Almost Free Boat

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William Miller

Member
Mar 16, 2007
327
Darnestown, Maryland
Boat Info
290 AJ
Engines
Twin Mercruiser 300 hp Bravo III
I have a good friend who I recently caught up with.
He has non SR boat (1995 Carver Mariner 330) that he owns with his brother-in-law for 4-5 years.
Like many of new boaters the experience has been less than pleasurable. Supprisingly the only complaint that I didn't hear was about the boat itself. Now that they've tried the boating "thing". The have realized that it's too much work vs. reward.

They are doing very well otherwise.

He suggested to me that if he could just give the boat away, he would. He mentioned this in front of his wife and they are both on board.

His contract at the marina is beyond the contract date and he techicanally owes transient slip fees.

I may pay him something for the boat, but need to get it hauled and surveyed just so I don't end up with a big problem.

I also don't want to end up with something that might have e lien on it. (Is it possible that if I buy the boat that I could be stuck with some old bills from the marina or others?
Not enough money for a broker to want to help. I know Boat US has a settlement department that helps with transactions.

Looking for advice on the process.
I especially want to avoid any issues that could mess up our relationship.
Thanks!
 
I think the lien has to be taken care of for you to be able to register it in your name. So the previous owner can't really sell it until he takes care of the lean.
 
Beer Thirty said:
I think the lien has to be taken care of for you to be able to register it in your name. So the previous owner can't really sell it until he takes care of the lean.
Click to expand...


Yep, this is true. BUT, he can give it away and this may make you responsible for the liens. Depends on what agreement you come to with him and the marina. If his financial situation is dire, then maybe a discounted arrangement can be worked out with the lien situation with the marina.
 
I don't know how it works where you live, but in Alabama boats and trailers are not titled. One of my boats has a lien, but is only secured by its appearance in the contract. I could easily sell the boat to someone and sign over the registration, as the lien is not registered. Illegal, of course, but possible. Then the bank would have me arrested, and sieze the boat from whomever thought they had bought, that person being out of their money.
 
More then likely the marina hasn't even thought about placing a lien on it yet. What marina is it at? If it's basically free why even worry about getting a survey done? Worst case scenario is you part it out/sell it to a junk man if there is a problem.
 
Sorry for the slow reply...
I was actually spending some time on the Sea Ray the last few days!

The boat is at a Marina in D.C. They don't have a travel lift, so it needs to be moved.
It was not used much last year, but professionally commissioned and Winterized. In most other places, I suspect the bottom and props are pretty fouled up. I have confidence that I can get it running, but who knows if I can get it to move.

Could a diver clean the props / bottom?



The owner's financial situation is far from dire which is why he may consider this. (Like a lot of folks these days, he is mostly intrested in simplifying his life.)

Other than a potential lender, I doubt there is a lien on the title, but you never know so that's why I ask.

Is there such a thing as title insurance for boats? Like on a home.
 
I slip in DC and there are several "Dock Queens" at my marina. The slime & gunk build up pretty quickly on them.

A diver could certainly clean the props and bottom for ya, but it would be all by touch, visibility on the Potomac/Anacostia is crap. I know, I went looking for some lost keys and sunglasses in the marina, gave up before I found them.

Cant answer your question about the title insurance, but if the boat happens to be at James Creek Marina, stop by, I will spot ya a cold one.

Thanks
 
Suggest you do some research on Maritime Liens, or consult an Admiralty Lawyer. I am not a lawyer but have spent most of my career in the ocean freight business and have picked up a couple of things. Here are the big points;

Basically, a maritime lien is automatic. Once money is owed for items that are termed 'Necessaries' a lien is created. There are lots of things that constitute a Necessary, and dock fees are definitely one of them. All a creditor needs to do is file in Federal Court.

Because Maritime law treats the vessel as an entity (like a corporation), it is the vessel that 'owes' the creditor. As a result. maritime liens created by a previous owner stay with the vessel even after it changes hands. So unlike real estate that can't change hands with a lien in place, vessels can.

'Vessels' do not have to be Federally documented.

If someone goes after a vessel to collect the debt, he can affect what is known as arresting a vessel. Basically, a US Marshal impounds the vessel where it sits. The vessel stays impounded until the debt is resolved either through the courts, or by settlement. This is a holdover from the days when debtors could literally slip away in the night. It is actually this part that is the most serious as deadlining a ship can cause literally millions of dollars in loses. There are other forms of collection and they are equally nasty. I know one lawyer who got a Rule B Attachment on a containership that was midway through the Panama Canal. You would not believe the $h_t storm that created. But his client got their money almost instantly.

One of the Admiralty lawyers I work with from time to time (the PC guy) is adamant about getting insurance coverage when buying a used boat from any source.

