Electrical switch help!

[rbh235]

I have a 2002 280 Sundancer. The Starboard side switch panel which controls my windless, nav lights, stereo, horn, all of my lights plus a few other items, has benn giving big problems!! They literally work when they feel like it. They all started malfunctioning at the same time. When I push the horn in it sometimes stays blasting when I let go of the button. My mechanic thinks there may be a master relay for the whole board... Any help would be GREAT!
Daddy's Toy.

 

[Four Suns]

I assume you are talking about a switch panel at the helm and not down in the cabin... since you mentioned the horn. Although not on a 280, I assume it is a panel like this (conceptually... yours is probably a different shape):

I would unscrew the thing from the helm and take a peak behind it. I've had several wires come loose out of their crimped on fittings for the spade connectors on the switches and if you have a loose hot wire bouncing around, it can cause problems. The way these things are wired is there is a common hot wire that is daisy chained on the switches and the switch then turns the juice on or off from that hot wire to the respective circuit. If you've had any of the crimped on fittings come loose for this hot wire and it periodically completes circuits or provides or doesn't provide power to the downstream switches, that can be easily fixed.

The ground wire that feeds the Sea Ray Systems Monitor (LCD screen) is connected to a spade connector on the panel I show above. The same thing happened where the crimped on fitting fell off the wire and the systems monitor got all stupid on me. When I checked the other wires behind that panel, I believe there were 3 others (hot wires at that) that just fell out of the crimped connectors... I spent a little time with it and re did a few of the connectors and have been trouble free ever since...

Anyway... pull it off and take a peak... it may be a 10 minute fix.

 

[Turtlesboat]

he's got the retarded panels like mine

they are those pressure pad thingy's. could just be dirty contacts. Like Gary said, could be as simple as some loose wires on the back or gunk on the pressure pads. I do hear relays when I push the buttons but haven't located where they are yet.

 

[Four Suns]

Sorry... didn't realize that Sea Ray put a bunch of proprietary switch gizmos on the 280... Looks like a Vulcan ship to me. Just ignore my post then.

 

[Turtlesboat]

yeah, I'm not looking forward to WHEN these panels go. I hate stuff that can't be fixed. I'm sure they aren't cheap either. If you are good with a multimeter, you can see if it's the relay(s) that's the problem or if it's the pad itself.

 

[boatmailster]

This is one of the main reasons sea ray has moved away from the switch pad. In every case I have heard of, the whole switch pad had to be replaced. Sorry for the bad news. The contacts are all sealed on the back, and it resembles a computer circuit board, so there is really not anything to attempt to fix behind the pad itself.

Problem is that there is no way to pinpoint cause. Most likely keypad is bad, but there is a chance that distribution/breaker box is going bad (those boxes went thru few revision before SR stop using them, they have relays permanently mounted to circuit board). Easiest way to check is to borrow working keypad and plug to system (without removing old one) to verify that switch pad is a problem.

 

[rbh235]

Thanks for all of the responces!!

I ended up pulling the whole switchpad off which was very easy. There is only 5 nuts under the dash and 1 harness with 4 wires in it to pull off. It took less thean 2 minutes. I turns out that the back of this sealed unit is cracked and must have gotten moisture inside. The Marinemax dealer near me is trying to locate the part which is $381.00.

Hopefully that is the problem... I'll let you know.

 

[Nehalennia]

Thanks for all of the responces!!

I ended up pulling the whole switchpad off which was very easy. There is only 5 nuts under the dash and 1 harness with 4 wires in it to pull off. It took less thean 2 minutes. I turns out that the back of this sealed unit is cracked and must have gotten moisture inside. The Marinemax dealer near me is trying to locate the part which is $381.00.

Hopefully that is the problem... I'll let you know.

That sucks. I have a similar, but smaller pad. It should be a $10 part and 20 minute repair for with a switch like Gary has, but $381 sounds better, because those Modular blob look more "Stylish" or whatever was the reasoning.

I'm lucky I already have a spare pad.

 

[Henry Boyd]

I have been doing some research on these things myself. The switchpad actually works in combination with what Sea Ray calls an EIM ('Electronic Interface Module'). On the 2002 280 there is one EIM for each of the switchpads. The starboard switchpad connects to the EIM on the starboard side of the helm behind the little trap door under the shift throttle control. The port switchpad is connected to the EIM on the port side in the ER above the batteries.

The EIM does the actual circuit switching. The switchpad communicates with the EIM when a button is pressed providing an on/off message and ID on the switch. The EIM takes this data and actuates the correct relay. This why when the main battery switch is turned off, all of the switchpad settings revert to off. The EIM resets to all circuits off when it is powered down.

Wacky behavior of the switchpad can also be caused by the EIM going bad. Since electrical parts have a no money back clause, do a little research/troubleshooting on the EIM before committing to buy a $381 part that you might not need, and can't return.

Henry

 

[corsairt]

I just had both keypads/switch panels go inopertive on my 2001 280 Sundancer. Didn't affect the engine ignition rockers on the port keypad as they have seperate connectors on back. Only indication on the keypads is that all the green dot lights flash on for a second on both keypads as house battery knob is rotated on, or the forward EIM breaker is reset to on. All connectors and cables look good, and no sign of damage/corrosion inside the forward EIM. Even swapped 5A pin breakers inside EIM to no effect. Also replaced 5A fuse in forward EIM. Will next try removing right keypad to inspect back.
Anybody know where a master relay for the EIMs may be located?
Noted on other postings a price of $381 for the keypad and/or for the EIM. Which one is the high price? Or both?

