Electronics Upgrade for SR410 DA

[Max]

I have recently purhased a 2000 - SR410da with a complete RayMarine electronics package, albeit 12 year old stuff. I would like to upgrade the Radar and GPS. I operate mainly in the Upper Mississippi area. Present equipment is: Ray Pilot 650; Ray Chart 601xx; R41xx Raster Scanner Radar; Nav 398 GPS; Raydata.

Looking for suggestions on new equipment from anyone that may have done similar upgrades. Obviously would like to use exiting wiring and antenna if at all possible.

Can anyone help here?

Thanks

 

[THJeff]

I just did the same upgrade on the same exact boat. I trashed all the old Raytheon stuff except for the RayPilot 650 as that is still a good functioning autopilot and is capable of being integrated into my new system. I went with the Raymarine e97 as my installer said it was the largest screen that would fit on the dash but as we've dicussed here a few weeks ago you can likely squeeze an e127 in there and get the larger screen. I also got the 48" HD Color array and the Ray218 VHF radio. You can certainly use the existing VHF antenna but you won't need the GPS puck on the port side as the GPS antenna on the e Series is built in to the unit. I put my XM antenna puck on this mast instead preventing it from going unused.

 

[Max]

I have recently purhased a 2000 - SR410da with a complete RayMarine electronics package, albeit 12 year old stuff. I would like to upgrade the Radar and GPS. I operate mainly in the Upper Mississippi area. Present equipment is: Ray Pilot 650; Ray Chart 601xx; R41xx Raster Scanner Radar; Nav 398 GPS; Raydata.

Looking for suggestions on new equipment from anyone that may have done similar upgrades. Obviously would like to use exiting wiring and antenna if at all possible.

Can anyone help here?

Thanks

THJeff:
Thanks for the information. I am a novice at this, is it necessary to replace the Radar antenna? Since you replaced it I assume I would as well.
Could I ask for a ball park of what I am getting into as far as cost? I assume you are happy with everything. Also is there a network of installers out there? I don't know of anyone in my area that would be capable of doing the entire project.
Thanks

 

[mistercomputerman]

www.raymarine.com

You need to find a local dealer who can advise you on this stuff. It can get expensive and it is helpful to have a dealer that can support you.

I just spent about $8,500 or so on replacements including labor.

e127 Multifunction display
p70 autopilot hooked to my existing course computer
i70 multifunction instrument
RD418D radome
SR1000 Sirius weather module (having problems getting to work)
SRA40 Sirius antenna
B60 transducer
some cables
some labor

 

[highball]

I installed a 120 E classic in mine but had to change only the core inside. I was able to keep the 48" Array, wiring.
I installed the new 125 GPS antenna on top of arch with short antenna post and installed a AM?FM antenna where old GPS antenna was.
The 120 E classic was about $1400, The Array core $1000 and GPS antenna $ 225
Hope this helps

 

[THJeff]

I had my guy do my stereo and TVs in addition to the electronics. It was around $8-10K for the electronics piece. You'll need a new array or dome for the e series as I'm sure the 12 year old model isn't compatible.

 

[Throttlejockey]

I just gutted my 380 and was looking at the e140W. No matter how I tried, I couldn't find enough space. For about $200 more I was able to get an e97 AND an e95. Instead of splitting screens, I can run full screen on each and get bigger images. If you are going to upgrade to an array, you are probably going to want look into the Super HD as I am told they will no longer be making the regular HD. With all things being digital these days, I also had to run a new cable from the array to the panel. I kinda went overboard(especially if you ask the Admiral) but we have some longer, ocean bound trips coming up and, hell, you only live once, right?

e97(with sounder) $3000
e95 $2800
AIS650 $800
SR6 Sirius Wx $850
Super HD 48" open array(you'll probably need a new mount if you currently have a radome) $4050
Raymarine 55 VHF $200

I'm not the best mechanic in the world by any means, but with the kind help of a few slipmates, we got it all up and running in a 3 day weekend. If I had a little more experience, ()or had to make fewer trips to the beer store fore the aforementioned help, I probably could have gotten it done sooner.

 

[Max]

Highball - thanks for the information.
I am looking at the e7 or possible the c95 to get a larger display and forgo the touch screen. So far the advice I have been given is that I need to replace the current 48" array with a dome, or new (expensive) HD array. You mention that you kept the 48" array by replacing the core?? Can you explain that in more detail? I can't seem to find anything on that issue.

My current radar display is mounted in a wood grain panel (I think the standard mounting for SR410's of this vintage) - which unlike the other panels on the dash, does not have screws holding it in place. And there doesn't seem to be any easy access from the back. Does this panel snap in - or do I have to figure out a way to get at the back of it?

Thanks for your help, I really appreciate it. There are no RayMarine installers anywhere near me so I have to do this update on my own.

