Sick of being stranded, possibly another vapor lock issue

[bamafutbal]

started last year (sept 09). rode up and down the intercoastal all day long. last stop was at a sandbar, played around for 1 hour, got in the boat and it cranked for 1-2 seconds before it muffled out. would continue to sometimes crank but just kind of spit and sputter at super low rpm, overall waited an hour for buddy to come tow us in and then it cranks up. :smt013

episode number 2: take the boat out (may '10)after getting impellar, all fluids, spark plug, and thermostat changed and decide to go to lake to run out the old gas (no stabile), runs great all day, while pulling kids on tube and hydroslide. turn boat off, wait 20-30 minutes and it cranks up great, begin pulling kids on the inner tube and it starts spitting and sputtering, and dies, cranks up and dies, muffles a couple of times and then nothing. 1 hour later as i am, getting pulled in, i try it and cranks right up. thank the guy for the short pull and proceed to pull the kids for next hour with no trouble turning the boat on/off several times.:smt013

- take boat out to lake with same routine and no troubles, this time with premium gas(93) and some marine stabile for ethanol gas.

episode 3- today, takes friends and their kid with us, pulled one adult skier, 4 kneeboarders, turn boat off and on several times, go to middle of lake, turn it off for about 45-60 minutes, get kids on inner tube and it cranks up very muffled at low rpm and dies (blower has run for 75% of the time, idled 5 minutes before turning off and opened engine hatch after eating and jumping in lake to cool off). for next 45 minutes nothing, get a tow in, put it on the trailer and was latching everything down and decided to see if it would crank, and of course it did:smt013. took it home, put the muffs on and it cranked right up with no problems, let temp get to 175-180 and turned it off, waited 15 minutes and it still cranked up

2000 sea ray 210sd with 5.0mpi, normal operating temp is 170-190 by temp gauge but probably reads a little high, water coming out back while on muffs is shower hot, but in no way scalding, both risers are hot if you hold your hand on them for 4-5 seconds with firm pressure, so can't be too hot. dumped fuel from new filter and it showed NO water in a pan. boat cranks up roughly 27 of 30 times but its those three times that make me want to sink the boat.
please :smt100:smt100:smt100:smt100:smt100:smt100:smt100:smt100:smt100:smt100:smt100:smt100. this boat is a complete waste of time and money if it justs sits in the garage in sunny florida with 84 water temp.

 

[Dave S]

There have been a lot of discussions on Vapor lock here on CSR that you may want to look for using the SEARCH feature. Also, here is an older Mercury Service bulletin that does a pretty good job of explaining the cause of vapor lock and what you can do to help prevent it or what to do if you get vapor lock. Unfortunately the CSR editor puts ****** in place of the word B-O-A-T-F-I-X so type that in (without the the seperators (-) on the attached URL and you can then download the PDF. http://www.*******.com/merc/Bullet/99/99_07.pdf

Dave

 

[toddh]

I am having the exact same problem. I have the 5.7 EFI. I don't think it is vapor lock. I watched the injectors while it was being cranked and it is getting fuel. I think the ignition is bad.

 

[toddh]

Also I have fuel and spark and it still won't start for an hour?

 

[bamafutbal]

hopefully solved the problem. i now have patience to let the fuel pump prime and wait for the alarms to go off. has not happened since

 

[Ashlexadd]

I have the same problem and I agree with Dave that you should read thru the Mercury Service bulletin on boat fix.

I have the issue everytime I trailer the boat home and hook up the muffs (about 45 minutes after shutdown), I've had it happen only twice out on the water and both times it restarted after letting it cool down 30-45 minutes.

I'm pretty sure the problem is with the hot water from the engine block draining back into the fuel pump/cooler. If you feel the water line coming from the fuel pump to the thermostat it is cool when the engine is running. I noticed that whenever I get the vapor lock that hose has filled up with hot water from the engine.

A number of people with our same boat have had success eliminating the problem by adding the Check Valve Kit P/N 21-862271A 1. This prevents hot water from running backward into the fuel pump after shutdown.

As soon as I get a chance, I'm going to add the check valve (hopefuuly be done with vapor lock). I hate to pay Mercruiser $50 for a $5 check valve and some hose clamps, especially to fix their problem (it must be marine grade:smt021)

I'll send you a message after I install it to let you know the results, since it happens everytime I should know pretty quick if it fixed the problem.

Hang in there (I thought I saw your boat listed for sale today:smt089).

 

[beachcombersc]

Any idea where to install this valve on the 4.3? Happens quite often to us as well...

 

[Ashlexadd]

The valve is installed in line in the hose that is coming up from the fuel pump and going into the thermostat. Maybe someone else has a picture as I probably won't get around to it for a few weeks.

 

[Ashlexadd]

It's item #13 in the attached diagram

 

[dansc]

Funny, read the service bulletin and it exactly describes what is happening to me. My mechanic suggestted leave the key in alarm setting for 2 to 3 minutes to "prime" the fuel pump and drive the air out.

 

[OldSkool]

I thought I had found my problem as the air was being resticted into the engine bay. Now I pull a tube all day long with no problem and can restart with no problem by using a football to keep the engine bay lid cracked open. Still trying to find the exact cause but this works for me until I can figure it out.

