In a pickle and could use some guidance

Carpediem44DB

Carpediem44DB

Well-Known Member
Aug 18, 2015
3,230
Sanfransico Bay area
Boat Info
2000 Carver 506
2006 44 DB Sedan Bridge
Engines
Volvo TAMD 74 P
So I am selling the 506. It has Volvo engines but that is not the problem. The problem is that the boat has hobbs meters installed in the ER that read 600 and change each. When I bought the boat I assumed those were the hours and I really don't recall giving it a second thought. I bought the boat from a marina/ Yacht club neighbor directly with no broker services and had two surveys done and none of us questioned the hours. Well today the boat went to survey and the surveyor turned on the keys and looked at the digital hour meter on the tachometers and they read 2200 hrs! The Volvo engine electronics have been problematic and there has been alot of work done to the system over the years and I am thinking that the recorders are in correct but really have no way to back that up. In the end I think I will need to represent the boat as having 2200 hrs on the engines. The question is how to price that into the value of the boat. When I was selling aircraft there was a simple engine time amortization schedule we used based on overhaul cost and TBO but marine diesel engines really don't have set overhaul times and if they did 2200 hours is still relatively low time. Any guidance on how to deal with this to save our deal would be appreciated.
 
Do you know if the tach meters read the hours from the engine computer? Maybe have the mechanic hook up a monitor and see what the computer says -- that would be the true guide. I found that my tach hours are off by about 100 on each engine. As for a price concession, that might depend if all the scheduled maintenance has been done. Like you said, 2200 hours are still breaking in, especially if all the maintenance is up to date.
 
Golfman25 said:
Do you know if the tach meters read the hours from the engine computer? Maybe have the mechanic hook up a monitor and see what the computer says -- that would be the true guide. I found that my tach hours are off by about 100 on each engine. As for a price concession, that might depend if all the scheduled maintenance has been done. Like you said, 2200 hours are still breaking in, especially if all the maintenance is up to date.
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Yep, I would think, even on a 2000 Volvo TAMD 74 P, a "Good" Volvo Tech/engine surveyor should be able to pull all actual engine data.

Damn that boat is sexy!
 
techmitch said:
Yep, I would think, even on a 2000 Volvo TAMD 74 P, a "Good" Volvo Tech/engine surveyor should be able to pull all actual engine data.

Damn that boat is sexy!
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I am pissed at myself now for not spending the $$$ to have a Volvo tech do my survey when I bought it. I did not have any reason to wonder why there were hobbs meters in the engine room. I just feel stupid for not doing more homework on the operation of the volvo instrumentation to understand the read outs. There are LCD read outs that display the Engine RPM in the instrument cluster with the fuel, oil pressure, voltage and engine temp. no full time engine hour display. Well now I know:(.
Hey , the buyer's mechanical surveyor did not catch it either and he is a professional:D
 
Carpediem44DB said:
Im picking the boat up in the morning, hopefully they will have a tech available on short notice. if not it will be a house call:(
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Relax man, it's just a Fn' automobile, err.. I mean Boat, a man made it, a man can fix it!
Plus, when you've had enough of driving that beast of a MH around some of of our undoubtedly/assuredly most beautiful NW countryside you will be better at finding that NW Exploring vessel that you have eluded to in the past.

Fair seas Sir.
 
Granted it's mercruiser and smartcraft, but both of my engines were replaced before I bought it and the tachs show total boat hours (900) vs actual engine hours. There was paperwork to back up when they were replaced. Hope your surveyor can pull the correct numbers.
 
My Mans show anywhere from 19000 to 22000 every time you start it. I bought the computer to read the hrs off the engines. Battery's went dead in the helm units, Pretty pricey to have repaired. Hopefully you can do the same.
 
My digital hour meter tachs tick off as long as the ignition is "on"

I've worked a lot of diesel systems marine & industrial with Hobbs meters. The most typical wiring is the kit comes with a replacement oil pressure switch, a three terminal. This replaces the low pressure alarm N.C. and has a N.O. contact to run the meter only when the engine is actually turning.
Check the wiring style for the tachs and the meters see how yours behave.

Agree see if the computers have a total hours.
The dealer should also be able to check the serial numbers to see if they match the year/OEM
 
It makes sense to me that the helm meters at some point were believed to be incorrect which would be the only justification I can think of to add hour meters to the engines in the ER. I’ll do more research on the helm instruments and their reliability.
Thanks
 
Jus the two of us said:
My Mans show anywhere from 19000 to 22000 every time you start it. I bought the computer to read the hrs off the engines. Battery's went dead in the helm units, Pretty pricey to have repaired. Hopefully you can do the same.
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Curious as to where you bouth the computer to read the engines hours. Did you buy the full MANCATS computer?