Hope this helps. Seriously see a Lawyer about this.

Also don't forget this is all at the creditor's discretion, they can also go the plain old mechanics lien approach as well small claims court etc.

Henry
 
DragonAnchor said:
I slip in DC and there are several "Dock Queens" at my marina. The slime & gunk build up pretty quickly on them.

A diver could certainly clean the props and bottom for ya, but it would be all by touch, visibility on the Potomac/Anacostia is crap. I know, I went looking for some lost keys and sunglasses in the marina, gave up before I found them.

Cant answer your question about the title insurance, but if the boat happens to be at James Creek Marina, stop by, I will spot ya a cold one.

Thanks
Click to expand...

It's not there, but probably less than a mile or so away.
Is the slim & gunk the kind of stuff that can be easily powerwashed?
I tested a used 290AJ that was mored at Deal and the props were so fouled it would hardly come up on plane. I passed on that one and ended up with a good buy on the on I have.

The marina has a ramp so I guess my choices are (Assuming I can get it running.)
Have it hauled to my destination using someone with a hydrolic trailer. I'd need to check on Bridge clearance. Find a couple of places with a travel lift or big forklift for a short haul and clean (schedule survey ).

Do you know which nearby marinas have lifts? I saw that the sailing marina has the services, but do you have to be a blow boat?

Apparently this marina doesn't even allow someone to do even painting. Where do people have to go to get routine mainanance done?


Any Info would be great.
 
Points well noted.
I wonder if a surveyor can do a title search and/or provide a link.

Henry Boyd said:
Suggest you do some research on Maritime Liens, or consult an Admiralty Lawyer. I am not a lawyer but have spent most of my career in the ocean freight business and have picked up a couple of things. Here are the big points;

Basically, a maritime lien is automatic. Once money is owed for items that are termed 'Necessaries' a lien is created. There are lots of things that constitute a Necessary, and dock fees are definitely one of them. All a creditor needs to do is file in Federal Court.

Because Maritime law treats the vessel as an entity (like a corporation), it is the vessel that 'owes' the creditor. As a result. maritime liens created by a previous owner stay with the vessel even after it changes hands. So unlike real estate that can't change hands with a lien in place, vessels can.

'Vessels' do not have to be Federally documented.

If someone goes after a vessel to collect the debt, he can affect what is known as arresting a vessel. Basically, a US Marshal impounds the vessel where it sits. The vessel stays impounded until the debt is resolved either through the courts, or by settlement. This is a holdover from the days when debtors could literally slip away in the night. It is actually this part that is the most serious as deadlining a ship can cause literally millions of dollars in loses. There are other forms of collection and they are equally nasty. I know one lawyer who got a Rule B Attachment on a containership that was midway through the Panama Canal. You would not believe the $h_t storm that created. But his client got their money almost instantly.

One of the Admiralty lawyers I work with from time to time (the PC guy) is adamant about getting insurance coverage when buying a used boat from any source.

Hope this helps. Seriously see a Lawyer about this.

Also don't forget this is all at the creditor's discretion, they can also go the plain old mechanics lien approach as well small claims court etc.

Henry
Click to expand...
 
William,

The difficult thing is that a maritime lien status exists the instant that monies are owed for a qualifying expense. They do not become documented until the creditor goes to court to press his case. A mechanic's lien on the other hand does not exist until the creditor goes and files.

This is why getting insurance is a good idea because somebody can come out of nowhere after you get the boat and basically hit you with an old unpaid invoice that you would be obligated to pay.
 
Port Washington will be your closest marina that can pull it out. Couple miles south on the Potomac and take a left. Not sure how large they can handle as I have never been there. Dont know anything about the sailing marina.

I bought my boat at Prince William, so If I need any service that I cant do, or dont have time to do, I take it there. It's on the Occoquan and can lift it no sweat.

Powerwashing will take most off, including bottom paint. How effective it will be would depend on how long its been gathering, condition of the bottom paint before it sat and how aggressive you want to be with the power-washer. You may have to or want to get the bottom re-painted anyways.
 
Thanks again guys!
The likelihood of a lien is very small. (I wanted to learn and understand the potential)
I can get confirmation from the marina and the company that has be servicing the boat as well as the original lender. The boat has been in one place since about 2004 when they bought it.
I can check with the insurance company that insures the sea ray. As well as the people that got me the loan. They are well connected in the area and would know the law plus the avalibility of title insurance.
I'm sure the current owner will confirm and guarntee thet there are no liens.
I looked into BOAT US settlement services which has contracts and escrow services.

Thanks again for all the help.
I'll look into Port Washington.
Thanks again!
 
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