Changing trans fluid in Hurth V-Drive

M

mrsrobinson

Well-Known Member
Mar 9, 2006
7,704
Virginia
Boat Info
2001 380DA
Engines
Caterpillar 3126
1995 Sea Ray 330 DA with Hurth V-Drives.

We are starting our 3rd year with the boat. She came with Jasper Long Blocks, which now have approx 140 hours on them. The tran coolers were replaced when the engines were installed, all by the previous owner. I do not know if the fluids were changed then. I do not see anything noted on the engine bill so my assumption is the trans fluid was not changed then (September 2005).

I have never changed trans fluid. My assumption is a I can pump it out just like I do the engine oil, tube/pump, thru the dipstick tube? Are there any filters/screens that need to be replaced? What kind of trans fluid and how much for each? How often (hours/time) should one change the trans fluid?

Do I have a trans and a "gear" box, and do both need fluid or do they share fluids?

Thanks,
 
I would strongly sugeest you get the tranny numbers and then go to the ZF/Hurth site and download the service files.
 
It probably is a goof idea to get the Hurth-ZF owner's manual for your model transmissions and do as it instructs. Hurth-ZF makes transmissions with and without filter and some of those that have them use washable screen type filteration while others use disposable spin on filters.

The washable screens can be cleaned in mineral spirits and air dried overnight.....not with compressed air.

As far a the frequency of fluid changes, I make it a practice to change mine at least annually. It won't begin to get dirty in that length of time, but the transmission gear case is vented to the atmosphere so moist air is in the transmission in the air above the fluid. That much air will condense moisture as the temperature changes and changing the fluid is the only way to remove the fluid and other contaminants. Sucking it out with a dip tube on a pump thru the dipstick hole is one way to remove the fluid. That is worrysome and slow, so I hade some hosed made up that attach to the transmission drain hole in the pan so now I hook the pump up to a 1/2" hose instead of waiting for the pump to suck the oil out of a 1/4" tube which really speeds up the process.
 
Good idea to contact ZF Hurst as Chad and Frank suggest.

Our boat was new to us in May '07 and in the process of getting up to speed with systems I asked the Caterpillar tech what he would use as fluid in my trans. He said #30 oil which is incorrect. I learned from ZF Hurst that have ZF80 Transmissions which is the new number for HSW800. I will be replacing the fluid and filter after launch in April when I can run the engines and heat up the fluid for removal.

At the time I spoke with Jonathan in Customer Service at Hurst and he was very helpful pointing out the correct fluids (ATF) and e-mailing me both the repair and operating manuals. He was very helpful and took lots of time to describe things - reminding me that I am a customer and entitled to this level of support!

I was impressed and you will be too.. Good luck.
Warren
 
Warren,

If you have put SAE 30 oil in the 800 series transmissions, don't run the boat with that oil in them. It is a lubricating oil and it may damage the clutches, pumps and valves since it has completely different characteristics than ATF. If i were you, I would pump the fluid out during the winter months, then remove the drain plugs in the gear cases with a shallow pan under them and let them drip for a week or so. Then close the transmissions up and refill them with ATF.

In the spring, run the boat for a short while to circulate the transmission oil then change it again to purge all the SAE 30.
 
Thanks for your concern Frank but please re-read my post. The Cat tech he WOULD have put SAE30 in the trans. But I did not. Hurst gave me the correct information.
Warren
 
I went to AutoZone with the manual today. Of the 75 choices in the manual, they don't carry any. Our local Marine store doesn't carry any. Yamaha marine doesn't carry any. Chevron gas station doesn't carry the right ones. The local Chevron import station on the water doesn't carry the right kind. Our local SR dealer uses "Carquest" ATF with Mercon III - That isn't one of the choices in the manual. He asked what the manual suggested - I gave him some examples. He said they didn't know that it was sooooo specific.

Examples:
Castrol - TQ-D; ATF; TQ Dexron III F
Mobil - ATF 220 D...; ATF F...;
Valvoline - Multi Purpose ATF; ATF Type D
Penzoil ATF F-30110
 
PS - I have a round cannister on top of the side of the transmission with a 6mm hex top bolt securing the cover. This houses the filter. What kind of filter will this be, cleanable metal or disposable paper?

Hurth ZF 63 IV
 
John,

Dexron III is what I use.......here:

http://www.valvoline.com/pages/products/product_detail.asp?product=64

Any brand name ATF sold at a quality parts house that specifies it as Dexron III is ok....the label may say Dexron/Mercon.

If you remove the cap with the allen bolt in it and pull the screen filter out from top and you should find a filter that is all metal and looks like a screen wound around and around inside the filter body. You can wash it out in mineral spirits, shake the solvent out, let it air dry over night and reinstall it.
 
Thanks, Frank.

