Adding additional line for rode

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by Vdog, Jul 4, 2019.

  1. Vdog

    Vdog New Member

    4
    Oct 22, 2016
    Pasadena, MD
    1999 27' Sundancer with generator
    7.4 MPI W/BRAVO III OUTDRIVE
    i Want to be able to tie two lines together to add more rode for anchor.
    I do have windless and not sure if I can simply tie to lines together.
    Any advise ?
     
  2. Golfman25

    Golfman25 Active Member

    524
    Sep 12, 2009
    IL
    281
    V8
    I would buy a replacement rode at the size you want. Tying probably won't work out too well.
     
    Third Edition likes this.
  3. MonacoMike

    MonacoMike Well-Known Member PLATINUM Sponsor

    Sep 15, 2009
    Indiana lakes and Lake Michigan
    2000 Cruisers 3870
    8.2 Mercs
    85 Sea Ray Monaco 197
    260hp Alpha 1
    I have never heard of a tie for two lines that will feed through a windlass. My logic dictates that the two lines tied will be nearly twice size of the single line that feeds through the windlass. Then you have the issue of connection reliability, is it worth loosing your anchor and tackle to not just buy the right length of line or a longer length of chain?

    MM
     
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  4. Lazy Daze

    Lazy Daze Well-Known Member TECHNICAL Contributor GOLD Sponsor

    Apr 21, 2009
    PA
    Various
    Various
    The knot you tie won't go through the windlass. You'd have to stop the line just short of going completely through the windlass, pull the line that is on the anchor side of the windlass and tie it off, then let the remainder of the line come through the windlass after untying the line from the cleat in the anchor locker (you do have the bitter end tied off, right?), then tie the two lines together.

    Keep in mind that ANY knot causes the line to lose it's rated breaking strength, although some are better than others in this sense. Just a heads up on that.

    I did keep an extra 300' onboard my 260DA, but it was emergency use - not regular use. For regular use, I had a 25lb plow, 50' of chain and 300' of line. Once got caught overnight in a freak 70-mph windstorm. Boat never budged.

    Much easier to just get a new, longer line if you're short right now.
     
  5. Vdog

    Vdog New Member

    4
    Oct 22, 2016
    Pasadena, MD
    1999 27' Sundancer with generator
    7.4 MPI W/BRAVO III OUTDRIVE
    I was thinking it would not work, just wanted to clarify.
    I did see chain/rope combo and thought that was the way to go. The previous owner only had about 150 feet of rode and it is definitely not enough. The creeks around us are generally about 20 feet deep, with some areas about 3-5 feet, that’s where I generally anchor. We are only 3 seasons in our new lifestyle and any advise is always welcome! Thank you all for the advise!
     
    JVM225 likes this.
  6. JVM225

    JVM225 Well-Known Member GOLD Sponsor

    Apr 8, 2008
    Farmingdale, NY
    2002 410 Sundancer, Monaco Edition.
    3126 Cats.
    Just make sure your windlass can handle chain,
     
  7. Sea Gull

    Sea Gull Well-Known Member PLATINUM Sponsor

    Oct 19, 2006
    CT
    2019 Maritimo M64
    Volvo D13-1000
    Two lines connected with a long splice should work. Or, rope/chain with a tapered long splice will work as long as you have a gypsy that can handle the chain links.
     
  8. b_arrington

    b_arrington Active Member GOLD Sponsor

    931
    Feb 21, 2007
    Setauket, NY
    2018 Back Cove 34
    Cummins QSB 6.7 480
    If you decide to go all or longer chain you will need an anchor snubber. A windlass is not designed to take shock loads that occur while anchored.

    A snubber moved the load over to your cleats, reduces the shock load of the inelastic chain, and generally lowers the attachment point for better anchor performance.
     
  9. Vdog

    Vdog New Member

    4
    Oct 22, 2016
    Pasadena, MD
    1999 27' Sundancer with generator
    7.4 MPI W/BRAVO III OUTDRIVE
    All great advise, the windless I have has about 20 feet of chain before it gets to the line. So, I think the chain, line combo should be fine. I have seen snubbers on dock lines but I never thought about using one on the anchor line. That is a great idea for sure! I will be looking that up once I am done here. I am going to head to the boat today and measure the anchor chain and line I have to be sure it works with the windless. Thanks again for all of the advise!
     
