo III in its own right makes the boat perform better and definitely is more agile around the dock.

The 350 is not enough motor for the 260's in my opinion. You will have to run it very hard to achieve a reasonable cruise speed (think 3800 rpm plus).

The '87 and the '84 are different boats. The '84 has a faster, deeper deadrise hull (23 degrees), but is more tender and prone to porpoising.

The '87 is actually a 268 (if it has a seperate dinette, or a 250 if it does not). The'268 is 5 inches longer, and 6 inches wider than the '84 260.

I was very happy with my '83 260 (see below) after the repower, but would go with the 268 over the 260 in your case as long as the motor checks out.
DSC01329-1.jpg


DSC01348.jpg
 
Thanks for the info,and yea it is a 268. Very sharp dash area,was that custom or did you redo or what?,,Im in love with that :)
I dont have alot of experience with boats only owned 1 "a 1972 20.5 penn yan" and I could handle it will docking by myself,,should I have any trouble with this 268? Or do you think im biting off more then I can chew?
So if all is true and there are 800ish hours and it was maintained well through the years,and survey comes out good with good compression and all,I should be safe for at least a couple of seasons before I need a rebuild right?
 
probably a silly question,but I cant really find nothing on it "im sure because I dont have the proper name for it" But the boat I like comes with this spoiler thing that is around the center of the boat,but it looks like its facing the wrong way "im sure it is correct,as I seen pics of other boats like this" But what are these called and what are there purpose?
 
Mr. Doom,
Radar Arch....looks cool....good spot to mount peripherals. That is too much boat for a 350 in my opinion. 800 engine hrs would not scare me if:
1 -good maintenance records are available
2 - freshwater boat
3 - compression check is good
4 - risers and manifolds are good
5- Boat and bilge are clean ( at least some indication that current owner gives a crap about proper maintenance)

Freshwater motors can go thousands of hours if treated right.
 
Profit - you are NOT biting off more than you can chew. You will be able to handle this boat even if you NEVER handled a boat before as long as you care enough to learn. The people who are dangerous with any boat are the ones who drive it around like it's a car and don't learn the nuances of seamanship and boat maneuvering.

The rule of thumb you will hear very often is that if you need to consider whether an engine is powerful enough, it probably isn't. You can't go TOO big, but you could certainly go too small.

The beauty of either of these engines are that parts are and will continue to be readily available. Cylinder heads and blocks are easy to locate and cheap. You wouldn't necessaryily need a crate engine. The peripherals (manifolds, elbows, water pump, alternator, etc. ) can be recycled from your current engine if they are in good condx. Go to websites like DougRussell and see what long blocks go for.

I'd maybe be more concerned abt 10+ yo B3 drive. If the boat was trailered and used in fresh water (if it's up by you in Ohio, it's a fresh water boat), and as such, didn't sit in water all season long, there's a great liklihood that it's in good shape. B3s are much more expensive to replace and rebuild than Alpha 1s. Again, check sites like Doug Russell for prices. The b3 drive is a better drive for handling around the dock and at slow speeds. The boat will track much better in forward and reverse. Corrosion issues are pretty exaggerated but with trailer and fresh water use, probably not a consideration for you.
 
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Thank you for the comforting news :)
I just got off phone with the guy,he says it is docked all season at there yacht club. He said him and his wife only used it on weekends,and did most of there time on it at the dock or in the club. He said there was a misunderstanding on the hours,he was talking about the meter from the old engine "or something" but he says this engine/outdrive has around 300 no more then 400hrs. So everything looks good on the boat and might go see it today to see if its to my liking.
This is a 1987 268 sundancer,,this year boat was made good,like good hull construction and everything? Anything to look for when viewing this boat in particular?
 
Well I went today to have a look,I know I wanted to take pics,but forgot the damn camera :(
Well the boat looked very clean inside and out. Today was just a visual to see if I liked it,I thought it was a nice impressive boat and could be enjoyed by our family. The floors were nice solid and clean,no cracks or did I feel any weak spots. I try to move the out drive back and forth almost zero play. No wet spots or stains showing signs of leaking. Only thing I guess you could fuss about is that some of the teak wood such as some rails could have used some refinishing,other then that it was in pretty good shape for its age. He said he is a auto mechanic and keeps up on his boat,goes over and above on what needs to be done and done so ever since he owned the boat. He says he changes the oil in engine and outdrive at the end of the season and before the season starts he changes it again.
He says the boat does not take any water while at the dock and everything is in perfect running condition.
The bottom paint looked pretty clean and some what fresh. comes with mooring,camper and bimimi top,older but still fuctionable gps/fishfinder,new ship to shore,new cd player,flat pannel tv with a dvd in the closet area,fridge,stove,sink all work,Nothing smelled like mildew over all everything was in working order and great shape.
The trailer is a home built and says a local built it for a few guys taylor made to these exact boats,Looked heavy duty and functional,so I guess thats all good?
He did scare when he was talking about the props,it has dual props on the bravo 3,these are stainless steel and said that will run about 2k if I ever fouled them on a rock or what not :wow:
Also not sure what this is,if someone could explain more about this? He said the 454 was cool fuel,and he said something like the impeller wasnt in the outdrive but somewhere else,I kinda dont remeber what else was said,but could someone explain if this is better for maintence or performace,more cooling?
Over all I liked the boat,but I have to say the boat was BIG,I never operated a boat that big and it was very intimidating. Think this is just a newbie shock factor thing and I'll get the hang of it after a few times out?
I know I have a bunch of questions in here but here is one more. Now this guy docks near me,and belongs to a yacht club where he is on the board of something "im not sure how yacht clubs work so please forgive my ignorance" but he is a captain,commodore something of that nature and I also know another member of his same club personally who is also a higher end member and the seller says he knows him. He said yea he knows me well and knows how anal I am about my craft,that im always making sure it is perfect order,etc.
Now if I contact my friend and all checks out on what he said,As I already seen the boat and it did look like it was maintained well. Should I save the almost $500 and put that in a savings for my own future repairs/maintence rather then get a survey or survey for sure no matter?
Oh yea I forgot one last question,What is the weight of a 1987 268?
Thanks
 
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Sounds pretty good. As for weight of this boat, check the link I sent you above. It says around 5300lbs but that isn't necessarily correct. You can write to SR if you really need to know or maybe someone knows off hand. IF this is your boat, then this is probably reliable...

http://www.searay.com/boat_graphics/electronic_brochure/company1729/1C1_27_74DERNKGJ526.pdf

Bravo 3s have the raw water pump mounted on the engine. Alpha ones (the older ones) had a small impeller buried inside the outdrive - hard to get to. B3 is a better design.

B3 props are counter rotating dual props. Yes very expensive. Just don't hit anything and you'll be OK.

As for a survey, that's up to you. Your insurance MAY require one on an older boat. Not sure.
 
I see sets of used B3 props in good condition for sale around $600-$750 all the time. Watch the papers, craigslist, and the bulletin board at the prop shop.

Here is an example.

I wouldn't let the cost of the props worry you. They're stainless steel so they will stand up to a little mud slicing (DAMHIKT), just stay off the rocks.
 
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