6 Boats Capsize-- 21 Saved, 1 Died

Wow...just WOW!!! "The boat’s maximum capacity was five, but Marom had eight other occupants with him including five children. Zuehlke said wind gusts Monday afternoon were near 50 mph causing two to three foot waves on Rockford Lake. The boat capsized after nose-diving into a swell" 15' fiberglass boat!!!
 
Here in Puget Sound weather can change in minutes I haven't owned a boat for 30 years but grew up on the water we just purchased our new to us boat 5/15 we went out last Sunday early water was calm 3 mph winds coming back around 5 we had 3-4 foot swells with white caps and 18 mph winds. I told a friend yesterday that Friday I was getting a voluntary Coast Guard Safety Inspection his reaction was aren't you smart enough to know what you need. Safety when your son and grandson or whoever is trusting their life in your hands is no joke. I wanted the inspection for my own piece of mind I want to know what could have been missed or forgot while I'm sitting in the marina not while were sinking.
 
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sfergson727 said:
Life jackets can't save us from stupidity.

Before I get crucified for being anti-life jacket, take a good look at my signature picture. Note my son is wearing a PFD, and all my life jackets (12 plus two rings) are stored in the cockpit.
I am against being told I have to wear a life jacket in my whaler, even though I take all precautions. I don't need a law to keep me safe, I need commonsense and experience, and humblely, I would think I rate rather high on both.
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I was sort of thinking the same thing. The lack of life jackets didn't sink the boats, in most cases it sounds like they shouldn't have been out on the water because of conditions.
 
sfergson727 said:
Life jackets can't save us from stupidity.

...

I don't need a law to keep me and my passengers safe, I need common-sense and experience, and humblely, I would think I rate rather high on both.
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:thumbsup:
 
sfergson727 said:
Life jackets can't save us from stupidity.

Before I get crucified for being anti-life jacket, take a good look at my signature picture. Note my son is wearing a PFD, and all my life jackets (12 plus two rings) are stored in the cockpit.
I am against being told I have to wear a life jacket in my whaler, even though I take all precautions. I don't need a law to keep me and my passengers safe, I need common-sense and experience, and humblely, I would think I rate rather high on both.
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I agree with you 100% with the key being common sense AND experience. I know plenty of experienced boaters that are lacking in the common sense department. On the other side I know some inexperienced boaters that I have faith in because they know their limitations and show good common sense, this would include myself. If you lack both, well....the results are never good.
 
sfergson727 said:
Life jackets can't save us from stupidity.

Before I get crucified for being anti-life jacket, take a good look at my signature picture. Note my son is wearing a PFD, and all my life jackets (12 plus two rings) are stored in the cockpit.
I am against being told I have to wear a life jacket in my whaler, even though I take all precautions. I don't need a law to keep me and my passengers safe, I need common-sense and experience, and humblely, I would think I rate rather high on both.
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Having been on the water with Scott I can attest he does rate high on both. I also agree that laws just promote ticketing for profit, so leave it up to the Captain. MM
 
I agree, no new laws, the government needs to stay out of it. But that being said, you have a 30+ ft boat, are you saying the PFDs belong in the locker?

I have had logs pop up with no notice, in fact I have had a hump-back whale surface right in front of me to where I had to throw it into reverse. So unexpected things happens and so with a PFD you float, without one you sink/die.

We here at CSR talk about safety, and the need to be safe, but ignore the one most important item in the safety tool box?

On my boat (yes my choice) if it is underway, everyone wears a PFD. When we stop you can take it off.
 
But a law can substute for a lack of good judgement.

There seem to many people in this thread who would be willing to attribute boating accidents and deaths to a lack of common sense. Please do not use 'common sense' as an argument. It's an arrogant approach to safety and if it was a valid argument we could dispense with almost all Occupational Health and Safety and Boating Safety regulation in the world. After every accident and without knowing the facts you will always hear someone say.."but it's just common sense..."

Well clearly, even amongst the most intelligent of us, 'common sense' is almost always subverted by bravado, showmanship, 'get-home-itis', self-confidence, inexperience, bad judgement, poor navigation, forgetfulness, complacency, repetitiveness, fatigue, weather, time constraints, feelings of pressure to do something, and oh yes, in some cases, stupidity. But it is also overcome by a rapid change in conditions (that rouge wave), that floating log, that rock, that unexpected slip into freezing water or any other unexpected and unanticipated event. What about that experienced crew ferrying a 60 footer that ran into a broken and submerged marker pole and sank in 30 seconds!

Across the board regulation is problematic. A big boat cruising at displacement speed on a flat calm sea in open water doesn't present the same hazard to crew and passengers as a fisherman in a small boat on a cold windswept lake or planing our class of vessels in a long chop in less than good visibility and/or with a degree of flotsam about.

I applaud Akbassking's approach which I try to take myself although I have been guilty of blasting off on a flat calm day without the jackets on. But the jackets are always taken out of the locker each trip and placed beside our seats ready for immediate donning at anytime during our voyage, even when sitting in the bay. Jackets are always on when we have guests regardless of conditions.

