The great speaker debate

[ghatzie]

Hello fellow Sea Ray-ers! Long time lurker first time poster. Clubsearay has been a tremendous source for info so just want to post regarding my experience with speakers/stereo equipment. (Please keep in mind this is my opinion / experience, thats all.)

Theres a ton of posts all over the internet on speakers (JL vs wet sounds vs ... you name it). I did a ton of research before upgrading my stereo and going back and forth on what stereo equipment to install, particularly the speakers. For me it pretty much came down to JL's M6's vs Wet Sounds Revo8's. So eventually I decided to go with the JLs, now came another monumental decision, what size??

So I ended up going with a pair of the M6 770's plus 1 M6 10" subwoofer, a wet sounds SYN-DX6 amp and a Fusion 670 radio. I only bought 1 pair of the 770s as I figured once I installed them id evaluate then decide what I wanted to do with the other pair.

So I got everything wired up, pulled additional cable for the LED's mounted the 770s in the arch and this system rocks! It really sounds amazing and to be honest im either going to wait a little while or forego the 2nd pair of speakers all together. The 2 770s in the arch plus the 1 10" sub sound phenomenal and not sure I even need the second pair of speakers (I probably will eventually, im a nut like that).

So in conclusion, I would HIGHLY recommend this setup to anyone looking for a system upgrade and (I have no experience with the Revo's, im sure theyre also incredible), but would highly recommend spending the extra $$ on the JL's; definitely not a purchase I will ever look back and question if it was worth saving a few hundred bucks. The amp pushes plenty and im very impressed with the Fusion 670 radio, nice little unit, very good sound.

 

[Kwik]

We have 4 JL mid and a JL 12 sub above and 2 JL mid in the cabin on our 240DA. It doesn't sound like those $150k wakeboats that go by. But, it sounds pretty damn awesome sitting in the captains chair. I do need to upgrade the head unit to a fusion. Not sure why PO spent all the money on JL speakers and amp and left a non-marine Alpine to run it all.

 

[ghatzie]

We have 4 JL mid and a JL 12 sub above and 2 JL mid in the cabin on our 240DA. It doesn't sound like those $150k wakeboats that go by. But, it sounds pretty damn awesome sitting in the captains chair. I do need to upgrade the head unit to a fusion. Not sure why PO spent all the money on JL speakers and amp and left a non-marine Alpine to run it all.

Definitely, if theres one thing ive learned over the years its that you can have the most amazing amp and speaker system but if you feed it a crap signal it will never sound good.

So a word there... I was originally going to replace with another modern Clarion unit (M508 I think), because it would have slid right in in place of the older stock unit. Then I started looking at pre-amp specs; the Fusion had a strong 5.5 volt pre-amp output which is what made me ultimately go with that unit and im glad I did, it sounds very very good feeding the wet sounds amp

 

[JimT]

Totally agree that the quality of the signal into the amp will make or break the system. A simple solution is to add a DSP to clean up the signal.

 

[MonacoMike]

Totally agree that the quality of the signal into the amp will make or break the system. A simple solution is to add a DSP to clean up the signal.

My understanding is most Clarion head units put on boats do deliver good signal to the amp. Mine is from 2007

 

[Kwik]

Hoping for a little insight myself. I have all these speakers and a crap head unit. I also have myself installed a Raymarine Axiom-9 and the sirius weather and audio receiver that is connected to the MFD. I currently have a RCA to 3.5mm cable from the MFD to the head unit. Right now, that cable runs across the cabin door into the cabin. Ugly and in the way. End goal is to change the head unit to fusion and connect on NMEA 2000 to the MFD. Finally my questions. Do I still need the audio cable from the MFD after I CAN-BUS the head unit or is the audio transmitted across the CAN_ BUS? Does my head unit need to be Sirius ready or can it be a dumb receiver because the MFD and Sirius module are the true satellite receivers?

 

[Cocktail Time]

Fusion is NMEA 2000 capable so you can connect the head unit to the mfd from the NMEA backbone. They also have wireless waterproof remotes that don't require any wire. As for the sirius xm question, that is a module that plugs into the fusion radio or you can use your subscription to stream from your phone via the sirius xm app. The fusion phone app alone is a reason to switch to a fusion head unit. You can control just about every function on the radio from your phone.

 

[ghatzie]

Totally agree that the quality of the signal into the amp will make or break the system. A simple solution is to add a DSP to clean up the signal.