MMDS board battery needs replacing to correct display hours. Display battery can be replaced by Sea-Tronics for ~$350...(sea-tronics.com)
 
Something similar happened to my when I bought the 1995 330DA It was listed as a 97. During survey of course the HIN revealed it was a 95. When I went back to the broker of course he tried to tell me "all else equal", then I showed him different listings for 95s and 97s, so he agreed to a lower price.

Has the buyer asked you to lower the price? As a buyer this would not be a big deal to me. I'd ask for some kind of "discount" though. If you said No I think I'd still move forward with the purchase.

Maybe ask a reputable/good broker if there is s price difference.
 
Jus the two of us said:
My Mans show anywhere from 19000 to 22000 every time you start it. I bought the computer to read the hrs off the engines. Battery's went dead in the helm units, Pretty pricey to have repaired. Hopefully you can do the same.
Click to expand...
I don't recall the name of the company that repairs the MAN displays but IIRC a battery replacement was $750 per display plus shipping. Updated...mine were done by MAN under warranty for free but Carter has current knowledge on who does it and what it costs.
 
I was able to talk to the second owner of the 506 today. Found his number on an invoice. He owned the boat from 2014 to 2019. He used the ER HOBBS as his understanding as to engine times. He used the boat for a trip or two each year to Catalina from Marina Del Ray and a one or two hour coastal cruise one or twice a month. So about 30 to 50 hours a year max. He said the guy he bought it from which was the OO used it as a dock condo so it had very little use. This leads me to think the meters in the tachs are out of wack. I read the meters before we left the yard dock this morning. Turn the key and push active station button and the hours are supposed to appear. Took ten tries to get 2279 to come up. Several times I tried I got 8008 hours and some times only three digits appear.
Cruised 2.5 hours home. Tried to get numbers and after ten attempts with different combinations of key turn then button push, I only got the 8008! Something is amiss. Talked to Volvo dealer. Booking out into December to send a tech out. Looking into buying the soft ware and analyzer to verify
 
bmac said:
I don't recall the name of the company that repairs the MAN displays but IIRC a battery replacement was $750 per display plus shipping. Updated...mine were done by MAN under warranty for free but Carter has current knowledge on who does it and what it costs.
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The mmds boards (runaway clock issue) can be repaired by MAN for around $900 including labor and shipping. The repair can be turned in as little as 4-5 days if you do overnight to and from.
 
Carpediem44DB said:
I was able to talk to the second owner of the 506 today. Found his number on an invoice. He owned the boat from 2014 to 2019. He used the ER HOBBS as his understanding as to engine times. He used the boat for a trip or two each year to Catalina from Marina Del Ray and a one or two hour coastal cruise one or twice a month. So about 30 to 50 hours a year max. He said the guy he bought it from which was the OO used it as a dock condo so it had very little use. This leads me to think the meters in the tachs are out of wack. I read the meters before we left the yard dock this morning. Turn the key and push active station button and the hours are supposed to appear. Took ten tries to get 2279 to come up. Several times I tried I got 8008 hours and some times only three digits appear.
Cruised 2.5 hours home. Tried to get numbers and after ten attempts with different combinations of key turn then button push, I only got the 8008! Something is amiss. Talked to Volvo dealer. Booking out into December to send a tech out. Looking into buying the soft ware and analyzer to verify
Click to expand...
Why do anything Rusty? If the meters on the engines are correct then disclose that and the fact there are issues with the digitals. If the prospective buyer has issues with that then he can ensure the survey investigates - hopefully a Volvo qualified mechanic doing the engine survey. What was recorded in hours for the survey you had done? If it was the engine meters they you are solid.
 
ttmott said:
Why do anything Rusty? If the meters on the engines are correct then disclose that and the fact there are issues with the digitals. If the prospective buyer has issues with that then he can ensure the survey investigates - hopefully a Volvo qualified mechanic doing the engine survey. What was recorded in hours for the survey you had done? If it was the engine meters they you are solid.
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Tom, the problem is that I did not know about the hour meter issue until yesterday when the buyers surveyor pointed it out. I never even knew about the hour meter in the tach or how to display the values until then. I just naturally thought the engine hours were on the ER hobbs meters. Of course the buyer is just going by what his know it all surveyor is telling him. The buyer even said it took the surveyor several attempts to display the 2400 and 2700 hour values on the respective engine tach which on its own would bring into question the validity of the values. The only reason that I am wanting to do anything about it is to see if the EDM data matches one set of meters or it may be a different value altogether. I need to have a Volvo Tech come out and use the Vodia software to query the data and get the numbers. I may need to float across the bay next week to the dealer's dock because it will be December before they can make a service call to my dock. I just need to prove the hours to ease the buyer's mind to make this sale happen.
 
I have Aetna Engineering Model 8905 LCD tachometers. I reached out to the manufacturer to see what if any explanation they may have.
 
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