 

[Throttlejockey]

Sounds like your boat may be the same as my 380. I had to take the helm panel off(the one with the switches) and reach behind that panel. There were 4 wing nuts holding the panel with the plotter into the dash.

 

[Max]

Sounds like your boat may be the same as my 380. I had to take the helm panel off(the one with the switches) and reach behind that panel. There were 4 wing nuts holding the panel with the plotter into the dash.

Thanks, I thought maybe that was the way I would have to go at it but was hoping something easier would surface.

Did you have any problem getting a new cable from the plotter up to the antenna (assuming it is on your arch like mine). I think once I get the panel off, and can get the cable ran, the rest should be pretty simple.

 

[Throttlejockey]

I took the access panel in the arch off, the Chart holder/cup holder next to the helm seat and tied the new to the old and fed it around. Went fairly easily.

 

[highball]

Hi Max
I replaced the core inside the Array. this is the brain of the antenna. It is a very simple replacement. Just open the Array with the 4 bolts and inside there is a grey box with 2 red wires and 2 black that you unscrew with tiny flat screwdriver and pull the flat pug off. you the unbolt the core ( grey box) and carefull not to bend pin that goes inside box. Then do the reverse for installation of new one. All wiring is the same and plugs into the 120 E classic. Will try and send pics of screen install early next week. Don't know where you live but I was dealling with a company in Mississauga Ontario Canada

 

[Max]

Hi Max
I replaced the core inside the Array. this is the brain of the antenna. It is a very simple replacement. Just open the Array with the 4 bolts and inside there is a grey box with 2 red wires and 2 black that you unscrew with tiny flat screwdriver and pull the flat pug off. you the unbolt the core ( grey box) and carefull not to bend pin that goes inside box. Then do the reverse for installation of new one. All wiring is the same and plugs into the 120 E classic. Will try and send pics of screen install early next week. Don't know where you live but I was dealling with a company in Mississauga Ontario Canada

Thanks, that sound pretty simple. I asked a supplier about the "core" and he wasn't familiar with it as an individual piece, said it was the entire antenna. Can you elaborate on the "core" and where you got it? Thanks

 

[highball]

The core is the brain of the radar. Inside the base part you have the core (brain) and motor to turn Array. As I said I only replaced the core and all fit to my E120 Classic. I was lucky when I bought the new core to install someone was looking for a core like the one I had and sold it to him for half the price of the one I bought.
Here is the info of the guy I delt with.
He is exellent and was great help for info


Lorne Spence
CMC Electronics Mississauga

3600B Laird Rd, Unit 12
Mississauga, ON L5L 6A7
P: (905) 607-4262 x230

 

[La Maddalena]

Can you clarify info on the core (analog vs. digital)? The new multifunction displays and radar are all digital, and my circa 2003 Raymarine Pathfinder radar, 4 ft array and MFD are analog. My understanding is the radome or array on the older analog systems need to be completely replacedwith a new digital model when you install a new digital MFD. Does the core replacement change the array from analog to digital? You mention your "E120 Classic" - are you still using an analog MFD and an analog array with new core?

 

[Max]

The core is the brain of the radar. Inside the base part you have the core (brain) and motor to turn Array. As I said I only replaced the core and all fit to my E120 Classic. I was lucky when I bought the new core to install someone was looking for a core like the one I had and sold it to him for half the price of the one I bought.
Here is the info of the guy I delt with.
He is exellent and was great help for info


Lorne Spence
CMC Electronics Mississauga

3600B Laird Rd, Unit 12
Mississauga, ON L5L 6A7
P: (905) 607-4262 x230

Highball: Thanks for the contact information. I spoke with Lorne and he was very helpful. Unfortunately, 41xx series that we have (2000 vintage) is not upgradeable with the core change out. Too bad as that would have made things much easier and the 48" array would probably be better than a new dome. In any case, it looks like I will have to settle for the dome, can't justify the extra cost for array for boating on the Mississippi river.

 

[highball]

Sorry Max it didn't work for you. I think I had the R80 radar chartplotter in mine and the boat is a 2000 model.
I'm sure if you have any more questions about radar and stuff Lorne will do the best to help you

La Maddalena yes i had analog system before and the E120 Classic is still a Analog system. I wanted the larger colour Chartplotter and since I had a Array on top wanted it to work but as per using the radar it is nice but not a nessecity where we boat till we retire.
This replacement didnt cost me an arm and leg and I had a fully great fonctional for my needs.

 

[Max]

I have nearly completed my installation and wanted to post the procedure and possibly save someone else a lot of time and headache.

First of all, my vessel is a 2000 Sea Ray 410 DA. It has the full electronics package from the factory. RayPilot 650, RayChart 601xx, R41xx Raster Scanner, Nav 398 GPS, and Raydata. All I am replacing at this time is the Radar - however the new system incorporates GPS. It also has Sea Talk network. The new equipment I choose is the Raymarine C95 MFD RD424D Digital Dome.

