shower sump backflow

[skiprima]

I have a new '06 340 DA. I have been having an alarm problem related to the gray water bilge.
I always seem to get seepage back into the sump box from somewhere that triggers the sump and then the alarm. The shower and sink have never been used. We have used the AC several times but not for about a week.
How much water is in the condensate line that could continually cause the sump/alarm to go off? Highly improbable, but possible that the check valve is bad in the sump and the discharge is running back down to the box rather than getting to the holding tank?
Any help with this would be greatly appreciated.

 

[Asureyez]

Sump Alarm

Well an alarm signals high water ... sumps are designed to get a lot of water and remove it quickly.

The air conditioner will put out a lot of water particularily if the cabin door is left open and it runs continously, but it shouldn't over run the pumps ability to get the water out and to trigger the high water alarm.

It is possible the check valve is sticking open. These valves are close to the discharge line from the sump pump.

First I'd check the float switches in the sump ... are they working correctly? There is manual override on these float type switches which would allow you to manaully determine how much water would have to be in the box to trigger an alarm. Normal volumes should not set off a high water alarm.

While in the sump disconnect the discharge line and try to blow out the discharge line with a fresh water hose. Have an observer check the overboard port for flow and debris.

If that doesn't work replace the check valve.

Once satisfied all in the sump switches and pump is working correctly, then clsoe it up and move elsewhere.

On my 370 Dancer, I had a continous false HW alarm issue in my cabin. The cabin bilge pump located aft of the sump box was wired to the forward bilge pump in the ER, why SR would do this is a complete mystery to me, but I had to rewire the cabin pump to solve the problem. The forward pump in the ER was considered HW and it would activite frequently when coming off a plane as small amounts of water would surge forward as we slowed and the stern lifted.

Start in the sump box and move aft. you'll finally find the gremlin.

 

[wkearney99]

I'd wonder about that check valve. Your best bet may be to spend some time with a hose feeding water into the various drains to see what's not getting handled properly.

 

[boatmailster]

I have a new '06 340 DA. I have been having an alarm problem related to the gray water bilge.
I always seem to get seepage back into the sump box from somewhere that triggers the sump and then the alarm. The shower and sink have never been used. We have used the AC several times but not for about a week.
How much water is in the condensate line that could continually cause the sump/alarm to go off? Highly improbable, but possible that the check valve is bad in the sump and the discharge is running back down to the box rather than getting to the holding tank?
Any help with this would be greatly appreciated.

the alarm is only for high water pump
that pump have separate float switch (located higher than float switch for main bilge pump)
if you constantly getting alarm coming on I would check if your
main bilge pump works OK (looks to me that pump is out and you are using your high water pump all the time)

 

[skiprima]

closer to solving the problem

believe it or not the hose coming from the condensate line was tied into the discharge of the sump pump. The sump was taking the condensate that was running from the pan, seeping out the pump and pumping it back up into the pan. Quite the little mess under the ac unit
I installed the correct hose and now pump into the main holding tank, but we still get water running back from the length of the hose into the collection box and triggering the sump.
My dealer, who is 2500 miles from the boat, said to shim the float up so that it doesn't come on until more water is in the tank. Not sure I like that idea; it doesn't solve the problem of the constant cycling.

Thanks to those who offered their help!

 

[Asureyez]

Re: closer to solving the problem

believe it or not the hose coming from the condensate line was tied into the discharge of the sump pump. The sump was taking the condensate that was running from the pan, seeping out the pump and pumping it back up into the pan. Quite the little mess under the ac unit
I installed the correct hose and now pump into the main holding tank, but we still get water running back from the length of the hose into the collection box and triggering the sump.
My dealer, who is 2500 miles from the boat, said to shim the float up so that it doesn't come on until more water is in the tank. Not sure I like that idea; it doesn't solve the problem of the constant cycling.

Thanks to those who offered their help!

Help !

Are you saying that the condensate drain discharge line from the AC pan was plumbed into the sump pump discharge line???

Hope not.

