Replace bulbs in Perko all around (anchor) light - PERKO BULB FIG 71

[mrsrobinson]

https://store.marinebeam.com/perko-atwood-hella-31mm-festoon-led-replacement-bulb/

These lamps are MUCH brighter than the original incandescent festoons, and easily meet the 2nm visibility requirements. Choose Cool White for anchor lights, steaming lights, and stern lights, and Warm White for bi-colored lamps. If you have separate red or green sidelight fixtures (i.e. not bi-color), you need the colored bulbs found here.

Thanks, unfortunately they are out of stock.

I agree the coast guard will not board my boat and check these bulbs. However, if there is an incident at night while I am anchored, someone runs into my boat for example, a good attorney may think to check them (to see if they were working for example), see they are LED and find fault. Or not, I don't know.

 

[The Bill Collector]

Did you find the USCG bulb approval we discussed?

I have read and it seems logical that the lenses are not of adequate strength to maintain the color with that many lumens being pushed through them.

If the same LED bulb is approved in their fixture wouldn't it be approved in my fixture...?
"Exceeds USCG regulations"

 

[MonacoMike]

If the same LED bulb is approved in their fixture wouldn't it be approved in my fixture...?
"Exceeds USCG regulations"

Everything I read say the USCG does not approve bulbs. No, the same bulb will not perform the same with a different lens in a different fixture. A big difference between incandescent bulbs and LED is the location of the light, an incandescent bulb has the light concentrated in the center, the LED has the light spread among several LED’s not centered, as seen in the pics above, which is what the incandescent lens is designed to control.

Many of the incandescent lenses I have seen usually have various ridges or lines in them, they are similar to the cuts that the fresnel lens in a lighthouse has and appear to serve a similar purpose.

Why did manufacturers build a whole new fixture for LED’s instead of just putting an LED bulb in their existing fixtures? My take is the fixture is built to meet the needs of the LED electronics and USCG specs.

So to recap; the LED bulbs light is not positioned the same in an incandescent fixture, the LED is so much brighter it can overpower the lens color, the incandescent fixture is usually vented to allow heat to escape which allows moisture into the delicate electronics of an LED bulb.

 

[The Bill Collector]

Everything I read say the USCG does not approve bulbs. No, the same bulb will not perform the same with a different lens in a different fixture. A big difference between incandescent bulbs and LED is the location of the light, an incandescent bulb has the light concentrated in the center, the LED has the light spread among several LED’s not centered, as seen in the pics above, which is what the incandescent lens is designed to control.

Many of the incandescent lenses I have seen usually have various ridges or lines in them, they are similar to the cuts that the fresnel lens in a lighthouse has and appear to serve a similar purpose.

Why did manufacturers build a whole new fixture for LED’s instead of just putting an LED bulb in their existing fixtures? My take is the fixture is built to meet the needs of the LED electronics and USCG specs.

So to recap; the LED bulbs light is not positioned the same in an incandescent fixture, the LED is so much brighter it can overpower the lens color, the incandescent fixture is usually vented to allow heat to escape which allows moisture into the delicate electronics of an LED bulb.

No worries, to each his own... This not a battle I'm willing to throw myself on sword for, but I have had a Coast Guard Auxillary inspection for the past 14 years and have always passed with flying colors and I'm comfortable with my choice of LEDs.

 

[Nater Potater]

Why did manufacturers build a whole new fixture for LED’s instead of just putting an LED bulb in their existing fixtures? My take is the fixture is built to meet the needs of the LED electronics and USCG specs.

Unsure about USCG's take on this question (and it's definitely something to consider), but one reason for a complete redesign of a light fixture is that the bulb "should" last the life of the fixture. Consequently, you can seal the housing and hard-wire the LED, thus eliminating two primary reasons for traditional lamp failure.

 

[MonacoMike]

No worries, to each his own... This not a battle I'm willing to throw myself on sword for, but I have had a Coast Guard Auxillary inspection for the past 14 years and have always passed with flying colors and I'm comfortable with my choice of LEDs.