I'll start with the removal of the existing display, which is probably the hardest part of the installation. I contacted Sea Ray directly and the information they provide is not correct. The display is mounted in a wood grain panel with no accessible front mounting screws. The information I got from Sea Ray was that there are wing nuts on the back of the wood grain panel that must be removed in order to get the display out. Now that is a lot easier said than done. If you remove the main switch panel at the helm, you can insert your arm and barely reach the two wing nuts on the right side of the panel (as you face it). However, it is virtually impossible to reach around to the left side as the display is about 12” deep and unless your arm has multiple swivel points in addition to the standard elbow, there is virtually no way to get to those wing nuts.

The good news (or maybe bad news) is that removing those wing nuts won’t help you remove the display – so don’t bother at this point. The display itself has a lever on each side that locks it into place, securing it to both the wood grain panel and the ships structure at the same time. Again, accessing from the main switch panel, you can reach the lever on the right side of the display, but not the left side.

Since my vessel is also equipped with auto pilot and ray chart, both of which are mounted directly below the radar display, I figured removing one of those would allow access from below and maybe I could reach the left side of the display. Another point easier said than done. The auto pilot is also mounted from the back making it very difficult to remove. There are two L shaped brackets that are attached to sides the auto pilot. Using a mirror going in from the switch panel opening, I could at least see what I was up against. After about an hour of reaching, I was finally able to remove the right side screw (using 10mm open end wrench and finger tips). Another hour or so I finally got the left side screw out. Now with both side screws out of the pilot it slides right out. I have no idea what the engineer that designed this was thinking, other than he would never have to complete this procedure. Now having an access hole almost directly below the radar display, I was able to reach up to the left side of it and turn the locking latch. There is a large plastic headed screw that attaches the latch to the display, which also has to be removed from both sides. Finally, with the screws and locking latches removed, I was able to slide the display out. The wood grain panel actually stays in place but you can easily remove that now as the wing nuts mentioned earlier are very accessible. Replacing the auto pilot is now simple as I have the hole with the radar display came out which is about a foot square for access right above it.

Removing the old raster scanner is no big deal other than it is quite heavy. There is a large access panel in the radar arch directly below. Mounting the new dome was also no big problem. However, the cable is an entirely different story. There was some mention of using the old cable to pull the new one – forget that. Sea Ray buys cable ties buy the thousands and uses them everywhere – the old cable is secured in places you can’t even see. If you try pulling, you will most likely pull some other cable along with it, the results of which you may not like.

I don’t know if the stereo on my vessel is standard, but there is a speaker about half way up the radar arch, and another larger one (sub woofer) below the seat, somewhat inline below the arch. I removed both of those speakers. Feeding from the opening below the dome down to the first speaker is simple. You may think that going from there to the bottom would be easy, but no such luck. The radar arch is attached to the vessel in such a way that there isn’t a channel all the way to the bottom. So inserting my head (using a miners head lamp) I could see the hole where several cables pass up into the arch. The hole is about 2 ft above where you can put your head through the speaker hole, and since there are other cables passing through the hole, there isn’t much room. By the way, the speaker access hole only allows you put one body part through at a time, either your head or your arm, but not both. I used a metal electricians fish tape, with my head through the hole, working the fish tape with my fingers outside the hole, finally got it pointed at the hole and pushed it up, eventually getting it to the speaker hole mid way up the arch. Pulling the cable from there down is difficult as the hole at the bottom of the arch is very tight, but it will go through.

There is a large storage bin directly next to the captains seat, which when removed allows access both directions. From there you can shove the fish tape back to the bottom speaker area and pull the cable. Routing to the left of the storage bin, up and behind the main instrument panel is pretty easy and then you finally have the cable ran to the new display.

My vessel is equipped with Sea Talk and I suspect that was standard at the time it was built. The new equipment also uses sea talk, however it appears that the older sea talk is not compatible with the new sea talk systems. At least the jury is still out on that point, I am trying to get information from Ray Marine, which is about as difficult as installation of the system. You can do a direct connect from the dome to the display, using the provided adapter. However there is another cable (and another 50 bucks) needed to accomplish that task.

Last but not least, the old display is much larger than the new c95 (9 inch) so obviously the old wood grain panel isn’t going to work. You can order a blank panel from a Sea Ray dealer and cut it to the size of your new display. Sea Ray web site has parts manuals for older boats and the part number is out there. Nothing that another $275 can’t fix.

I have not connected power to my unit yet as I am waiting for the cable (above mentioned cable for direct connection). Once I have that I should be able to power on hopefully everything will work.

I hope that by posting all this information I will have saved someone a lot of time.

 

[sellnit]

Good luck, can't wait to see the pictures when you are done!