I was advised in another thread that in Canada, wearing a life jacket is manadatory. I'm not sure of the detail of that regulation but I believe such regulation is good (maybe even essential) if it applies to high risk situations such as small boats like 15 foot "tinnies'(whalers?) and children. Vessels of my size and planing capability require a judgement call but since there are many recordings of poor or bad judgment I would not at all be adverse to being told I must wear a lifejacket any more than being told I must wear a seatbelt.

Common sense doesn't cut itwhen it comes to reducing injuries and fatalities. Never has, never will. Its about having a healthy respect for the sea (water), planning for the unexpected and having a very strong desire to bring myself and my passengers home safely after every trip reagardless of what unfolds on the trip.

Our recreational activities often a hazardous element to them. It might be argued we wouldn't be happy unless there was a bit of danger involved to get the adrenlin pumping. How fast can we go at WOT! Feel that breeze! I'm not sitting on my sofa at home watching TV. So why wouldn't I have safety as my number one priority? Why wouldn't I use the safety gear available to me. Why would I object to such basic safety equipment being manadatory. It's not as though we are being asked to have dinghies fitted with an EPIRB!


Terry
 
Just like motorcycle helmets, I sometime wear and sometimes not. But that is my choice. Here in CT about 30 years ago I was very active in pushing that helmets were a bikers choice. Same with life jackets. In 35 years of boating, only once did I wear a life jacket. But with 18 to 20 foot rollers, that was the prudent thing to do.

Wearing of life jackets should be determined by the captain of the vessel, the conditions, the experience, the age of the person, the size of the boat, and many other conditions. I guess what I am trying to say, for a small minority of idiots, many are forced to do something to protect that minority.
 
Ka1oxd said:
Just like motorcycle helmets, I sometime wear and sometimes not. But that is my choice. Here in CT about 30 years ago I was very active in pushing that helmets were a bikers choice. Same with life jackets. In 35 years of boating, only once did I wear a life jacket. But with 18 to 20 foot rollers, that was the prudent thing to do.

Wearing of life jackets should be determined by the captain of the vessel, the conditions, the experience, the age of the person, the size of the boat, and many other conditions. I guess what I am trying to say, for a small minority of idiots, many are forced to do something to protect that minority.
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Amen!
 
Lord Farringdon said:
But a law can substute for a lack of good judgement.

I was advised in another thread that in Canada, wearing a life jacket is manadatory. I'm not sure of the detail of that regulation but I believe such regulation is good (maybe even essential) if it applies to high risk situations such as small boats like 15 foot "tinnies'(whalers?) and children. Vessels of my size and planing capability require a judgement call but since there are many recordings of poor or bad judgment I would not at all be adverse to being told I must wear a lifejacket any more than being told I must wear a seatbelt.

Terry
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Sorry Terry, Canadian law states no such thing. However, there must be a PFD on the boat for each soul on board, but that's it.
 
Ka1oxd said:
Just like motorcycle helmets, I sometime wear and sometimes not. But that is my choice. Here in CT about 30 years ago I was very active in pushing that helmets were a bikers choice. Same with life jackets. In 35 years of boating, only once did I wear a life jacket. But with 18 to 20 foot rollers, that was the prudent thing to do.

Wearing of life jackets should be determined by the captain of the vessel, the conditions, the experience, the age of the person, the size of the boat, and many other conditions. I guess what I am trying to say, for a small minority of idiots, many are forced to do something to protect that minority.
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Another statement about as bad as "it's just common sense" only this time implying anyone who has an accident is an idiot. I'm not quite sure of the logic which argues you should have a choice to wear a helmet or not then call someone an idiot for falling off their bike without one but that is for another thread. Although it is interesting to note how many of these choice v regulation areas there are. But one thing is for certain, I am sick of my taxes being used to pay for hospitals, search and rescue capabilities, workers compensation and on going medical care, simply because the Government has failed in its duty in some areas to provide necessary legislation to ensure people of all races, creeds and intelligence levels do what is necessary to provide themselves and the people who look to them for security, basic safety measures. Wear your seat belt, wear your helmet and wear your lifejacket.

As for the 'nanny state mentallity' comment, it is equalled only by the "it won't happen to me" mentality evident in a number of posters in this thread. You guys make attitudes to water safety an uphill battle, (which surprises me given the experience of the posters) but lives are too precious to not try to change attitudes to legislation that can help save lives. The 'stupid' ones will alway's be stupid but where their actions result in an injury or accident to someone else through their stupidity, they might at least feel the full weight of the law.


Terry
 
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Jimmy Buoy said:
Sorry Terry, Canadian law states no such thing. However, there must be a PFD on the boat for each soul on board, but that's it.
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Thanks Jimjmy Buoy. Actually that doesn't surpirse me. That the advice was that the law was more stringent did surprise me.

Terry
 
I'm with Scott on this one. If you reconstruct MANY of the fatal incidents (I can't say accidents because negligience was involved in many) you will find that there are many contribting factors to the incident/fatality. The primary cause is careless operation (whether by inexpierience of the operator or incapacitaion of the operator - aka drugs/alcohol). Do life jackets save lives YES! But responsible boat operators save more! How many PWC operators are killed each year in incidents (and yes I believe a life jacket is mandatory in all States). PFD's for kids ABSOLUTELY! Heck I even recommend it on the dock - as I have fished out more than one kid thats taken an unexpected dip! (not fun in April!!!!). I believe common sense is the issue (or maybe it's uncommon sense nowadays).
 
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