Totally agree with JimT, in general im a big fan of using an proper DSP, I have a $900 unit in my truck with Dirac Live and a similar unit for my home stereo, but in this case why use another piece of (expensive) equipment if not needed? I think the Clarion gives a 4V peak to peak preamp output, I think the Fusion 670 gives 5.5V out. Also the wireless remotes are a huge plus, im using one that I just stuck over the clarion one on the cockpit, wireless, simple, nothing to install or wires to pull.

So this thread started off to say how impressed I was with the JL speakers but I have to say that im very happy with the choice of the Fusion 670 head unit as well; it sounds great right out of the box, no tuning necessary!

 

[JimT]

Totally agree with JimT, in general im a big fan of using an proper DSP, I have a $900 unit in my truck with Dirac Live and a similar unit for my home stereo, but in this case why use another piece of (expensive) equipment if not needed? I think the Clarion gives a 4V peak to peak preamp output, I think the Fusion 670 gives 5.5V out. Also the wireless remotes are a huge plus, im using one that I just stuck over the clarion one on the cockpit, wireless, simple, nothing to install or wires to pull.

So this thread started off to say how impressed I was with the JL speakers but I have to say that im very happy with the choice of the Fusion 670 head unit as well; it sounds great right out of the box, no tuning necessary!

When I first started assembling my sound system I stuck with the Clarion HU and added an Audiocontrol EQS preamp which is an equalizer and line driver that increases the signal to 9.5v. Last year something fried the Clarion so I replaced it with a Fusion RA-70NSX. This unit does not have a DSP which the 670 does. If I was starting over I would probably go with the 670 and skip the EQS. I build sound systems in stages and sometimes its not the most cost effective way to do it.

I currently run:

-Fusion 70NSX
-Audiocontrol EQS Preamp
-Two JL 600/6 amps
-One JL 500/3 amp
-12 JL M770 speakers
-2 JL 10" subs

I have run out of room to add more speakers so I am done. Very happy with the sound. I can rock the lake or listen to it at moderate volume where the clarity is amazing for a boat.

JL builds great equipment. The components are sized to go together in terms of power output and input. Easy to put together a system where the speakers are adequately powered but not on the edge of blowing up.

 

[Kwik]

Sorry I hijacked your thread ghatzie. I bit the bullet and ordered the Fusion 70NSX and all the can-bus cabling to run to my MFD and Sirius weather receiver. I got the remote control for the transom like Cocktail time suggested. Hope I don't regret saving the money by going 70 instead of the 670. Boat already sounded damn good in the raft-up this weekend compared to the many of the other boats just because of the JL's. It was louder and more clear than a boat with 10 speakers a few boats down from me. Fingers crossed

 

[spikedaddy99]

To hijack here, I have Clarion head unit on bridge with new Fusion amp and original Clarion speakers. These are the "front" setting to my fade. Great sound. My "rear" speakers are 2 Clarion in the cockpit and I believe are not attached to an amp, just straight output from the HU. I have a "ticking"in these speakers. Is there a way to cancel this "ticking"? Even when muted, I still can hear the "ticking" (Reminds me to turn off the HU when we are done though)

 

[Kwik]

To hijack here, I have Clarion head unit on bridge with new Fusion amp and original Clarion speakers. These are the "front" setting to my fade. Great sound. My "rear" speakers are 2 Clarion in the cockpit and I believe are not attached to an amp, just straight output from the HU. I have a "ticking"in these speakers. Is there a way to cancel this "ticking"? Even when muted, I still can hear the "ticking" (Reminds me to turn off the HU when we are done though)

I get this out of the Alpine currently installed. But, it is on amplified speakers. I was hoping this was a problem with the head unit. I will update if it persists with the Fusion head unit installed. The speakers leads are likely run parallel with something else that is inducing the noise on the line. May have to add a filter to the speaker lines to eliminate it.

 

[ghatzie]

I currently run:

-Fusion 70NSX
-Audiocontrol EQS Preamp
-Two JL 600/6 amps
-One JL 500/3 amp
-12 JL M770 speakers
-2 JL 10" subs

Holy crap. JimT sir, my hat goes off to you, thats one hell of a system!!

 

[b_arrington]

You all are clearly building impressive sound systems. Perhaps keep in mind as you're using them that not everyone else on the water shares your taste in music, or even wants music on their boat at all. Boats are open with nothing to contain the sound. Sound travels far on the water and it's pretty easy to inundate other boats with your tunes.

My family goes boating for quite relaxation time. I purposely picked a mooring on the edge of the field away from other boats in the quiet side of the harbor. The extent of my radio time is an occasional baseball game. Few things are more irritating than when some other boater comes in, picks up a mooring next to me (that isn't theirs) and cranks up Pink Houses. We all enjoy boating a little differently; please be considerate of your fellow boaters as you enjoy your boating time.

