L590

SR did an outstanding job with L-class. We've seen L650 and L590 FLYs and they're awesome yachts. However, nothing is perfect and there were couple of major items that made my "don't like it" list. The tripple engines with zues was on the top of my list.

The issues I see with tripples:
1. Operational cost.
2. Maintenance cost.
3. Accessability.

I'm just thinking that SR's logic here is, peoeple who will be spending 2-3mill won't care about those bullet points I've mentioned above. They'll just write a check.
 
Last edited:
True that thought crossed my mind too, they'll just write a check. But I do love the boat a lot and wouldn't mind seeing what it's like riding on it with triples. Hopefully Skipper Buds up here in the North will get their hands on one so I can check it out. However getting a ride would be a very long shot.
 
I spoke to my SR sales guy today at the boat show and I said, why? He said:
1. There is no Zeus/Cummins engine big enough to power the 590 with twins
2. The cost of one of the twins that would be big enough to power the 590 would pay for 3 of the Cummins that are in the 590
3. Mann engines have not been a good venture with SR due to the expense and maintenance costs

So, there you have it. My take is:
1. SR has the smaller Cummins/Zeus in their parts bin
2. It is cheaper for SR to volume order one engine from Cummins/Zeus for multiple lines
3. It is easier for SR dealers to service Cummins/Zeus than Mann
4. SR is married to Cummins/Zeus and can only lust for Volvo IPS

I love my boat, but dream about the day that I might access 4 sides of my boat engine. That day will never come if I stay with SR on an upgrade. Maybe on a downsize. I do all of the service on my engines. Three oil changes are enough. In order to get a 590, I'd not only have to afford the boat, but I'd also have to afford the hired help to do the service. That is a big step up in expense. What SR saves on build expense, the customer pays on ownership expenses. I'd rather shop Volvo IPS. Of course, this is all dreaming, because I love my 48DA.
 
Don't overlook the Brunswick influence here. There has to be some pressure to keep the engine packages "in the family".

Zeus has about a 700hp input shaft limit so for applications needing more than 1400 hp total, the choice won't be a pair of Zeus drives.

The MAN thing has to do with cost of the engines, the cost of the service and with the fact that MAN service isn't available everywhere and is, in fact, kind of spotty in some areas. We are lucky and have a MAN servicing company in town, but the guys 50 miles west have to pay an additional 3 hours labor just to get the technician to their boat. Add that to the MAN required service and owning MAN's can be somewhat of an eye opener when an owner totals his expenses.

You can get to the back side of the C-18 Caterpillars in an L650.............based on how the L650 performs, I think a pair of 1100hp C-18's in the L590 would make a super cool and a very quick boat. Last summer when we heard about the 590's we just assumed the C-18's would be the logical and natural choice. When it debuted with triple Zeus, it became more of a "What are they thinking ?
 
Frank,

That was exactly my thought as well. After touring L650 and learning its power pkg, I was shocked to hear what SR put in L590. A reason I was given was that the same category Azimut had the best seller with triple engines. Oh well, I don't know what SR was thinking here, but to it looks like just an experimental boat (that was exactly my comment at the show). Why was there a need going with PODs when you have perfectly working model? Don't want C18? Go a bit smaller. The bottom line is that CAT produces enough options to choose from that I'm sure would work very nicely in L590. Forget chasing PODs. I personally don't see any advantages with triples and PODs. Speed? Fuel economy? I don't believe that triples are more economical that larger twins. Speed can always be achieved by having larger twins swinging larger or just appropriately tuned props with conventional shaft.
 
Maybe it's felt the handling benefits of pods will sell some boats to lesser experienced Captains or those thinking of moving up but intimidated by a 60' boat.
 
Woody said:
Maybe it's felt the handling benefits of pods will sell some boats to lesser experienced Captains or those thinking of moving up but intimidated by a 60' boat.
Click to expand...

You could have joystick or Yacht Controller with conventional shaft drives. No need for PODs for "dummy proof" docking. I'm not 100% sure if YC can work with only bow thruster, but add bow and stern thrusters and you're done.
 
JV II said:
What SR saves on build expense, the customer pays on ownership expenses. I'd rather shop Volvo IPS.
Click to expand...

