Have shaft resurfaced??

dtfeld

dtfeld

Water Contrails
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Jun 5, 2016
5,619
Milton, GA
Boat Info
410 Sundancer
2001
12" Axiom and 9" Axiom+ MFD
Engines
Cat 3126 V-Drives
I noticed my starboard Tides Marine Sure Seal started to leak about 2 weeks ago (right after I put the boat back into the water). I know the Port had a new lip seal and a spare installed in Feb 2018 as it was leaking during sea trial, so that one is in good shape.

I pulled the boat and got everything disassembled, but upon inspection, I found that the shaft had a couple of grooves where the lip seal had been seated over the years. So much for a quick swap out.

I contacted Tides, and they advised I could move the seal around a little bit, or I could have the shaft reconditioned/resurfaced.

You can see I have 3 wear rings in this shaft. I brought the shaft home anticipating having it resurfaced.

Inked20220309_142427_LI.jpg



Anybody have any experience or recommendations with this? I thought about PSS , but I like the idea of being able to slide a new lip seal in place. PSS (while really good), have a few more issues from what I've read.
 
Mine have slight grooves as well but I don’t get any leaks with the new seals. Those look pretty mild, how deep are they?
 
Rubber-lip seals are pretty forgiving, as long as the shaft is smooth. I'd boot-polish with a bit of crocus cloth and carry on.
 
Strecker25 said:
Mine have slight grooves as well but I don’t get any leaks with the new seals. Those look pretty mild, how deep are they?
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Hard to measure, but I can feel them. I'd estimate .005-.010. Like a slight wavy-ness in the surface. The whole surface is pretty smooth, no hard edges.

I ordered a whole new Tides assembly and an additional lip seal based on Tides recommendation. Just hate to get to all this work (its a Beothch getting all the hardware out) and not have a functioning seal.

I'm going to look for a shop to TIG same material on and put it on a lathe.
 
dtfeld said:
Hard to measure, but I can feel them. I'd estimate .005-.010. Like a slight wavy-ness in the surface. The whole surface is pretty smooth, no hard edges.

I ordered a whole new Tides assembly and an additional lip seal based on Tides recommendation. Just hate to get to all this work (its a Beothch getting all the hardware out) and not have a functioning seal.

I'm going to look for a shop to TIG same material on and put it on a lathe.
Click to expand...

That would work.

how bad was it getting the transmission coupler off the shaft? I’m doing my port side seals Friday and dreading getting them apart. The other side sucked
 
The Tides instructions will tell you how to adjust the positioning so there is no side loads on the seal housing, however I felt that the results weren’t that great. I found it easier to get everything in place and then hook the shaft back up to the coupler, then measure up where I wanted the new seal to ride on the shaft and assemble it. I didn’t have to cut the hose to get the seal to ride in a new spot I had polished up, there was room on the shaft log to just push it on a little further. Also, the new hoses were about a 1/4” longer than the old hoses so measuring and checking is important to know where the seal will ride.
Just what I experienced. You might have less room because of the v drives, but just something to consider.
E1A4A4CC-00F0-4678-A824-C709E50842D3.jpeg
 
I talked to a local machine shop, and they did not recommend resurfacing the shaft. Several issues including trouble machining off the new material, and warping the shaft. I think I'll pass and make do as @Riptide III suggests!

I called General Propeller, and they also don't resurface this shaft. They are however the OEM for this shaft, and can machine a new one, if it ever becomes necessary.

If you get the shaft out, there is a couple of lines of dot matrix text right next to the transmission coupler end indicating the part # and GP can look up the spec's and build date. Mine is a 78" x 1-3/4" double taper made from A22 Stainless Steel

A new one machined with a new transmission coupler mated and new hardware is $1950.
 
my3sons said:
The Tides instructions will tell you how to adjust the positioning so there is no side loads on the seal housing, however I felt that the results weren’t that great. I found it easier to get everything in place and then hook the shaft back up to the coupler, then measure up where I wanted the new seal to ride on the shaft and assemble it. I didn’t have to cut the hose to get the seal to ride in a new spot I had polished up, there was room on the shaft log to just push it on a little further. Also, the new hoses were about a 1/4” longer than the old hoses so measuring and checking is important to know where the seal will ride.
Just what I experienced. You might have less room because of the v drives, but just something to consider.
View attachment 122249
Click to expand...

Thanks! This is what I'm going to try. There isn't a whole lot of room to work under the V-Drive, but I think I can make it work. Adding a ruler to the tool kit!
 
In case a 410 owner goes looking for this...

I wonder if this one was already replaced..062404??? Is that a date code? This is a 2001.

20220310_092251.jpg
20220310_092243.jpg
 
I got everything mostly back in place today, and marked off 4 locations where I think the lip seal will ride inbetween the grooves.

I got stuck trying to reinstall the shaft coupling, the key is frozen in place, so its on my bench about to get that resolved.

The marks are in line with the face of the Tides housing, do I should be able to site this up fairly easily, then lock it in place.

Also got a spare lip seal in place, but I'm not sure the carrier will fit...I'll have to sort that out as well.

All new hoses and clamps, and reinstalling the cross feed line.(Some PO removed).

Ready for this to be DONE!!!

20220310_143439.jpg
 
Question.

If this isn't sitting in the best location, would any of you attempt to reposition it while in the water??

I'm not sure that could even be done. Should it be attempted is a whole other question!
 
dtfeld said:
Question.

If this isn't sitting in the best location, would any of you attempt to reposition it while in the water??

I'm not sure that could even be done. Should it be attempted is a whole other question!
Click to expand...

i don’t think it’s that risky to do it. The seal fits snug on the shaft log and as long as the log is clean you shouldn’t have to loosen the clamps very much to get it to move. Just be ready to re tighten the clamps quickly
 
dtfeld said:
Question.

If this isn't sitting in the best location, would any of you attempt to reposition it while in the water??

I'm not sure that could even be done. Should it be attempted is a whole other question!
Click to expand...
Since they're made to allow you to swap seals while in the water, like @Strecker25 mentioned, just be ready to tighten the clamps. You shouldn't need more than a nut driver for the entire operation.
 
I took my props, shafts, couplers all to the prop shop and they did their magic !!!
 
I just pulled our portside today to do our seals. I have a similar groove but they didn’t leak. Knowing my luck the new one will but I’m going to clean it up and reinstall as is.
 
Strecker25 said:
I just pulled our portside today to do our seals. I have a similar groove but they didn’t leak. Knowing my luck the new one will but I’m going to clean it up and reinstall as is.
Click to expand...

Im right there with you. Everything going back together and I’ll deal with it once back in the water.

I got other fish to fry.
 
So its mid March in GA, and its going to be below freezing for the next 24 hours with a low of about 20.

I'm actually going to have to winterize this thing as its sitting in the yard. Grrr. This job is becoming a PITA.
 
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