 

[ghatzie]

You all are clearly building impressive sound systems. Perhaps keep in mind as you're using them that not everyone else on the water shares your taste in music, or even wants music on their boat at all. Boats are open with nothing to contain the sound. Sound travels far on the water and it's pretty easy to inundate other boats with your tunes.

My family goes boating for quite relaxation time. I purposely picked a mooring on the edge of the field away from other boats in the quiet side of the harbor. The extent of my radio time is an occasional baseball game. Few things are more irritating than when some other boater comes in, picks up a mooring next to me (that isn't theirs) and cranks up Pink Houses. We all enjoy boating a little differently; please be considerate of your fellow boaters as you enjoy your boating time.

Well b_arrington, with everything in life one needs to be considerate of others and be conscious of those around them. Its actually quite frequent that when parked at the marina and drinking with my neighbors they will ask me to play some tunes but obviously we keep the volume in check depending on which boats in the vicinity are hanging out and the time of night etc.

I think a common misconception though is that the goal of a good stereo system is to be loud. In my opinion this is absolutely not the case and once can be just as loud and obnoxious with a cheap stereo system. In my personal opinion is that in circumstances where it is appropriate to rock out (we pretty much only crank it when were out anchored in a cove where everyone is partying to begin with) the high end system sounds clear and full and reproduces the music in a way that is pleasing to the ears, not with extra high end or not enough bottom end. I think that this is an important point that its the quality of the audio reproduction not sheer volume that were after.

 

[JimG]

Well, I just bit the bullet and ordered the Fusion MS-RA670 and a pair of Wet Sound Revo6 speakers. Gonna start with that and see how it sounds... add to it if needed.

I already have a 10" Boss Audio sub w/Boss 1500W mono amp, and the OEM 4 channel amp.

 

[spikedaddy99]

"I think a common misconception though is that the goal of a good stereo system is to be loud. In my opinion this is absolutely not the case and once can be just as loud and obnoxious with a cheap stereo system. In my personal opinion is that in circumstances where it is appropriate to rock out (we pretty much only crank it when were out anchored in a cove where everyone is partying to begin with) the high end system sounds clear and full and reproduces the music in a way that is pleasing to the ears, not with extra high end or not enough bottom end. I think that this is an important point that its the quality of the audio reproduction not sheer volume that were after."


This. We were the only ones anchored out last Saturday for about an hour. As people showed up and we rafted 6 boats, we all decided to play 1 radio station instead of my kids playlists (older folks don't care for kids music). Quality of sound vs. loudness (and I have 2 subs in my truck so I don't mind loud)

 

[Kwik]

"I think a common misconception though is that the goal of a good stereo system is to be loud. In my opinion this is absolutely not the case and once can be just as loud and obnoxious with a cheap stereo system. In my personal opinion is that in circumstances where it is appropriate to rock out (we pretty much only crank it when were out anchored in a cove where everyone is partying to begin with) the high end system sounds clear and full and reproduces the music in a way that is pleasing to the ears, not with extra high end or not enough bottom end. I think that this is an important point that its the quality of the audio reproduction not sheer volume that were after."


This. We were the only ones anchored out last Saturday for about an hour. As people showed up and we rafted 6 boats, we all decided to play 1 radio station instead of my kids playlists (older folks don't care for kids music). Quality of sound vs. loudness (and I have 2 subs in my truck so I don't mind loud)

Agreed. We tend to raft up with 4 other boats. We all agree with basically the same music. We all tend to turn in about the same time and morning is not blaring music time. If someone comes in to our area playing different music, I usually shut mine off and let them run their batteries down. I can listen to just about anything other than the so called "new country" and gangster rap.

During the major raft-up last weekend, one fella had a FM transmitter playing dance music and hip hop with some rock thrown in and all 250 boats tuned to his channel. I was like a concert! Good times.

 

[Kwik]

OK. Bit of an update. I got the Fusion and NMEA2000 cable installed. Bad news: You still need the RCA output from the Sirius SR200 to the head unit for audio. The audio is not conveyed through the canbus. So, I have ordered a 50ft RCA cable to run through the boat next. Good news: The radio controls popped right up on my Axiom-9 as soon as the NMEA cable was live. Audio sounds great and I am not noticing any popping or hiss, now. Got the wireless remote mounted to the transom and tested. Phone went dead before I had a chance to bluetooth it the the head unit and try out Fusion-Link. Putting the boat on the water tonight. Have the RCAs running through the cabin door for a couple more days.

 

[JimG]

Yep, CANBUS does not have near the bandwidth for audio... data only.