I was hoping to see some information I had not seen before. As I said above, this is about risk, but others reading here may not know the risks and they need to know this information. USCG approved LED fixtures are not very costly, or one can continue to use the incandescent bulbs in their approved fixtures and take zero risk…

 

[The Bill Collector]

I was hoping to see some information I had not seen before. As I said above, this is about risk, but others reading here may not know the risks and they need to know this information. USCG approved LED fixtures are not very costly, or one can continue to use the incandescent bulbs in their approved fixtures and take zero risk…

 

[The Bill Collector]

I'm not a Maritime attorney, but I am comfortable in my decision...

 

[Bill Curtis]

Gospel..... Only thing USCGAux checks:
Did light come on as required? Yes / No
They suggest you carry spare bulbs. LED's are exempt from that.

Most USCG Aux VE's don't have a clue as to LED design, only they are brighter and last longer. Same probably holds true for the USCG actives, also.

LED fixtures are normally stamped with visibility distance and approval number. I know mine are.

 

[ranger58sb]

So to recap; the LED bulbs light is not positioned the same in an incandescent fixture, the LED is so much brighter it can overpower the lens color,

Yes. The marinebeam sidelight LEDs we have/had in the original Aqua Signal 41s have to be ordered in the correct color for each side. IOW, they don't rely on the lens for color...

LED fixtures are normally stamped with visibility distance and approval number. I know mine are.

Yes, our new Aqua Signal 44 fixture is.

FWIW, the LED in the Series 44 fixture is not replaceable. If the LED goes south, it'll require a whole fixture replacement.

-Chris

 

[MonacoMike]

Yes. The marinebeam sidelight LEDs we have/had in the original Aqua Signal 41s have to be ordered in the correct color for each side. IOW, they don't rely on the lens for color...

So are you saying that they are running a colored bulb inside a colored lens fixture? I have never seen an incandescent at fixture that did not have colored lens.

 

[Nater Potater]

So are you saying that they are running a colored bulb inside a colored lens fixture? I have never seen an incandescent at fixture that did not have colored lens.

A little background on the two disciplines; Incandescent bulbs throw out light across the visible spectrum, plus quite a bit in the infrared range. In doing so, you can filter out the wavelengths you don't want, and let out only the color of light (with a colored lens) that you do want. It's that very nature that makes them so inefficient. They throw most of their "light" as heat. You only get about 10% of visible light from an incandescent bulb, while the other 90% is going out as heat. Then, throw a color filter (lens) in front of it, and you remove just that much more.

LED's, on the other hand, are very "narrow" in the wavelength of light they project, allowing you to tailor the desired color by tweeking their chemistry. It's because of this property that you don't need (or want) a colored lens to modify the color of light. Not wanted because any filter lens will reduce the output, and there's no need for it, since the LED does the job for you.

For a given light output, an LED requires around one-fifth the energy needed for an incandescent bulb, and that's before you throw it behind a lens!

 

[mrsrobinson]

@ranger58sb, what LED lights did you upgrade to from www.marinebeam.com website? Was it these: https://store.marinebeam.com/led-navigation-side-lights-pair-12v-24v-horizontal-mount/

I don't see a series 44 fixture on their site.


Thanks

 

[MonacoMike]

A little background on the two disciplines; Incandescent bulbs throw out light across the visible spectrum, plus quite a bit in the infrared range. In doing so, you can filter out the wavelengths you don't want, and let out only the color of light (with a colored lens) that you do want. It's that very nature that makes them so inefficient. They throw most of their "light" as heat. You only get about 10% of visible light from an incandescent bulb, while the other 90% is going out as heat. Then, throw a color filter (lens) in front of it, and you remove just that much more.

LED's, on the other hand, are very "narrow" in the wavelength of light they project, allowing you to tailor the desired color by tweeking their chemistry. It's because of this property that you don't need (or want) a colored lens to modify the color of light. Not wanted because any filter lens will reduce the output, and there's no need for it, since the LED does the job for you.

For a given light output, an LED requires around one-fifth the energy needed for an incandescent bulb, and that's before you throw it behind a lens!

Right, That is why each bulb needs its own fixture and no authority will bless mixing them.

 

[mrsrobinson]

I just picked up new lenses for my anchor light, wow look at the difference in color

 

[MonacoMike]

I do not understand the devotion to this whole practice of replacing the incandescent bulbs with LED in navigation lights. I did it on my first boat (you can see the thread I created) until I studied it and determined it was not a risk I did not want to incur.

