Fuel options / E10 Ethanol with treatment or Ethanol free?

M

MartellFlorida

New Member
Jan 30, 2012
19
Tampa Bay
Boat Info
1997 270 Sundancer
Engines
7.4 Mercruiser / Bravo II
Hello all,

In the southeast we have the luxury of a year round boating season without the hassels of winterizing. Most of the info I've found on ethanol/E10 fuel and the use of additives is around storage and winterizing. What do you all run year round? I have a trailer, so the ability to get to MUCH cheaper gas (even ethanol free is $.75 cheaper on land) is attractive. In the past, I've only used ethanol free gas and I tend to use my boats at least every other week so I've been fortunate not to encounter any issues. Does anyone use E10 on a regular basis? What are your thoughts on Starbright Star Tron?
Thanks!
TM
 
I'm not 100% sure but, I believe an important issue is E10 can cause a "gumish" film to develop in the newer gasoline tanks...?
 
If you can comfortably get to E-free, go for it. I thought it was unavailable anymore. Otherwise, Startron (or slightly more expensive, but no better, is Stabil Marine) is fantastic and pretty much a "must do".

E will eat away at older (fiberglass) tanks. Al or plastic tanks are fine. Now, if there is already a buildup of gunk in the tank or the lines, then E will soften that and break it up and allow it to go towards the engine. But, that is what is your filter is for and is one of the reasons why you should always keep a spare on board and know how to change it.
 
Bob - I thought the Valvtect was E10, but with the correct additives already in it?
 
The Valvtect gas often times has ethanol in it. But the additive is supposed to help eliminate the issues with e10 much like the other additives, the best solution is use the boat and burn through your fuel.
 
Lazy Daze said:
Bob - I thought the Valvtect was E10, but with the correct additives already in it?
Click to expand...

The 2 marinas where we buy Valvtect both have big banners hanging on them saying ethanol free and I have asked them, but looking at their site it may not be in all areas but you won't need to add startron to it. Thanks for pointing that out.
 
In our travels we see both E-10 and non-E, I recommend and buy non-E when available I also run Startron as well as sometimes I have to buy E-10. My 7.4 cold starts with 3 pumps on non-E and 15 pumps to start on E-10.

MM
 
Bob & Sue said:
The 2 marinas where we buy Valvtect both have big banners hanging on them saying ethanol free and I have asked them
Click to expand...

That's good to know, thanks (and Mike). I had thought it was outlawed everywhere, but maybe it's just outlawed on land? But then again, the OP said he can get it on land. I dunno.:huh:
 
Lazy Daze said:
That's good to know, thanks (and Mike). I had thought it was outlawed everywhere, but maybe it's just outlawed on land? But then again, the OP said he can get it on land. I dunno.:huh:
Click to expand...

No, non-E is not outlawed, it is taxed with a special tax. The feds add a 10 cent tax to each gallon of non-E gasoline sold. (On land, don't know marine fuel law.) In many midwest states some gas stations have off-road non-E pumps or on road non-E pumps. I buy on road 91 octane non-E for about 20 cents more per gallon than 93 octane E-10 on land.

I have a friend in the gas blending and wholsale business, he says 87 octane E-10 is made of 84 octane gasoline and high octane ethanol to get to the 87 octane final blend. The 93 octane is made the same way starting with 90 octane gas and so on. My carbed 7.4 runs and starts WAY better on 91 octane gas over the 93 octane E-10.

MM
 
Here is a good website to keep handy. It has up to date lists of gas stations in every state that sell non ethanol gasoline...

http://pure-gas.org/
 
Thanks, guys. That's good info to know.
 
When you go on pure-gas.org, if you find a station in your area and click on the details tab, you will see recent posts of price and availability. My marina charges $4.85 and a station about 10 miles away charges $3.90 for Ethanol free.
 
[rant]Ethanol Sucks. It was nothing more than a way to buy votes from the farm belt with subsidies from everybody paying taxes. Not one drop of it that I know of comes from this country, it comes from Brazil via the port of Miami. It leaves a larger carbon footprint in production than it saves in consumption. It's a joke we the taxpayer paid for at the pump, grocery store, hardware store....etc..... [/rant]

That said. By the very crude numbers, stay away from it if you can. In non mechanic terms (because I'm not a mechanic); In your engine: Gas and air in the cylinder chamber, piston comes up, a spark goes off, the gas and air go boom, the piston is forced down. The more boom you can get from a given amout of gas, the less gas you need for the same boom.

Summer blend non ethanol gasoline produces 114,500 BTU's per gallon. Summer Blend 10% ethanol laden gasoline produces 111,836 BTU's per gallon. I need energy (in this case BTU's) to move my boat. Gasoline just happens to be the means of conversion here.
Using my boat as an example, I need 22GPH of 10% ethanol laden energy conversion liquid (there is very little non ethanol here) to run a 22 knot cruise.


THEORETICALLY

I have the option of getting non ethanol or 10% ethanol. For the sake of agrument it's the same price.

I'm heading to a weekend destination that is 3 hours away, all cruise speed except for docking.

Using ethanol fuel: That's 22GPH * 3 hours * 111,836 BTU's / GAL / Hour = 7,381,176 BTU's needed for the trip each way.

HOWEVER

Because non-ethanol fuel produces 114,500 BTU's / GAL / Hour, I don't need as much fuel.

7,381,176 BTU's required / 114,500 BTU's / GAL / Hour (non-ethanol) / 3 hours trip duration = 21.48 GPH.

That's a 2.3% increase in fuel economy and that's in pure math theory. Even so......That's a $260 savings over the course of a 100 hour season $4 per gallon. Plus, no additives during the season. No seperation anxiety during layup. Just lots of things eliminated that make ethanol a VLPITA.

In reality, friends who go from FLA to the Islands every year, have more like a consistent 10.5% increase in effeciency. There is no ethanol where he goes.

My 2 cents
 
Valvetech fuels are usually treated with Valvetech additives at the point of retail sale (by the marina, etc where you buy the fuel), not at the distributor level, so if your marina is a Valvetech dealer and buys ethanol free fuel, you will be getting Valetech-ethanol free gas.


A couple of years ago Mercruiser did some extensive testing on ethanol fuel. They discovered that E-10 begins to degrade in about 15 days. While it may store for 6 months or more, it begins to show signs of decreased octane, sludging, water containment etc after 2 weeks.
 
fwebster said:
Valvetech fuels are usually treated with Valvetech additives at the point of retail sale (by the marina, etc where you buy the fuel), not at the distributor level, so if your marina is a Valvetech dealer and buys ethanol free fuel, you will be getting Valetech-ethanol free gas....
Click to expand...

Can you please explain the above. My marina is selling Valvtech at a premium. I was under the impression it was as pure as BP with regards to additive and ethanol content.

I can get non ethanol, but the travel offsets the cost savings in my above equation. However, it may be worth it.

TIA, Frank
 
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