Spare Tides seal installed backwards

[streaga51]

I just went to replace my leaking seal on my port shaft. When I opened the carrier seal, I found that the seal was installed backwards on the shaft. So then I checked the starboard seal, and that was also on backwards. Now I'm wondering if this is Searay issue since these spare seals were installed at the factory. Has anyone else heard of this happening? Now I'm looking at a $5000 repair to pull the shafts and one engine to get at the shaft seals. :smt013

2002 310 V-drives

 

[FireIsland1]

A mistake like this could easily happen. it might have been the same employee that has to think twice when taking out a bolt. The seal lips should be facing the prop side of the shaft. If that's not the case yup there backwards. the solution is haul, remove props, pull shaft from trans coupler, slide shaft back about 1', swap out seals. This should no way be 5,000 unless the engines are comming out. I just did this job on my boat It took about 5 hrs both sides, but i have a bit more room to work. You have to figure you would want to replace the spares anyway so all is not waisted. I actually put on 2 new spares each shaft so i don't have to do it again for the next 10 years.

 

[tobnpr]

Ouch...
You have to pull an engine to get to the shaft seals???

 

[fwebster]

This should be a haul out and 2 men for an hour, maybe 1.5 hours...............whoever quoted you $5K saw you coming and you need to find another boat yard.

 

[Jimmy Buoy]

If space is that tight that you cannot get at the seals without pulling one engine, I'd suggest changing both seals from Tides to PSS. It is a superior product that will outlast Tides many time over. With the expense to gain access being so high, you may want to investigate PSS vs Tides.

 

[fwebster]

If the space under the engine is so tight that you need to pull an engine to reverse the seals, just throw the extra seals away. There is no way you will cut out the old seal and press in the new one.

 

[streaga51]

This should be a haul out and 2 men for an hour, maybe 1.5 hours...............whoever quoted you $5K saw you coming and you need to find another boat yard.

I here you but have you looked at the room between the engines on a 310. I'm only 5'2" and it was a tight fit for me.

 

[fwebster]

The lip seal goes in just like the seal on a wheel bearing. YOu must have enough access to hammer/press the new seal in straight in. I have extras on my boat and tried to change them one time......what a royal pain in the a$$. I don't mess with them anymore since seal replacement is never an emergency.

The other thing I've learned after several years of doing this is that if your lip seal is leaking, it is most likely because the entire Tides seal body has ingested enough dirt, sand an grit that it is worn and wobbles too much to hold the lip seal centered. When mine leak, I replace the whole seal, not just the lip seal.

 

[streaga51]

I found a boat yard that will pull both shafts, replace seals and short haul for $2000.00. It's about a 15min. ride to the marina with water spewing from the seal. I might try to make a shroud to put over the seal assy. to cut down on the salt water
spraying up under the engine. For a $3K savings I think it's worth a shot.

 

[La Maddalena]

I just watched the video about Stay Afloat (after reading Two Peas' post about his recent upgrades).
http://www.stayafloatmarine.com/

Can you use some of this product to control the leaking and spraying water while you move the boat?

 

[tobnpr]

I found a boat yard that will pull both shafts, replace seals and short haul for $2000.00. It's about a 15min. ride to the marina with water spewing from the seal. I might try to make a shroud to put over the seal assy. to cut down on the salt water
spraying up under the engine. For a $3K savings I think it's worth a shot.

Ouch... that's like two full days of labor for a mechanic. You said they have to pull one of the engines tho? That'll require re-alignment (might as well do both engines).

I don't understand why they need to pull the shafts? Do they think one or both of them is scored or somehow bad? Seals are done with the shafts in the boat (obviously)...

Be sure to check your cutlass bearings. If they're original they may be due, or close to it. If they do pull the shafts, you'd want to take advantage of that while you've got everything apart. Ditto with your rudder packing...much easier- and cheaper- to deal with all that "stuff" now while you're there.