  10. Sublimetime

    Sublimetime Active Member

    654
    Oct 22, 2007
    clifton nj
    420 da
    454
    The snubber he is talking about is not the same as your typical "dock line" snubber. He is talking about adding an extra line that somehow ties into your anchor rode before it enters the pulpit and then ties off to a cleat. To hard for me to describe, maybe someone else has an idea hhow to explain it.
     
  11. Lazy Daze

    Lazy Daze Well-Known Member TECHNICAL Contributor GOLD Sponsor

    Apr 21, 2009
    PA
    Various
    Various
    With only 20' of chain, you really don't need the bridle/snubber. You'll pretty much always be letting out at least 20' so you'll have rope to tie off with.
     
  12. stephens013

    stephens013 Member

    219
    Oct 8, 2009
    Ft Walton Beach, Fl
    2001 510 Sundancer
    1997 400DA Sundancer
    3196 Cat; 660 PHP
    3116 Cat; 340 PHP
    A knot is not the appropriate application. There is a way to meld the two bitter ends together. Problem is it makes the splice larger and stiffe at the junction point. My windless just would not process the larger girth. I always had to be right there to make sure the rope kept feeding into the locker.
     
  13. Lazy Daze

    Lazy Daze Well-Known Member TECHNICAL Contributor GOLD Sponsor

    Apr 21, 2009
    PA
    Various
    Various
    Correct, it is not. Hence the reason I said it wouldn't work. The OP had a simple question about tying two ropes together so the goal was to keep things simple.

    You could do an end to end splice (probably what you are referring to), and you might get away with it working in some windlasses - especially if you taper it. Unfortunately, I've done literally 1,000's of splices :confused: ... it 'could' work - but may start to eventually slip as the line gets stiff/salted up - cleaning/soaking helps, but not always. But the OP's question, at least it seemed, was for temporary use - as in "tie them together, then untie them again".
     
  14. Creekwood

    Creekwood Well-Known Member GOLD Sponsor

    Apr 26, 2009
    Oakville and Georgian Bay, Ontario
    '97 330 Sundancer, Raymarine C80 suite with radar, Mercury 310 Hypalon w/8hp Yammie 2stk
    2X 454 carbs w/ vDrives
    IF your depth is 20 feet and its sheltered, 150 of rode with 20 feet of chain is plenty. If you are worried that is not enough, then you must think you need more than 7 to 1 scope and if you need that much, you should be worried about a spliced rode if you went that route.
     
  15. Sea Gull

    Sea Gull Well-Known Member PLATINUM Sponsor

    Oct 19, 2006
    CT
    2019 Maritimo M64
    Volvo D13-1000
    A tapered splice is needed at the rope/chain connection if you want it to feed correctly.
     
  16. Vdog

    Vdog New Member

    4
    Oct 22, 2016
    Pasadena, MD
    1999 27' Sundancer with generator
    7.4 MPI W/BRAVO III OUTDRIVE
    So I measured the chain and it is 1/2 wide and the line is 1/4. Does anyone see a reason as to why I should not step up to 1/2 wide line? It seems like 1/2 would be a much safer choice.
     
  17. Sea Gull

    Sea Gull Well-Known Member PLATINUM Sponsor

    Oct 19, 2006
    CT
    2019 Maritimo M64
    Volvo D13-1000
    The diameter of the rope and the geometry of the chain links are dictated by the gypsy. Of course you can replace the gypsy, but it’s doubtful the same one would handle both 14” and 1/2 line. BTW, we use 1/4” on our 13’ dinghy and I think it’s too light. I’d probably want at least 5/8 on a 27 foot boat.
     
  18. Creekwood

    Creekwood Well-Known Member GOLD Sponsor

    Apr 26, 2009
    Oakville and Georgian Bay, Ontario
    '97 330 Sundancer, Raymarine C80 suite with radar, Mercury 310 Hypalon w/8hp Yammie 2stk
    2X 454 carbs w/ vDrives
    Use what is recommended by your windlass manufacturer. Is it a Progress 1?
     
  19. Lazy Daze

    Lazy Daze Well-Known Member TECHNICAL Contributor GOLD Sponsor

    Apr 21, 2009
    PA
    Various
    Various
    That doesn't sound right. I think you may be measuring wrong or someone did something DRASTICALLY wrong. The most likely combination for a smaller cruiser is 1/4" chain and 1/2" rope. Both of those sizes are MORE than enough for your size boat. Maybe you mixed up your numbers?
     

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