Reducing tongue weight

[Nature Boy]

I weighed the tongue on my '95 200 Select BR riding on Eagle trailer. It weighs in excess of 340lbs , the scale pegged.

Looks like a factory type setup. The transom trailing edge is 2 - 3" forward of the rear edge of trailer bunks.

I have room to move the Winch standard back several inches almost 6". Would it be OK to move it back say 2" to get the tongue weight down to say 300lbs..

How much is too light on tongue weight.

Thanks for your opinion.

Eric

 

[Presentation]

A small move goes a long way.

Go with 2 inches then check again. Not more then 2 inches.

 

[Lazy Daze]

I would expect to see that tongue weight well into the 400lb+ range, even approaching 500lbs. I'd be hesitant to change it as it could lead to handling problems. Other than that, follow Doug's advice above.

 

[Nature Boy]

OK. I'll go no more than 2.

It seems odd that the transom trailing edge is is 2 -3 forward of the bunk trailing edge. Maybe they used a trailer slightly too long. Having said that it would not be good to have a light tongue as it feels more secure trailering with significant tongue load.

I pull with a Silverado 1500 ext cab. I'll try 1 + 1/2". That should be fine. It feels heavy as blank but its not a 17 footer with a 140 Mercruiser which is what I had before.

 

[chuck1]

How much does your boat and trailer weight? Like Dennis said I would think you would be looking at atleast a 400+ tongue weight. I always heard a good rule of thumb was 10% of the rig weight.

 

[Nature Boy]

4500 lb +/- 150 is my best estimate. 3250 dry on boat and tandem axle steel trailer.

 

[Lazy Daze]

Eagles are not light trailers. Figure about 1,100 for the trailer (tandem, right?). By the time you add for gas, the Bravo drive, spare tire, batteries, oil, gear/toys... you'll likely be awful close to 5,000lbs, if not over.

 

[Nature Boy]

Eagles are not light trailers. Figure about 1,100 for the trailer (tandem, right?). By the time you add for gas, the Bravo drive, spare tire, batteries, oil, gear/toys... you'll likely be awful close to 5,000lbs, if not over.

Your probably right in that it may be more. The trailer is tandem

The dry weight came of SeaRay spec. card that came with boat papers. It wasn't powerplant specific, so the stern drive may add something as well as 5.7 instead of a 5.0 but not sure what displacements were common with that boat back then.

Don't have a spare battery anymore. There was one in it but since its not wired I took it out.

Its a heavy rig though may have to live with 400 + lb tongue weight.

 

[Woody]

The trailer is supposed to be beyond the transom by several inches. It's not good to have the boat unsupported, even by the tiniest, tinyest bit. Also, a light tongue weight is courting with disaster, so as long as your tow vehicle is not burdened by the weight, I'd leave things alone.

Why?

 

[Woody]

The trailer is supposed to be beyond the transom by several inches. It's not good to have the boat unsupported, even by the tiniest, tinyest bit. Also, a light tongue weight is courting with disaster, so as long as your tow vehicle is not burdened by the weight, I'd leave things alone.

Boats were not built as cantilevers. In other words, there is a lot of weight in the rear of the boat, including a heavy outdrive, and often swim platform, not to mention that big thing that makes the boat go. If the transom is not supported adequately, the hull will develop a hook. Honestly, you knew that, right? This is pretty basic stuff.

Yes Scott, I did know that, but I was questioning the need for the support to bypass the transom by several inches.

 

[Woody]

I must not be understanding what you mean. Several inches of boat hanging over is important(bad) or several inches of extra support length is important?

 

[Nature Boy]

I'm going to leave it. I own it in halves with another guy. Too much risk involved as he has no trailer towing experience,

What started me on this was wanting to tow it around my property with small garden tractor. I put some weight on swim platform which lightened tongue enough. Will mount a ball on FEL of bigger Kubota as it lifts tonque with no problem.

the bunks protruding threw me also. The 10% rule also carries a lot of weight no pun intended. It is what it is.

Thanks to all!