I was on a 2006 Cruisers 56 at the brokerage show, halfway down the ER ladder and chatting with the broker when a guy boarded and asked about the engines. The broker told him they were Volvo D12's. The guy said, "I can afford the boat, but not Swedish parts", and then he walked away. The broker looked at me and shrugged. Volvo parts and service aren't in MAN territory, but I haven't met many owners who are pleased with their TCO.
 
C-18s would be a perfect package for the L590. I thought they were a little light for the L650. Most of the competitors would have a C-32 option in that size.

Paul
 
MAN territory is a great place to be , owning MANS engine boat , I won't ever have nothing else , maybe a pair of 2000 hp MTUs would do the trick .


Boltman
 
My out of the gate - initial impression of the L Class - I was not in love with the series.

Of course, I am slow to change sometimes...

Spent some time at the Fort Lauderdale show on the ones there - have to say - starting to come around. Still picking at a couple of items - but starting to think I like the L Class...

I am a tedious researcher. As soon as I got the boat "before" this one, I was starting to look at the next boat. Got this one last fall, now well into the search and refining of important features for the next one - sometime around 2016-17.

Sea Ray is doing a good job, have to commend the SR team.

Local boat show in Dallas had an Azimuth - 53-54 ft range. Salesperson had called and asked me to come look at it. I thought it was a beautiful boat - I am sure it would be great for some folks. Not interested for us. Would buy an L class before an Azimuth.

Best thing about the process is what you learn by looking and the points that are raised about different boats in a forum such as this.

Challenge in a forum sometimes is sorting through the "knowledge" and speculation. I had posted a year or more asking for input on the model of boat I wound up getting. Got responses. After having experience with the boat - the responses I got were not all "knowledgeable" many were speculation.

Put your hands on it - your feet on the deck.

Anyway - realized I am rambling...

Mark
 
CAPTAINJEH said:
Found out they will offer this boat with twin inboards and they'll be MANs not Cats.
Click to expand...

I was told the same thing by someone VERY close to the 590 development.
 
bmac said:
I was told the same thing by someone VERY close to the 590 development.
Click to expand...

If this is true I soo hope they use the MAN V8-1000 to 1200's. 2000hp to 2400hp would make this an extremely spirited yacht. I see a cruise of 35kts possible with these engines.
 
Stunnerable said:
If this is true I soo hope they use the MAN V8-1000 to 1200's. 2000hp to 2400hp would make this an extremely spirited yacht. I see a cruise of 35kts possible with these engines.
Click to expand...

I would expect it would be the V-8 1000. I have also heard the V-8 1200 MAN might be headed for the 650 in place of the Cat.
 
bmac said:
I would expect it would be the V-8 1000. I have also heard the V-8 1200 MAN might be headed for the 650 in place of the Cat.
Click to expand...

Funny you should mention that. I thought from the start that the 650 needed some more power. I was thinking more along the lines of the MAN V12-1550s in the 650. That would make it a proper sporty yacht.

Of course you're talking to a guy who would opt for the 1550s in the 590 if it was an option. lol


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
Why would Sea Ray would re-engineer the propulsion on the 650FLY is a mystery. For an 80,000lb boat, its performance and economy are phenominal. Additionally, there has been a constant customer backlash on MAN engines from the start. The engines and the distributor are great, but in many parts of the country MAN service is either non-existant or spotty at best, and very expensive everywhere. That isn't the case with Caterpillar engines. At this level of boating, I guess the buyer doesn't care, but a pair of 1200 MAN's burn 120 GPH and the Cat C-18's burn about 85 GPH. At $4/gal for diesel, that is a $140/hour premium to pay for an additional 100 hp..........which you would never use at normal operating conditions.
 
Frank it's clear to me , MANs are completely a better engine , there's something to be said about German Engineered engines , they outlast , out perform CATs and at that price point You're not concerned about the price of diesel , if you cannot afford the diesel you sure as hell cant afford the boat. Besides that MAN is on an aggressive campaign to increase their service points throughout the USA.


Boltman
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Forum statistics

Threads
113,212
Messages
1,428,690
Members
61,110
Latest member
rvlewis
Back
Top