Prop shaft leaking

[Nmor830]

2008 34 Sundancer”s starboard shaft seal is leaking. On a recent trip I heard a strange whining sound. Back at the dock noticed bilge was pumping water out. Very unusual. Open up the hatch and sure enough it’s leaking pretty good. It’s smelt like burnt rubber. Very hard to get to but can see where the original seal looks burnt? With the bit of research I’ve done is sounds like there’s a case bearing. Is it possible it is shot and caused the shaft to get hot enough to distort the rubber seal? Was planning on pulling out for paint anyway. Will get a better look then.
It’s a little unnerving with water flowing but the pump seems to be handling it well. Any info would be much appreciated.
Thanks

 

[ttmott]

It could be the seal (which is probably a Tides dripless seal assembly) cooling water was lost.
On the seal housing is a hose barb and hose that usually routes to a component of the raw water engine cooling system and supplies cooling water to the seal assembly.
If it got that hot then most likely the seal assembly Delrin bearing and the lip seal itself is damaged. and will require replacement.
The boat will need to be pulled, propeller removed, shaft disconnected from gear and pulled back so the seal assembly can be removed and replaced. You can purchase directly from Tides Marine - about $800....
2008 boat and shaft seals never replaced? So, if you are in that deep it would be best to service both sides and upgrade with cross cooling so the chance of loosing cooling water is greatly reduced.

 

[mquiet]

Time to get it out quickly. Sounds like you need to replace the dripless kit. Pending on which system you have, but if the rubber boot is also leaking you might need an entire kit. Your story sounds like no water was getting to the shaft and it burnt up the syste,. These are items most people don't do any routine maintenance on, but should be checked to make sure there is good water flow.

 

[Bt Doctur]

Funny how nobody has a problem with Flax packed shafts. "A little drip will do ya"

 

[sbw1]

Funny how nobody has a problem with Flax packed shafts. "A little drip will do ya"

flax packing requires constant attention. Dripless shafts last for years. At least that has been my experience. I installed them on my 1993 370 Express after it was a year old and sold it in 2004 with a dry bilge.

 

[Nmor830]

It could be the seal (which is probably a Tides dripless seal assembly) cooling water was lost.
On the seal housing is a hose barb and hose that usually routes to a component of the raw water engine cooling system and supplies cooling water to the seal assembly.
If it got that hot then most likely the seal assembly Delrin bearing and the lip seal itself is damaged. and will require replacement.
The boat will need to be pulled, propeller removed, shaft disconnected from gear and pulled back so the seal assembly can be removed and replaced. You can purchase directly from Tides Marine - about $800....
2008 boat and shaft seals never replaced? So, if you are in that deep it would be best to service both sides and upgrade with cross cooling so the chance of loosing cooling water is greatly reduced.

It does have the Tides drip less system. Both assemblies were replaced when I purchased the boat 4 years ago. Wondering if the shaft wasn’t aligned properly or somehow lost water to cool it? The water line connects the the manifold. Probably only have about 60-70 hrs. since purchased. Getting it out of the water ASAP. Most the yards where I am are jammed right now.

 

[Nmor830]

It could be the seal (which is probably a Tides dripless seal assembly) cooling water was lost.
On the seal housing is a hose barb and hose that usually routes to a component of the raw water engine cooling system and supplies cooling water to the seal assembly.
If it got that hot then most likely the seal assembly Delrin bearing and the lip seal itself is damaged. and will require replacement.
The boat will need to be pulled, propeller removed, shaft disconnected from gear and pulled back so the seal assembly can be removed and replaced. You can purchase directly from Tides Marine - about $800....
2008 boat and shaft seals never replaced? So, if you are in that deep it would be best to service both sides and upgrade with cross cooling so the chance of loosing cooling water is greatly reduced.

2008 34 Sundancer”s starboard shaft seal is leaking. On a recent trip I heard a strange whining sound. Back at the dock noticed bilge was pumping water out. Very unusual. Open up the hatch and sure enough it’s leaking pretty good. It’s smelt like burnt rubber. Very hard to get to but can see where the original seal looks burnt? With the bit of research I’ve done is sounds like there’s a case bearing. Is it possible it is shot and caused the shaft to get hot enough to distort the rubber seal? Was planning on pulling out for paint anyway. Will get a better look then.
It’s a little unnerving with water flowing but the pump seems to be handling it well. Any info would be much appreciated.
Thanks

2008 34 Sundancer”s starboard shaft seal is leaking. On a recent trip I heard a strange whining sound. Back at the dock noticed bilge was pumping water out. Very unusual. Open up the hatch and sure enough it’s leaking pretty good. It’s smelt like burnt rubber. Very hard to get to but can see where the original seal looks burnt? With the bit of research I’ve done is sounds like there’s a case bearing. Is it possible it is shot and caused the shaft to get hot enough to distort the rubber seal? Was planning on pulling out for paint anyway. Will get a better look then.
It’s a little unnerving with water flowing but the pump seems to be handling it well. Any info would be much appreciated.
Thanks

 

[Nmor830]

It’s kind of funny to watch the YouTube videos of a 10 min replacement of these V drive shaft seals where there’s lots of room to work around the shaft. Trying to squeeze down between those motors and getting your arms and hands in there requires one to be a good contortionist.