BTW we use the football when we swim.

 

[rcm]

Still trying to find the exact cause but this works for me until I can figure it out.
We had this same problem last year, and after many comments from Club Sea Ray Members, we replaced the fuel pump and cool fuel unit. We also checked the exhaust fan intake location in the engine compartment. In our boat, a previous owner had replaced the blower, and located the exhaust pickup at the bottom of the engine compartment, right next to the intake hose. This short circuited the air flow, and provided no cooling. Relocated the exhaust hose to the top of compartment, entire compartment is much cooler, and we have experenced no further vapor loc issues. CSR Members recommended 5 minutes of cool down blower time after shutdown really helps cool engine compartment. We do that every time we stop for playtime. The sound of 8 cylinders working together at the turn of the key anywhere and anytime is music to the ears.

 

[Kay Lee]

We also checked the exhaust fan intake location in the engine compartment. In our boat, a previous owner had replaced the blower, and located the exhaust pickup at the bottom of the engine compartment, right next to the intake hose. This short circuited the air flow, and provided no cooling. Relocated the exhaust hose to the top of compartment, entire compartment is much cooler, and we have experenced no further vapor loc issues.

Careful, you may have created a new problem that won't show up until it's too late. If by "exhaust fan" you mean "bilge blower," then the exhaust pickup should be low in the bilge. The purpose of the bilge blower is not to remove hot air from the engine compartment, it is to remove explosive gasoline vapors that can settle in the bottom of your bilge! The intake hose outlet should be higher in the bilge.

Larry

 

[rcm]

"The intake hose outlet should be higher in the bilge."

Larry,

Thanks for the heads up. The intake hose discharge and original (before I moved it) exhaust hose inlet were side by side. I will re-route as you suggest, and shorten the intake to discharge into the bilge area higher up.

Roger

 

[toddh]

"The intake hose outlet should be higher in the bilge."

Larry,

Thanks for the heads up. The intake hose discharge and original (before I moved it) exhaust hose inlet were side by side. I will re-route as you suggest, and shorten the intake to discharge into the bilge area higher up.

Roger

Have you had any more problems since you did this? I am having these problems and it is in the shop. They say they are going to install a fuel lift assist to prevent this from happening. I have not looked at my intake and exhaust hoses.

 

[rcm]

Have you had any more problems since you did this? I am having these problems and it is in the shop. They say they are going to install a fuel lift assist to prevent this from happening. I have not looked at my intake and exhaust hoses.[/quote]


I have had no further vapor loc problems, but I will follow and report after we run with the corrected intake hose location. Saturday or Sunday. The other thing I did was replace the fuel pump, which cost about $250, and took two hours. Our 210BR Signature Series Sea Ray only has 286 hours, but is 10 years old, so a failing electric fuel pump is a distinct possibility.The fuel-cool kit from Merc fit perfictly, and may have been the source of our problem all along. So far, all of last year after the new pump (June), and so far this year, we have been out 8 or 9 times, most of them the air temps in the real high 80's to mid 90's, no problems. Other CSR members suggested, and we follow their suggestions, have said that running the blower for 5 minutes after shutdown helps to cool the engine compartment, reducing both internal compartment temps, and possible vapor loc.

One further source of hot fuel issues can be poor flow of water from the outdrive pump, since this pump pumps cold water from outside the boat, through the power steering unit, then through the cool-fuel unit, then into the engine. If the impeller is failing or has failed, at low engine speed, poor flow through the fuel-cool unit may cause overheating of the pump, and immediate vapor loc. Down here in Tennessee in August, water surface temps can get pretty high, upper 80's, and with a hot engine compartment, low or no cooling flow, and poor fuel pump operation, vapor loc is possible. The sound of 8 cylinders working together at the turn of the key anywhere and anytime is music to the ears.

Roger

 

[bpalmer00]

Dumb question....do you let the engine idle for a few minutes before you shut down? This might give things a few minutes to cool down and stablize...??

 

[OldSkool]

Non turbo charged engines don't need to necessarily idle down. I like to idle mine a bit even though it’s a non turbo engine and not necessary but turbos need time to slow down after high idle. If you don't the engine shuts off and the oil supply is cut off to the turbo allowing the bearings to spin with no oil in them until the turbo stops.

There is another thread on this topic. Use the search function to see more.

 

[bpalmer00]

Absolutely correct with respect to turbo engines. But I've always felt that sometimes it's a good idea to also let non-turbo engines to idle a bit before shutting down. Allows water and oil to circulate and cool things down somewhat before shutting down, particularly after running at high rpms for an extended period.

 

[Chris Dauth]

Here is a little tip that will help people who are reading this thread who have carbureted engines (doesn't apply to TBI or MPI).

I had the same problem, mongrel would not start when hot, tried all of the above, no joy.

My engine builder gave me a half inch fibre insulation block that goes between the carb and the inlet manifold, made by Edelbrock.

Problem disappeared immediately. The block has been in for over 12 months now, and now I love my boat. :thumbsup: