Sluggish Steering

S

Searaybio270

Active Member
Jul 8, 2010
1,058
Bush River on the Cheasapeake Bay
Boat Info
1996 EC, Garmin 3210, Dinghy - Seadoo Jet boat with twin 85 horse. Fun and Fast.
Engines
7.4 MC 360 HP each
Westerbeke 7KW
I have noticed that when making turns or trying to dodge crab pots that the turns are very sluggish/slow in their response. My friend has a 2008/38DA and it is very responsive.
So, Any ideas of things to check and where? I am somewhat at a lose as to where to look.
Thanks,
 
I had a similar problem. It turned out to be air in the hydraulic steering system. Provided that you have the same set-up (This may or may not be the case) there is a little thumbscrew on the top of the steering column just fwd of the wheel. Unscrew it and see if there is HYDRAULIC fluid visible. The fluid is a clear type, I believe Seastar is the correct name, but NOT power steering fluid. I use a little funnel and top off the reservoir. Then move the wheel back and forth several times and you will feel it give a little more resistance as the fluid fills up the line.
This is what I use:

$(KGrHqIOKokE32mz93cbBOFnGjkIDw~~_1.JPG
 
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Todd,

Thanks I am headed to my boat and I will check what you wrote. One more thing, Where can I get this SeaStar Fluid?
 
West Marine carries it. I'm sure there are other places too, I just am not sure of them.
 
Thanks. I read that link that Frank wrote today. My first step will be to replace the fluid. Then look for leaks. Then email Frank.
I'll keep you posted.
 
OK, I filled the power steering up today. Didn't really take that much - about a 1/4 of the quart container. Recheck tomorrow night and I will start the engines and let it run for a bit while moving the wheel port and starboard. I did notice before putting the cap back on the steering wheel area that the fluid was red. Sea Star is kind of clear. I think maybe the PO may have done that. I'll let you know how tomorrow night goes. Now off to bed have a 8-4:30 class tomorrow. Can't wait.
 
If the fluid is red the PO might have used "Power Steering" fluid. I was told that in an emergency that would be OK but, then the system would have to be bled out and replaced with the Seastar. The amount you required will definitely affect performance. I think that the steering wheel is some sort of pump for the system and when the reservoir drops just a little bit you are pumping air instead of fluid and getting little response from the system. I had a situation last fall as I was running the boat over to the marina that I winter store it at. I couldn't get the rudders more than 15 degrees. I stopped the boat and added fluid. I took about 1/3 of a bottle max that time.

I think my problem is related to the installation of the autopilot the PO did the summer prior to selling me the boat. My mechanics have been over it several times and could not find a leak!!
 
There's something else you may check. On the back of the helm unit there are two threated caps sealing a kind of a check valve. (#5 on the pic)

http://www.teleflexmarine.com/products/hydraullic-new/helms-new/

Loosen the caps and take out the little ball inside. Clean it and the spring holding it in place. This should give a more positive action from the steering.

Usually it's necessary to clean the valves when the boat is not going straight.

It's all on the user manual :wink:
 
Four Suns said:
The fluid Sea Ray adds at the factory has a red dye in it.
Click to expand...

Thanks for the info Gary. I was not aware of that. I guess since my system had been previously drained for the autopilot install my fluid is all clear Seastar.

Pietro said:
There's something else you may check. On the back of the helm unit there are two threated caps sealing a kind of a check valve. (#5 on the pic)

http://www.teleflexmarine.com/products/hydraullic-new/helms-new/

Loosen the caps and take out the little ball inside. Clean it and the spring holding it in place. This should give a more positive action from the steering.

Usually it's necessary to clean the valves when the boat is not going straight.

It's all on the user manual :wink:
Click to expand...

Pietro, Thanks for the link. It's stored in my favorites now!! I'm going to check that ball valve on mine this week!
 
tdschafer said:
If the fluid is red the PO might have used "Power Steering" fluid. I was told that in an emergency that would be OK but, then the system would have to be bled out and replaced with the Seastar. The amount you required will definitely affect performance. I think that the steering wheel is some sort of pump for the system and when the reservoir drops just a little bit you are pumping air instead of fluid and getting little response from the system. I had a situation last fall as I was running the boat over to the marina that I winter store it at. I couldn't get the rudders more than 15 degrees. I stopped the boat and added fluid. I took about 1/3 of a bottle max that time.

Todd - good info. I agree that the steering wheel is a pump possible of some sort. Headed there now to check it and then test it with a run on the Bay.

Four Suns said:
The fluid Sea Ray adds at the factory has a red dye in it.
Click to expand...