Every time this topic comes up there are those that vigorously defend the practice, but why? I might get it if it was a guy with a 40 year old boat on an extreme budget, but it often is members with boats worth thousands. Surely a part of a boat buck for the safest nav lights is not a big deal, but I cannot fathom just what it is…

 

[mrsrobinson]

My only goal is improved visibility, making my boat more visible to other boats.

 

[ranger58sb]

So are you saying that they are running a colored bulb inside a colored lens fixture? I have never seen an incandescent at fixture that did not have colored lens.

Yes, per info from marinebeam.

These: 60-LED High Output BAY15d Replacement LED Bulb for Aqua Signal Series 40, 41, 42, 43, 50 & 55, Hella or Perko (marinebeam.com)

@ranger58sb, what LED lights did you upgrade to from www.marinebeam.com website? Was it these: https://store.marinebeam.com/led-navigation-side-lights-pair-12v-24v-horizontal-mount/

I don't see a series 44 fixture on their site.

No. These: Aqua Signal 44301-7 Series 44 LED Side-Mount Navigation Light - Port (Red) with White Housing - Walmart.com

The fixture fits within roughly the same footprint as our original Series 41 lights... and can use the same pre-existing boat-mounting holes. Took me about an hour and a half to change, since some of the bits area little fiddly.

I do not understand the devotion to this whole practice of replacing the incandescent bulbs with LED in navigation lights. I did it on my first boat (you can see the thread I created) until I studied it and determined it was not a risk I did not want to incur.

Every time this topic comes up there are those that vigorously defend the practice, but why? I might get it if it was a guy with a 40 year old boat on an extreme budget, but it often is members with boats worth thousands. Surely a part of a boat buck for the safest nav lights is not a big deal, but I cannot fathom just what it is…

For me, it's mostly time management. Takes a couple minutes to change a "bulb" and can take significantly longer to change a fixture... with potentially more mounting issues to solve along the way. As it happens on this boat, I've had to address approximately 280 "issues" of some sort (!!!!) and the list is probably another 75 line items long... of the things I know about so far. (For example, I've got in about 10 of my own labor hours on the GHS lift, plus a boatload of "thinking about it" time and discussions with GHS tech support, and it still doesn't work yet.)

Wasting time yutzing with a light fixture when a simple bulb replacement -- also visually MUCH MUCH brighter than the original incandescent, MUCH MUCH more visible -- takes only a few minutes just gets me there faster. Cheaper too, in this case, although that's not usually my concern.

I'm not worried about inspections or law suites on this particular issue. That's not to say I'd put any ol' cheap piece of crap LED in a fixture and expect it to be great. But in this case, with the supplier I usually use, and with the best LEDs that fit the AS41s, I think my credential is safe.

Edit: I'm not really making much of a recommendation, aside from vendor. Otherwise, my comments are meant more like a series of observations.

-Chris

 

[Korkie]

We replaced all of our stock bulbs with LEDs. Was one of the first things we did. Mainly for the lower amp draw. Didn't really consider any USCG approval as stated above. I just know that if I leave my anchor or nav lights on at night my father in law can see them on the other side of the Bay we live on, he is just under 2 miles away. Works for me and I figure the CG would be fine with it. On the hook, we also leave other lights on at night to increase our visibility. Underwater stern lights (white LEDs), the light in the head and 2 small bicycle LEDs (white) that I clamp to my bow railing just forward of my windshield. Not concerned if these extras are USCG approved or not. But I can certainly be seen.

 

[TTG]

My only goal is improved visibility, making my boat more visible to other boats.

This right here.

I’ve never seen a thread with this much agony about a light. Must be the high fuel prices. Anyway….I changed out to LED bulbs for the same reason above. Done. Easy. When rafted up with other boats I can see a huge difference in visibility compared to non led boats (when walking back to dock etc). Problem solved and I’m comfortable with that. I’ve been boarded a number of times and also do the yearly inspection. All they do is check to see if it works. Never heard of an approve bulb. If there is an approved bulb provide a link for it please. I’d like to learn more. In the meantime I’m going to raft off this weekend with my led bulbs. You’ll see me .