 

[streaga51]

I just watched the video about Stay Afloat (after reading Two Peas' post about his recent upgrades).
http://www.stayafloatmarine.com/

Can you use some of this product to control the leaking and spraying water while you move the boat?

Looks like great stuff. I don't know how it will work with the shaft rotating but I what to get some to have on the boat.
Thanks for the info.

 

[streaga51]

Ouch... that's like two full days of labor for a mechanic. You said they have to pull one of the engines tho? That'll require re-alignment (might as well do both engines).

I don't understand why they need to pull the shafts? Do they think one or both of them is scored or somehow bad? Seals are done with the shafts in the boat (obviously)...

Be sure to check your cutlass bearings. If they're original they may be due, or close to it. If they do pull the shafts, you'd want to take advantage of that while you've got everything apart. Ditto with your rudder packing...much easier- and cheaper- to deal with all that "stuff" now while you're there.

For $2K their not pulling the engines. The reason the shafts need to come out is because some moron at the Sea Ray factory put the spare seals that ride on the shafts backwards.

 

[go-hokies]

For $2K their not pulling the engines. The reason the shafts need to come out is because some moron at the Sea Ray factory put the spare seals that ride on the shafts backwards.

Just went thru this last year... not because they were on backwards, was replacing a V5000 tranny...
Here is a summary of the process
-Remove Props
- remove V drive coupling (we had to make a special puller as there is no room)
- clean shafts
- pull back shaft so that end clears the v Drive housing....

....PULL ONE ENGINE / TRANNY because...

On the 310 with 350's I do not see how it will be possible to change both seals without pulling at least one engine. It is way way way tight in there, and when you are danglling upside down, contorted, etc, there is no way even a small dude, can get the seal pressed in square... I could not figure a way to do this without pulling one engine / tranny.

I would like to know if they do get it done with out pulling at least one engine.. ( Once one is pulled, you can get down there and work... So 2 grand is not out of the question.

I paid about $600 for haul out and use of the travel lift to pull engine and re-install engine ( 1 hour total)... all of the other connecting / disconnecting I did myself with a buddy of mine so we saved a ton...

Mike

 

[tobnpr]

For $2K their not pulling the engines. The reason the shafts need to come out is because some moron at the Sea Ray factory put the spare seals that ride on the shafts backwards.

To remove the spare seal carriers, the shafts only need to be slid back enough to get the necessary clearance to slide them off. Removing the shafts would not serve any purpose that I can see. As mentioned above, removal requires cleaning all the antifouling off the shaft so that it'll slide through the bearing.

 

[streaga51]

Ouch... that's like two full days of labor for a mechanic. You said they have to pull one of the engines tho? That'll require re-alignment (might as well do both engines).

I don't understand why they need to pull the shafts? Do they think one or both of them is scored or somehow bad? Seals are done with the shafts in the boat (obviously)...

Be sure to check your cutlass bearings. If they're original they may be due, or close to it. If they do pull the shafts, you'd want to take advantage of that while you've got everything apart. Ditto with your rudder packing...much easier- and cheaper- to deal with all that "stuff" now while you're there.

You have to pull the shaft back at least enough to expose the end of the shaft. How would you get a round seal on the shaft.

 

[fwebster]

Tides make a seal protector that slides into the seal so you can then place the seal over the end of the shaft without cutting the new seal. It is very difficult to install a new seal without damage if you don't use the seal protector.

 

[douglee25]

I wish more companies offered those seal protectors or a tool to help with seal installation.

When I did a clutch change on my BMW M3, I decided to do a rear main seal change while I was in there. BMW included the seal protector to aid in seal installation. In fact, I don't think there was any other way to install it without one because the spring on the seal lip was so stiff.

Doug

 

[streaga51]

Tides make a seal protector that slides into the seal so you can then place the seal over the end of the shaft without cutting the new seal. It is very difficult to install a new seal without damage if you don't use the seal protector.

Frank, thanks for reminding me about the seal protector. I remember seeing it on the Tides site.