 

[RiverRat]

That sucks. I have a similar, but smaller pad. It should be a $10 part and 20 minute repair for with a switch like Gary has, but $381 sounds better, because those Modular blob look more "Stylish" or whatever was the reasoning.

I'm lucky I already have a spare pad.

Isn't it nice to know people with spare parts!!!:grin:

 

[corsairt]

I just had both keypads/switch panels go inopertive on my 2001 280 Sundancer. Didn't affect the engine ignition rockers on the port keypad as they have seperate connectors on back. Only indication on the keypads is that all the green dot lights flash on for a second on both keypads as house battery knob is rotated on, or the forward EIM breaker is reset to on. All connectors and cables look good, and no sign of damage/corrosion inside the forward EIM. Even swapped 5A pin breakers inside EIM to no effect. Also replaced 5A fuse in forward EIM. Will next try removing right keypad to inspect back.
Anybody know where a master relay for the EIMs may be located?
Noted on other postings a price of $381 for the keypad and/or for the EIM. Which one is the high price? Or both?

Finally fixed problem by buying a replacement forward EIM ($456+) from SeaRay. Luckily, I didn't have to order the difficult to find aft EIM ($477+) that would have been non-returnable. SeaRay claims no diagnosis or parts replacement capability inside the EIMs although I opened them up and numerous fuses and breakers were simple plug in's. I still suspect that the voltage regulator and/or processor went bad so no grounding for any switch or item. Too bad SeaRay won't bother with an EIM repair program.

 

[FourGone]

I'm having an issue with my switch pad as well. Fuelled up the otehr day and could not run the blower, and the nav lights wouldn't activate. Talked to SeaRay dealer locally, and in Seatle. The parts are "no longer supported"! So, until I find a way to run the blower, nav lights, water pump, horn, etc.etc. I guess I'm floating at the dock on a beautiful July weekend.

Come on SeaRay :smt100- this is a major switch module that controls all the safety systems on the vessel.

I'm going to pull it apart today, treat it with contact cleaner, and see what happens.
Todd, you could probably make some extra cash with an auction on your spare!

More when I know more.

 

[FourGone]

Well, still DOW (dead on water) with the switch issue. pulled the switch pad off, cleaned what I could, and put all back together. it worked - no problems! Set out on an overnight cruise to a local area, anchored, powered down, enjoyed dinner and refreshments. time to clean up - water pump won't turn on. Anchor light won't turn on, general malfunction. Powered down the whole system at the battery switch. Turned on again, and .... everything worked. Next morning anchor light won't turn off. tried the "reset" with the battery switch -nothing. go for a row and a hike. return, try the "reset". it works. Head for the dock. At the dock, non-functional again and "reset" won't work.
Called Searay dealer next day. Ordered part ( based on new part number, - FYI - Part Number in the parts manua from the SeaRay archive is "no longer supported" as the Grayhill mfr listed on my part stopped making them in '00 - now made for SeaRay by DNA Group). No parts in SeaRay inventory, likely need to have them made when SeaRay gets enough orders! could be 4 to six weeks or more - puts me smack in the middle of September - hence the DOW comment!

Picked up a couple clues from other posts here about EIMs, and am going to check all the grounding points I can find and see if that puts these gremlins to rest.

Again, I'll update when I know more.

And in the meantime, if anyone has some additional experience solving this issue, I'd love to hear it.

BTW, has anyone noticed that all new SeaRays have rocker switches? Hmmmm.

 

[FourGone]

Problem resolved - I still have a boating season. Here is what I've learned from this issue.

Get the wiring diagram from the SEARAY.COM archieves. The wirng diagram for my 260DA shows the Eletrical Interface Module, and the SwitchPad, and the next page shows the pin connectors along with the voltage.

One the '01 260DA, there are six wires that lead from the Switchpad (S) to the Eletronic Interface Module (E) 24 pin connector. Voltage shows that on E-Pin 5 to S Pin 6 it should be battery voltage - 13.4 v on a full charge, and that on E Pin 24 to S Pin 1 it should be 5 volts going into the processor chip. When I tested this, I got 12 volts on the E Pin 24. Conclusion - 5 volt regulator on the EIM was toast.

SeaRay came through - new EIM and Switchpad arrived today!:smt038 - 2.5 weeks of waiting.

Installed the new EIM first. Measured 4.99 volts at the E Pin 24 - right on spec. Connected the harness to the old switchpad and everything worked, and the LEDs all lit as they should - :thumbsup:

To measure the voltage I used a safety pin, and shoved it down the top of the pin plug connectors next to the wire, then touched the digital voltmeter (pos) to the wire and to the common ground (neg). I didn't want to penetrate the wire jacket, as that is a recipe for corrosion and a failed wiring harness in no time around the salt.

More of what I've learned - when the switchpads malfuction, its most likley a symtom, not the real problem. Go for the EIM as the main culprit as most of the gremlins live in there!

And, there is generally a good amount of information on the CSR forums, and hopefully what I've added will help others to a more accurate and speedy correction on this fairly common problem.

And when I picked up the part I checked a bunch of new '09 SeaRays - no digital switchpads, all toggles. Again I say Hmmm!

And now I can throw off the lines and be confident the safety systems will work as they should for the rest of this boating season.