Survey - what are the rules ?

Blueone

Blueone

Well-Known Member
SILVER Sponsor
Jan 24, 2007
13,840
Lake Erie, Ohio
Boat Info
2004 420 Sundancer
Engines
Cummins 6CTA 450's
So when buying or selling. How much is the buyer on the hook for and how much is the seller responsible for ?

My buyer is leaning towards buying a brand new boat that’s 20 years old. The things he wants replaced are things that haven't been a concern for me for 8 years.

Part of the problem is he bought it at a premium price from the broker and no where near the price I’m getting. So I can see he might expect above and beyond…. But I don’t…. I’m getting substantially less and I told broker this is the price I want.

I don’t want this to be a broker conversation

I’m just curious when should I push back in general

Batteries ?
Hoses?
That kind of stuff
 
My general opinion is that all systems should work as intended. If the batteries are dead then it's on you to replace them but if they are just a few years old and the buyer wants new then he should pay for them. If the hoses are cracked or leaking then that should be on the seller and not the buyer, but if he wants them changed because they are 20YO then it's on him.
Cosmetics should fall upon the buyer unless its structural or makes the boat less sound for operation.
 
I'm sure you'll get varying opinions on this. But this is a negotiation. Whenever I'm negotiating, I weigh the duress I may or may not be under, my best guess as to how easy it would be to find a replacement (product or buyer), what I really feel is fair, etc.

I would buy a used boat in even the best of condition assuming it would have a list of things that would need to be addressed. I would make an offer with that expectation. Further, I would not need a survey to tell me about batteries, hoses, etc. I am terrified for any would-be owner that would need a surveyor to explain to them the condition of those things.

To me (buying or selling), the price of the boat would not usually change from the survey unless unexpected or unusual problems were discovered like a cylinder with low compression, moisture in the deck, bad oil analysis, etc. If I were selling and those things were discovered by a surveyor, I would negotiate to keep the deal. If I were buying, I would likely just walk.
 
To me it's major system type issues. Say more than $2000+ to fix. If it's just normal wear and tear on a 20 year old boat, nah. Also would depend on if it's obvious at first site or actually needs a surveyor to find. Of course depends how desperate you want to sell it. If there is room between you and the broker, maybe he can pick up the cost.
 
If the items the buyer is asking for are in serviceable condition, then I would push back. For example:

Replacing things like this, I would say no.
Batters 5yrs old, but still work.
Hoses are original, but serviceable.
Canvas/upholstery showing use, but no holes, tears.
Cosmetics - should be in good condition age accepted.
Electronics older, but again still work.

It's a fine line because you want to sell the boat, but from the buyers side you can't blame them for asking. You just have to negotiate -- he is buying a 20yr old boat. If he wants new and perfect, that's called a new boat (although we know even a new boat is not perfect).
I don't know if you can do this with a broker involved, but you might work the deal out better by talking directly with the buyer - that way things don't get lost in translation. Nobody can talk about your boat better than you!
 
Blueone said:
So when buying or selling. How much is the buyer on the hook for and how much is the seller responsible for ?

My buyer is leaning towards buying a brand new boat that’s 20 years old. The things he wants replaced are things that haven't been a concern for me for 8 years.

Part of the problem is he bought it at a premium price from the broker and no where near the price I’m getting. So I can see he might expect above and beyond…. But I don’t…. I’m getting substantially less and I told broker this is the price I want.

I don’t want this to be a broker conversation

I’m just curious when should I push back in general

Batteries ?
Hoses?
That kind of stuff
Click to expand...
I am confused by this statement. Sounds like the broker established a price over and above what you are asking?
 
Blue, it's simple. If it's a big item on the survey or is operational, then you should replace. But if cosmetic then it's on him.

The cosmetic things come down to what are you willing to do and how much. That only you can answer.
 
I agree with everyone else. The boat is 20 years old, there are going to minor issues. As long as all major components are functioning and there are no structural issues, the seller can upgrade as he sees fit. He's buying a used boat, not a brand new boat with a warranty, his purchase price reflects that.
 
I tend to agree with the sentiments above.
I'm assuming you aren't selling at a fire sale price.
Major mechanical, either on you to fix or negotiate in.
Cosmetics, way more on the buyer than you, subject to your eagerness to sell.
Also, don't feel bad about asking your broker to reduce his commission to get the deal done.
 
FootballFan said:
I am confused by this statement. Sounds like the broker established a price over and above what you are asking?
Click to expand...
Yes I told him a price I wanted. He went over and sold it… he makes a very good commission and I get what I wanted
 
Blueone said:
Yes I told him a price I wanted. He went over and sold it… he makes a very good commission and I get what I wanted
Click to expand...

I agree with the above poster, its up to the broker to take care of the issues.

I would have a problem with the broker listing the price different than what we agreed. The higher price may limit the offers received.
 
Just for clarification, the broker selling over the price you wanted... Are you getting the additional amount minus commission?
 
Hang on…. Slow down you guys. I didn’t want the topic to be about my survey. I was just curious if there is a set of expectations as to who is responsible for what?…. I talked to one guy that said as is where is and here is the price when selling privately…. One approach

You get bigger boats where a broker is involved with a 5% commission…. He stands to make a pretty good profit for very little effort if there is very little effort.

When you sell you now have 3 people involved. So is it just negotiating?…. Should the broker have anything in the game?….. or is this just a free for all?

I was just looking for expectations that you would expect from each party
 
FootballFan said:
I agree with the above poster, its up to the broker to take care of the issues.

I would have a problem with the broker listing the price different than what we agreed. The higher price may limit the offers received.
Click to expand...
Ya but if there is a leaking injector is that still the broker ?
 
Blueone said:
Hang on…. Slow down you guys. I didn’t want the topic to be about my survey. I was just curious if there is a set of expectations as to who is responsible for what?…. I talked to one guy that said as is where is and here is the price when selling privately…. One approach

You get bigger boats where a broker is involved with a 5% commission…. He stands to make a pretty good profit for very little effort if there is very little effort.

When you sell you now have 3 people involved. So is it just negotiating?…. Should the broker have anything in the game?….. or is this just a free for all?

I was just looking for expectations that you would expect from each party
Click to expand...

I was just asking because if the broker is pocketing all of the money above your price, then the broker should be pulled into this negotiation. If the broker is only making a commission on the amount, I believe it is just between you and the buyer.

As I said, my opinion is any normal wear issues that could (or should) be seen or known before the survey should have already been reflected in the offer price. Ultimately,... it will be whatever you and the buyer agree on.
 
So next question….. if a fan belt or engine hose looks like it may break because the engine surveyor said so or the boat surveyor said the sanitation hoses should be changed…. They are not broke but they could break by expert opinion.

who’s responsible?

Do you see what I mean?…. It’s very subjective
 
So I did not use a broker and this may not help much, but when I bought my 340, I wanted a few things fixed. One item we discussed was really a deferred maintenance item (Manifolds never changed). The buyer pushed back on that. The surveyor found cracks in the fuel line fittings and noted my insurance company would have issue with me driving the boat home in this condition. I pushed the seller to fix this and he did.

Now the crappy part, the batteries were dead and he only replaced three of the four to complete the sale. He stated the fourth tested good.

Everything else on the list was generally wear and tear so I bought it knowing this.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Forum statistics

Threads
113,199
Messages
1,428,407
Members
61,107
Latest member
Hoffa509
Back
Top