Gary - thanks didn't know that either but like Todd I have autopilot as well. However it is red? Hmmm....

Pietro said:
There's something else you may check. On the back of the helm unit there are two threated caps sealing a kind of a check valve. (#5 on the pic)

Pietro - Thanks for that info. I need to look for them today when I go down there. On a side note - I bought some covers for my seats in the cockpit area. Very similar to yours. Not as nice but similar. Your boat looks great.

It's all on the user manual :wink:
Click to expand...
Still trying to get an owners manual. I thought they were here on CSR but I can't find one. I tried SR but they are more a sales brochure. Any ideas please chime in. Thanks.

And thanks to all of you for your help and insight.
Click to expand...
 
Excerpt from a conversation I had with Frank W a while back regarding this same matter. Note the explanation of where the "lost" fluid went. Probably nothing to worry about unless you have puddles under your ram or helm.


The Teleflex system is designed with very little volume in the pump and a very small air space. Fluid not approved by Teleflex reacts with Sea Star fluid and changes its characteristics as to expansion with heat, contraction with cold tolerance for moisture, resistance to corrosion, etc. Some other fluids, even ATF, will cause leaks at the seals. In fact, SeaStar says use ATF in an emergency but that you must drain and purge the system with SeaStar fluid as soon as possible.

West Marine does sell SeaStar fluid, which is about $24/qt........but you only need one qt for the life of your boat, unless your name is Four Suns.

THe helm pump should be filled, with the cap off, turn the wheel from lock to lock 5-6 times, then refill. Do it again. THen wait a week and do it one more time. Over time, some fluid leaks out as the ram goes in and out....takes about 10 years....but you need to catch it before the helm pump sucks air. If it sucks air, you are coming home with no steering.

Teleflex is the MFG and SeaStar is a trade name. You might see steering fluid under either name. To confuse us all, Teleflex/SeaStar has changed from red to amber to clear fluid, but as long as the bottle says its for SeaStar /Teleflex systems it is ok to use.
 
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I think Frank W. just dissed me....

I lost a gallon of Sea Star fluid in 800 feet....

oh... and another couple gallons blowing up some hoses...
 
rondds said:
Excerpt from a conversation I had with Frank W a while back regarding this same matter. Note the explanation of where the "lost" fluid went. Probably nothing to worry about unless you have puddles under your ram or helm.


The Teleflex system is designed with very little volume in the pump and a very small air space. Fluid not approved by Teleflex reacts with Sea Star fluid and changes its characteristics as to expansion with heat, contraction with cold tolerance for moisture, resistance to corrosion, etc. Some other fluids, even ATF, will cause leaks at the seals. In fact, SeaStar says use ATF in an emergency but that you must drain and purge the system with SeaStar fluid as soon as possible.

West Marine does sell SeaStar fluid, which is about $24/qt........but you only need one qt for the life of your boat, unless your name is Four Suns.

THe helm pump should be filled, with the cap off, turn the wheel from lock to lock 5-6 times, then refill. Do it again. THen wait a week and do it one more time. Over time, some fluid leaks out as the ram goes in and out....takes about 10 years....but you need to catch it before the helm pump sucks air. If it sucks air, you are coming home with no steering.

Teleflex is the MFG and SeaStar is a trade name. You might see steering fluid under either name. To confuse us all, Teleflex/SeaStar has changed from red to amber to clear fluid, but as long as the bottle says its for SeaStar /Teleflex systems it is ok to use.
Click to expand...

Wow. Thanks that was very helpful. So it is off to drain the hoses after this weekend. I am out on the boat for sure. I did take it out for a spin tonight and the steering was much much better.
 
Also check the resorvoir that is likely in your engine pay. It's about the size of a large coffee can. It will have a pressure guage on top and should be mainted between 25 and 35 PSI. You can use a bike air pump to bring the pressure up, the shrader valve is on top of the cannister. If the pressue is low, say under 10 the steering will be sluggish. As for hydraulic leaks, look to the rudder shaft in the interior transom. Follow the steering arm to the hydraulic unit. It's likely bronze in appearance. There are seals at the hydraulic ram that moves the rudders, and these may leak if the hydrualic arm is pitted, etc. Good luck!
 
Steven,
Thanks. My Father-in-law mentioned that to me last night. Said I would check today. However, your info is much better and more detailed that I might be able to find it and accomplish the task.
Thanks again = I'll post tonight after I work on it. Joe
 
Joe, why would you drain the hoses? If you top off and find no leaks, leave well enough alone and, like a great man once said, "go boating."
 
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