The AC drain line should go into the Sump Box and then pumped over board through the Sump Pump's discharge hose. This hose does not go into the toilet holding tank.

What is the "Main Holding Tank" you spoke of? If you mean the "holding tank" for the toilet, that is not where you want to discharge the AC drain nor any of the gray water in the sump as everything from the sump must go overboard. I'm confused by the terms you are using.

When you say collection box, you mean the Sump Box?

The AC condensate pan will get a little grody from water dripping from the condenser coil adn is always wet and stuff growing, but the sump pump should not be pumping anying back there. You should hav eonly one hose running from the AC condensate pan and that hose runs into the sump box directly.

The Sump pump discharges any contents from the sump box to a main discharge line that exits the boat to the sea.

Your toilet holding tank is dumped either to a shore side pump out station or to the sea where direct discharge to the sea is allowed.

What line did you re route and where did you tie it in to, the Sump box or the toilet holding tank?

Did you blow out the discharge hose from the sump pump with a water hose?

Did you find the check valve for this discharge hose? Is it working, if not have you replaced it? These two efforts should be undertaken before any new plumbing would be undertaken.

 

[wkearney99]

What? There's a loop? The way you're describing it the drip pan was connected to the sump and the sump was then back up to the pan? How?

You DO NOT want the AC drip pan connected to the main waste tank (black water). That tank should be reserved for the TOILET alone. Otherwise you'll be pumping out a more than necessary.

Some boats *may* have a gray water tank. This tank holds water from the sinks and shower. I don't know if it's common to run the AC drip pan into the gray water tank or not. But if your boat does NOT have a gray water tank then the sump should go overboard.

Sumps are different than bilges. The sump is usually a 12" square box with a pump in it. The bilge pumps are usually mounted directly on the bottom of the hull (inside of course) and usually pump directly overboard.

The constant cycling is due to constant water being dumped into the sump, triggering the float. Where is this water coming from? During most normal boat operations there really shouldn't be much water flowing into the sump (or bilges for that matter). Other than when using the sinks, toilet or shower there's not much water flow going on inside the boat. The AC drip shouldn't be very much, but will vary based on local humidity conditions.

Bear in mind the AC system has THREE hoses. One pulls raw water from outside, through a sea strainer. That water goes back overboard via a through-hull on the side of the boat. The third line is from the drip pan and that commonly goes to the same sump as the shower and sinks.

At this point it sounds like there are three problems. One is the terminology being thrown about isn't consistent. Two, there may be a hose routing problem. Three, there's more water moving than one would normally expect.

Is there a gray water tank on this boat? This would be IN ADDITION to the black water tank.

Are the sinks, shower and drip pan connected to a sump? Is that sump plumbed either to the gray tank or overboard?

 

[skiprima]

problem fixed

There is only one line from the ac unit to the "sump". This line normally just drains into the sump and collects. In my case this line was connected to the discharge side of the ejector pump in the sump. The original water was from the condensate of the ac unit. Instead of just running into the "sump", it was running into the pump and seeping out . The pump would activate and send it back up to the drip pan where the cycle would repeat itself.
As far as where the sump discharges to, on my boat the gray water goes into the main holding tank. This is what is described in our owners manual and visual inspection(running a food coloring dye through the lines) verified this. The manual acknowledges that when the tank is full, it has to be emptied. I cannot tell you how many gallons the holding tank is rated at.
The only modification I performed was to install a check valve on the discharge line.
I have not had any more alarms and the "sump" is empty.
The problem originated at the factory, was not caught by the dealer on pre delivery, and was not noticed by us until the ac was running. We had never run water in the sink or the shower, fortunately, or there would have been a real mess up front.
Thanks to everyone for their help. It is obvious there are a lot of very knowledgable people reading this website willing to help other owners.

 

[Asureyez]

I don't think we ...

I don't think we helped much because the circumstance is really bizzare.

Just to give us some comfort you're going to be okay with the fix,

Tell us where the sump pump discharge hose now goes to.

And do you have two separate holdings tanks, one for toilets and one for grey water ( showers, sinks and AC condensate?