Amberjack 290 (02) DC panel question.

[purplehayes]

I am still learning about my boats electrical system and thought I would ask here for a few ideas of what I am seeing as it is not covered in any of the manuals.

This is what I have noticed... I have three batteries the aft two are the House batteries (aft switch on the batt panel), the forward battery is the start battery (fwd switch on batt panel)... anyway.

When I turn on the forward battery the DC panel and Volt meter come alive shall we say. (I didnt test with the house batteries off as well but I will tomorrow) Anyway, when I turn on the fans and the lights shall we say the DC panel is showing a drop in Volts... it will continue to drop with the lights on and stuff even though the shore power is on and the AC Converter is on charging. Anyway on to my questions....

It is my understanding that the Start battery is not supposed to do anything except start the engines. So my question is why is it that with the Start battery turned on that the DC V meter is showing volts and why do they drop as the system is loaded... is this showing that my system is not rigged properly, are the house batteries not hooked in properly or... ???... or is it all normal and just my lack of knowledge.

Anyway, any ideas or info would be greatly appreciated.

Cheers


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[GrandMaster]

Are you sure you dont have two start batteries since you have twins??

 

[searsb]

I am not sure about this, but on my 290 Amberjack the battery connection to the forward switch also feeds some basic functions of the boat, dash , lighting as indicated by the breakers on the starboard circuit board as well as serving as the start battery for my gen and port engine.
The battery connected to the rear switch rear does provide juice for some of the higher demand items, ie blowers, refrig,etc. as well as starting the starboard engine. This is how it was originally setup by Sea ray and is what the manual shows atleast for 2001.

 

[purplehayes]

Hey Guys

Thanks for the posts. I was curious so also phoned a dealership service department and picked his ear a bit.

Apparently: (I still need to dig into the manuals to see the wiring as I still think something is not quite right but...)

With the AJ's or SeaRays (assuming twin engine configurations) the three batteries work something like this. The FWD switch controls the "start" battery, the AFT switch controls the two "House" batteries. The Starboard engine will be started by the "start" battery. I tested this and when only the FWD switch was on I was able to start the Starboard engine and not the Port engine. I had the engine instruments but not the panel electrics like radar, radio, nav lights.... I did have, however, the cabin lights and all of the DC equipment downstairs.... which I believe is wrong as this battery is meant to be the one to start the engine and be able to start it when you are on the water if you run the system down. It is also "linked" to the Port engine using the "EMERG START" switch on panel. But for me this means that I should be starting the Starboard engine first (in my opinion).

Anyway, the AFT switch did the opposite, I was able to start the PORT engine and not the Starboard, I had no house items downstairs and all of my dash electronics and panel items worked but I had no engine instruments.

This kind of makes sense from an aviators perspective with the exception of the fact that house items should of worked with the house battery switch. It makes sense to me that to preserve your starting capability that you are able to disconnect the "Start" battery from the system and save its power for purely starting the engines, however, my boat is not currently rigged that way. I will look at the schematics but outside of that difference it seems to make sense providing that you can use the electrics while turning off the start battery switch. It also makes sense that your primary start battery bus will have the engine instruments as well as the engine start capability on it.

Cheers

Edit: I have been looking at the wiring schematics. It looks to me as though the boat is not designed really as 'house' and 'start'. The big bank of batteries (two of the three) are referred to as the Starboard batteries while the other battery is the Port battery. The EMERG START switch combines all batteries and can be used in either direction with the manual saying start the engine which has battery starting capability first.... So based on the schematics and my boat then it sort of is making sense, the "starboard" batteries are the house batteries, they are the bigger bank of batteries and power the Starboard Engine starting as well as the electrics on the DC panel, lights and radio and things. and the other battery powers basically the starting of the Port engine and whatever you power on the console. Still not sure if this is all correct.

 

[searsb]

purplehayes,

I believe you are correct in your analysis of the battery setup by Searay on the Amberjack. Most people do talk about a setup with a start battery bank and a house battery bank which provides better isolation and protection from a dead battery. Searay just didn't set it up that way.

I have had this boat 2 years now and have experienced some issue with dead batteries and starting sequence. (Once I replaced the batteries and charger I haven't had any issues.) After a day on the hook w/o running gen or sitting on lift 3-4 wks between use, I first had to start the generator, allow it to run 10-15 min, then start the port engine, then the starboard engine using the emergency start button to draw current from both battery banks. This always worried me for fear of completely discharging the "start" battery for the gen. I added a second battery to that bank and replaced all the 3 batteries and faulty charger, but I would still feel better with a dedicated start battery at least for the gen that could be isolated from the other systems on the boat and used to start an engine in the event the other batteries are drained. That being said, I have run the refrig, vhf, gps and anchor light on DC over night all night without a problem. I do run the gen first thing in the morning prior to starting engines as insurance that the batteries have sufficent charge for starting and allow complete charging as we run during the day.

There is a good thread on one of these boards , with diagrams to rewire, and isolate for a starting bank and house bank, but I have been too lazy to do it, I just keep my tow Ins paid up

 

[GrandMaster]

FWIW, the port battery (on/off batt switch) on my boat does nothing but start the port engine and the 2 stbd batteries can start the stbd engine as well as act as house batteries depending on how the 1/2/Both battery switch is set.

Any battery can stary any engine if you have the "Emergency Start" botton pressed

 

[purplehayes]

Hey Everyone,

Thanks for the posts I was down at the boat today for the whole day working on engine stuff and decided to test my theory. I used only the Starboard battery (FWD switch) and as the Grandmaster indicated this was able to power all of my DC house items, radio, head, water pump, lights, etc etc... I left the port battery off so effectively isolated the Port battery and used all of my comfort items that I needed.

I now feel confident that though it is not setup as House and Start it really works that way. I can isolate the PORT when on the water or at anchor and just use the Starboard for my house items. I still need to check the starting of the generator though as well as the DC function of the fridge but think I have it sorted and am confident that the boat is wired as per my schematics.

Thanks again for the post folks.

 

[searsb]

GrandMaster,
On the 290 AJ's there are 2 battery switches mounted above deck in compartment locker on the starboard side in a forward and aft configuration. Both are on /off only.
I believe the forward switch operates the starboard battery bank/ engine and the aft switch operate the port bank/engine. And yes using the emergency switch allows both banks of batteries to be used to start either engine. Both banks are wired and isolated to allow for a dual bank charger when connected to shore power or running the gen.
I also believe they are isolated from each other when charging off the alternators ie) port engine running only charges port battery bank. Not sure about that but that what seams to happen from my experience.

I wish I had a switch to isolate at least one battery from the on board DC systems, but the circuit breakers for various items are split between the 2 battery banks on the control board of each switch. Both battery switches have to be on for all the various systems to operate. Bilge Blowers, high water bilge pump on aft switch bank,/ lights, freshwater pump and some other electronics on forward bank. Not sure this was a wise way to wire ( easier to write than say) these battery banks originally but that's how Sea Ray did it in 2001.

Do you or anyone else have any other suggestions for managing the power usage or allocation of batteries within this setup or am I missing something that would make things a lot easier to prevent draining both battery banks completely.
I would never do such a thing, but I have son's who tend to go brain dead at times