The book makes it seem like you have to pick one of these 75 types (I just counted - it's over 150 to choose from, but non are normal - see examples above), many of which are very similar to the auto brands, but the names are not exactly the same. I'll go back and get the DIII or MIII. Also, thanks for the info about the filter. Sea Ray wants $107ea for them. They only have one. It's marked $64 because they've had it so long. That should have been my first hint that they were reusable.
 
There marked 64.00 because thats what you would pay from hurth or zf. They are marking them up big time. I didnt have luck at autozone either so I get it all at walmart. Penzoil atf d/III
 
Greg,

You probably have Hurth 630V transmissions. They take 5 qts of Dext. III fluid. The filter kit <includes filter & 2 o-rings> is part #3312199031 from Transmission Marine Inc <954-467-1540, Marinegears.com>. I got 2 for $110 and that included shipping. They have been great for info and parts.

The filter is on the port side on top. Look for a t-handle. Unscrew it and pull off the top. The filter is underneath. Wipe off the top so when you remove the cover no dirt/debris falls into the tranny. I've had better sucess sucking the fluid out from the hole under the filter vs the dipstick hole. I get 5 qts out and put 5 back <that's the only fluid they need>. I re-fill through the dispstick hole using a clean funnel. I've heard varying timing on when to change the fluid & filter. It varies from 100 hrs to 300 hrs. I've always changed mine at 100, but the fluid looks fine and I have never seen an particles in the filter.

The filter kits are expensive. I've always replaced mine, but Trans. Marine said that if there were no metal particles you could clean the filters with mineral spirts and re-use. I might try that next time.

And these transmissions usually get good review. "Maintain them and they will last forever" is a frequent comment I hear. I have 1,500 hours on mine with only fluid changes. I did change the coolers & hoses last year as a preventative maintenace item. It should cost approx $130-$140 to do both transmission <if you change the filters> and about an hour or 2 of time.
 
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I mentioned a conversation that I had with Hurst several months ago in an earlier post. They confirmed exactly what Franks says that any good DIII or MIII brand of ATF is fine and not to take the manual too literally. I didn't know that the strainer is reuseable though - great information, THANKS!
Warren
 
The reason the AFT types listed in the manual are so difficult to follow or find for that matter is that you are working with a manual written in a country that is non-English speaking. Many of the types listed are confusing becasue they are getting the AFT name and SAE specifications designation both in the manual recommendations.

Any good Dexron III ttype ATF from a premium manufacturer works, but this is an area where spending more money to ge a brand may be best because the additive package in the ATF is a large part of the cost and you would want to use a premium additive pack to combat foaming, corrosion, moisture effects, etc. as opposed to a store brand that was formulated to sell at a low price.

Sea Ray dealers mark up parts by 100%. If you are intent on replacing the washable screen, then there are several online sources........but, unless you have a damaged filter or a load of metal in yours I have to wonder why you would replace one. Mine are 10 years old and all I've ever done is clean mine and replace the transmission fluid every year.
 
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I bought 12 quarts of Castrol ATF for multiple automotive use / domestic with Mercon/Dexron III (/IIE) and qualifies for "H".

Any problems before I soak my Transmi's?

I also bought 2 863832T Oil Coolers for $213ea. I bought these at marine power service . com. I searched the web for the part number, and read the prices in the search window. When I actually went to their site, the price was dated, but I called them, quoted the web page, and they honored it.

http://www.psepmarineparts.biz/store/mercruiser_oil_coolers.htm

http://www.marinepowerservice.com/B...0508/block_nbr/230/Doc_Part_nbr/889342001.cfm $216

All parts are OEM.

http://ishopmarine.com/partList/0/4/C0058936/MM~A0000004~M0002696~M0002700~C0058936 $204

I also ordered 2 serpentine belts for comfort - $43 each.
 
We do have Hurth HS 630 V1 vee drives. Anyone have the contact info for Hurth?

Thanks,
 
I spoke with Customer Service at ZF-Hurth at 954-581-4040, a very helpful rep named Jonathan. His e-mail is Jonathan.Lucco@zf.com
Have your transmission model numbers available when you call.

I suggest that a phone call is best as he was very generous with his time in educating me on my transmissions and answering all of my questions thoroughly on the spot.
Good luck,
Warren
 
Please do tell. What did you learn?
 
I learned that my transmissions, HSW800, have been renamed ZF80. The previous owner did not provide any literature or manuals so he detailed the routine maintenance procedures. I also obtained the Repair Manual and Operating Manual for my transmissions. He also told me that the Cat tech who told me that he would have used SAE30 oil in my transmissions was very wrong - that alone was worth the call, don't you think?
Cheers,
Warren
 
Yes I do. I run HSW630's by the old designation, but they are called ZF 63 IV's since my boat was built. Though not as heavy as the 80's, they are significantly beefier than the next smaller version.
 
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