 

[ttmott]

It’s kind of funny to watch the YouTube videos of a 10 min replacement of these V drive shaft seals where there’s lots of room to work around the shaft. Trying to squeeze down between those motors and getting your arms and hands in there requires one to be a good contortionist.

You are right about that; I had a 400 Sundancer which was also V-Drive and a pain to access; I had to change a seal in the Bahamas in the middle of nowhere... Fortunately had a spare on the shaft. My 52 Sedan Bridge is a breeze to get to; they are right there in your face when you enter the engine room....

 

[MasterFab]

Tom, I like to see the machined plastic alignment busing supporting the shaft too....I just made a new pair for my boat, since I am changing the boots, housings, and seals this week, and performing an engine alignment. Centering the shaft in the log minimizes radial loads on the housing once the installation is complete, and that's a great thing with V-drives that can be hard to access.

Dale

 

[Jimmy Buoy]

If you're going to replace them, it might be worth your while to check out Lasdrop seals. I believe they are a far superior design. (no affiliation, just appreciation)

 

[ttmott]

Tom, I like to see the machined plastic alignment busing supporting the shaft too....I just made a new pair for my boat, since I am changing the boots, housings, and seals this week, and performing an engine alignment. Centering the shaft in the log minimizes radial loads on the housing once the installation is complete, and that's a great thing with V-drives that can be hard to access.

Dale

I made those to support shaft alignment when I had to remove and re-bed the struts several months ago. My mechanic was dubious as to their value until we started to reassemble and then align the engines; now he is an advocate as it made his job not only easier but more accurate.. I have a whole diatribe on the effort with lots of pictures in the 500/520DB forum section.

 

[Nmor830]

If you're going to replace them, it might be worth your while to check out Lasdrop seals. I believe they are a far superior design. (no affiliation, just appreciation)

Hi Jimmy, I mentioned Lasdrop to the yard I’m in. They think the Tides are better because on the 34 DA’s it’s really hard to get to the seals and that Lasdrop seals require occasional adjustment to the tension springs? I find better reviews on the Lasdrop vs Tides and like the design better. If you have them wondering how they have performed for you.
Thanks,
Nick

 

[Jimmy Buoy]

Hi Jimmy, I mentioned Lasdrop to the yard I’m in. They think the Tides are better because on the 34 DA’s it’s really hard to get to the seals and that Lasdrop seals require occasional adjustment to the tension springs? I find better reviews on the Lasdrop vs Tides and like the design better. If you have them wondering how they have performed for you.
Thanks,
Nick

Still have Tides, but when one fails I plan on replacing with Lasdrop. I haven't seen anything about needing any adjustment once installed due to the spring design. Mechanical seals are less problematic than lip seals in my opinion so it's either Lasdrop or PSS. PSS uses an accordion type flexible tube to provide pressure on the mechanical seals. The problem is that the tube as it ages becomes less able to provide the same pressure which it why I'd choose Lasdrop.

That being said, I don't have V-Drives but Straight Shafts so I can easily access the shafts for adjustments in any case. If you do choose Tides, I'd suggest getting a couple of spare seals (and seal cases) for each shaft. That way, should a seal start to leak you can easily remove and cut away the old seal and slide the next one into place with the boat still in the water. (I've done that on one of my shafts that began to leak and had one spare left on the shaft).

 

[hottoddie]

Still have Tides, but when one fails I plan on replacing with Lasdrop. I haven't seen anything about needing any adjustment once installed due to the spring design. Mechanical seals are less problematic than lip seals in my opinion so it's either Lasdrop or PSS. PSS uses an accordion type flexible tube to provide pressure on the mechanical seals. The problem is that the tube as it ages becomes less able to provide the same pressure which it why I'd choose Lasdrop.

That being said, I don't have V-Drives but Straight Shafts so I can easily access the shafts for adjustments in any case. If you do choose Tides, I'd suggest getting a couple of spare seals (and seal cases) for each shaft. That way, should a seal start to leak you can easily remove and cut away the old seal and slide the next one into place with the boat still in the water. (I've done that on one of my shafts that began to leak and had one spare left on the shaft).

If you watch the video on the Lasdrop website they use an accordion type tube that they say may require adjustment just like PSS.

 

[Jimmy Buoy]

If you watch the video on the Lasdrop website they use an accordion type tube that they say may require adjustment just like PSS.

Not so, unless you consider our boats "workboats". There are three different models of the Lasdrop shown at the beginning of this video. Two of the three do NOT utilize the accordion type tube but a straight tube. The only one with an accordion type tube was named the "Bellows" type which would not used for our applications (see below). The Genesis II Seal seems to be their most recent seal that would not require any adjustments.

This is the application for their "Bellows" design from Lasdrop's website...
The Lasdrop Original “Bellows” seal is a face seal that features a vibration absorbing bellows, ideal for use on sailboats and workboats. Specially balanced for smooth rotation, this model utilizes a 316 stainless steel and carbon graphite for its sealing surfaces. Like all Lasdrop models, a water lubricated bearing is designed in the assembly to insure correct alignment with the shaft.

As I've said, I'm not affiliated in any way to the company - just appreciative of the design which seems superior to either the Tides lip seal or the PSS mechanical seal.