 

[Henry Boyd]

Scott makes a good point about supporting the hull. However the big issue is the weight distribution on the trailer. This is controlled by the relationship between the boat center of gravity, longitudinal center of suspension, and length to tongue. Moving the boat CG ahead of the suspension center transfers weight to the tongue, backing the boat up reduces tongue weight. The important thing is that boat trailer suspensions are pretty mickey mouse (compared to something like a Meritor Flexair suspension) and don't really do a good job at equalizing weight between the two (or three) axles. They tend to work great statically, but terrible dynamically. It then becomes easy to overload one axle. This may not be catastrophic, but will lead to excessive tire wear.

Henry

 

[floriduramax1]

I agree with Henry. I'm still playing with my placement and still overloaded on rear axle. I have a class five hitch with weight carry of 1500# tongue and 15k# weight carry without bars. The worse thing about boat trailers is the greater the tongue weight, the rougher it rides on the truck versus other trailers like RV's. But air bags, Bilstein shocks and Sulastic rubber shackles make for a smoother ride...lol

 

[Woody]

I agree with Henry. I'm still playing with my placement and still overloaded on rear axle. I have a class five hitch with weight carry of 1500# tongue and 15k# weight carry without bars. The worse thing about boat trailers is the greater the tongue weight, the rougher it rides on the truck versus other trailers like RV's. But air bags, Bilstein shocks and Sulastic rubber shackles make for a smoother ride...lol

What is it that indicates that rear axle is overloaded, tire wear? What type of suspension is on your trailer?

 

[floriduramax1]

What is it that indicates that rear axle is overloaded, tire wear? What type of suspension is on your trailer?

Yes VERY EXCESSIVE!! I have an appointment with one of the best frame and alignment shops in Orlando. I send all my buses with trailers there so he will "take care" of me. We will weigh each tire position and axle before I spend too much money on it. It is leaf springs and the rear tires have gone completely bald (evenly) since I have had it. I have only pulled it a few times!!! I just built new bunks for the front so I load and not hit to winch stand roller (which is working awesome...btw) I did move the boat 3.5" which took tongue weight from 485# to now 900#. I can already tell it's not wearing the tire as badly but we will make sure next week!

 

[Woody]

How many miles on the tires? You hear about the tire problems some guys have and I always wonder what's up. I know sometimes there are bad tires out there or improperly spec tires but I often wonder how many of the problems are actually in the suspension itself or it's alignment. I don't have alot of miles on mine, about 3,500, and some guys say my tire brand is junk, but all my tires are worn even and look almost new. It'll be interesting to see what you come up with.

 

[Henry Boyd]

How many miles on the tires? You hear about the tire problems some guys have and I always wonder what's up. I know sometimes there are bad tires out there or improperly spec tires but I often wonder how many of the problems are actually in the suspension itself or it's alignment. I don't have alot of miles on mine, about 3,500, and some guys say my tire brand is junk, but all my tires are worn even and look almost new. It'll be interesting to see what you come up with.

That's kind of the point of my post, there is a very small window of combinations where boat CG, suspension position and trailer length all align to create equal weight on the axles. I would say do not change a thing, for whatever reason you hit the trifecta don't do anything to mess it up!

Fiddling with the boat position on the trailer might reduce tongue weight, but at the same time put the axles out of balance. Axle alignment can cause problems as well. The big thing is that boat trailers have basically simple and cheap suspensions. This is in large part because of the life they live. I (or any good trailer engineer) could design an air ride for a boat trailer that would ride like a dream and solve every problem, e.g. tire wear, blowouts, wandering etc. But it would cost about $ 10K and would be ruined the first time it went in the water. Building a decent trailer suspension (and trailer) for a large boat is a really difficult task with all of the external constraints.

Henry

 

[bigblockcutlass]

10% is what I read somewere.
You need the right amout so you drive the truck, not the boat.

How much does your boat and trailer weight? Like Dennis said I would think you would be looking at atleast a 400+ tongue weight. I always heard a good rule of thumb was 10% of the rig weight.