51 Dancer

boater seabuddy said:
Sea Ray and Mercury Marine are jointly owned by Brunswick Corp. They and their parent (Brunswick) make the most money if they use each others stuff. Mercury Marine is with VW diesel right now, but VW does not have engines for all sizes of Sea Rays. This is 2013 model year info. Why do you thiink we see a 37 cabin cruiser with outboards right now? It is cheap to make as there are no CAT requirements on outboards right now and these outboards from Mercury Marine have the most "inside the Brunswick Corp" umbrella of all power choices. If the boat sells, it makes the most money for Brunswick. Try one with a full cruising load onboard, for yourself, before you sign on the dotted line.
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Even though the 300 hp Verado's are an "internally" supplied engine, they are $30,000 each. The new JV with Cegielski will provide a 7 cylinder, 850 HP model for that price. Brunswick will reap those price benefits as a partner in the JV.
 
Have you run the 370 Venture or is your comment about full loading just your opinion?

We ran hull #1 at the homecoming in Knoxville at the Homecoming event with 21 people onboard. The PD&E engineer on the boat told us the props were wrong and would be changed when the boat returned to PD&E, but we saw 40 mpg with that load on the boat.........I honestly don't know what else you could ask for in preformance other than a little better low end torque, which the new props would have fixed.

As far as the motivation behind the outboard power, it has nothing much to do with cost or "CAT requirements" , but a whole lot to do with Sea Ray's largest dealer requesting a cruiser with outboards for their shallow water markets in the NE and south Fla.
 
"As far as the motivation behind the outboard power, it has nothing much to do with cost or "CAT requirements" , but a whole lot to do with Sea Ray's largest dealer requesting a cruiser with outboards for their shallow water markets in the NE and south Fla."

Thanks, but but outboards is where Mercury Marine is putting almost all their eggs at the main boat shows. Joystick for outboards, as an example. Brunswick is a business, they promote based on business profits.
 
I was also on the 370 with a full load of passengers. I echo what Frank says as he's a hell,of a lot more knowledgeable on that than I. The engineer said the same thing to the bunch of on board about the props and pitch. But that boat came out of the hole fast, rode smoothly and was very quiet.

I wasn't sure about the outboard propulsion at the start. Now I think it's a very viable option. Even given Carter's point of 30k each!

Mark
 
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Why in the hell would SeaRay have a boat at a national show and test drive, with the wrong props. What's it take 20 mins. to change a prop? Why not "overnight " the props from PD&E? I'm a Ford dealer and Ford does dumb stuff like that. Drives me nuts. Just saying. I feel better now.
 
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carterchapman said:
KayKook, I can’t believe you are not sharing the exciting new details of the new MerCruiser LION[SUP]© [/SUP]Hybrid Propulsion system.

Yes, Carbo is correct – the CMD (Cummins MerCruiser Diesel) JV was terminated last year – but Mercruiser is not looking at VW for Diesels. They are partnering with H. Cegielski - Diesel Engines and Generating Sets Factory LTD – of Poznan, Poland. They will be providing their L-16/24 Line of Engines built under MAN B&W Diesel license. These engines have 5, 6, 7, 8, or 9 cylinders and run at 1000-1200 RPM. Their horsepower varies from 600 to 1225 depending on their cylinder configuration.

The new large Sea Ray Yachts will use a single engine, with banks of Lithium Ion batteries and capacitor banks located in the space beside the engine. The engine will be used at its constant RPM to drive a generator manufactured by another LION[SUP]© [/SUP]Partner – Fuzhou Tarong Industrial Co., LTD of Fujian Province, China. Their two electric motors will be directly coupled to the twin screws and are variable speed and reversible. The generator’s output is 220V/400Hz and appropriate transformers will be used to supply house current for US or European standards.

A three speed transmission arrangement is being provided between the engine and generator by the final LION[SUP]©[/SUP] JV Partner - AGROMET ZEHS LUBAN SP. Z O.O. of Luban, Poland. This transmission allows the engine to run at its most efficient, constant, RPM, but when higher power outputs are required for higher speeds, the transmission will shift to another ratio allowing the generator to turn faster and generate more power (putting the engine under more load at its constant RPM). This will cause the 400HZ frequency to vary, but it is being handled by a VSCF (Variable Speed, Constant Frequency) Converter located between the two motors. For the European-spec models, a manual transmission is being specified – currently Cigielski wants to provide a non-synchromesh model, but MerCruiser would prefer synchromesh. The U.S. spec models will have a CV automatic transmission that adjusts output RPM automatically depending on load requirements.

The Li-Ion batteries will be charged by the excess power generated, and the capacitors banks will be charged for short-term power requirements, reducing requirements for the transmission to shift. When the engine is not required for power generation, it will go into a cylinder deactivation mode, or shut down as determined by the battery/capacitor charge state and power demand.

Finally, solar cell panels will be on the hardtop, and Fuzhou Tarong is proposing an unusual charging method – they are recommending anchoring in areas with high tidal swings or high current so the propellers could back drive the motors (which would then become generators) and provide charging as well. MerCruiser feels this may work on the Yangzi River in China with its high current flow, but may not provide this dividend in the U.S. The studies are not complete for Europe at this time.

KayKook – feel free to contact Mr. Richard Huang of Fuzhou Tarong Industrial Co., LTD (Telephone: 86-591-83719190) for further details.
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So is this relationship with VW small diesels old news and over? http://cmdmarine.com/ourcompany/cmdvwalliance.html
 
AMFM3, you said, in part, "But that boat came out of the hole fast" Was the idle to 30 MPH time 10 seconds ... or 50% longer like, say, 15 seconds or 100% longer like 20 seconds?

Again, we are talking about the factory drivened demo 370 Venture with passengers.
 
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On the ride we were on, they went out on the river a gradually got up to speed. When we turned around, he stopped the boat and hit the throttles. The boat came up and out of the hole nicely, with a full load. Sorry, didn't have a stopwatch going.

My point is, it's a nice boat. Ride and power are great. It might not be everybody's boat, but I like it. Very quiet and no vibration at all.
 
Why do you think Zeus drives are "fading fast?" I get the opposite impression. Almost all new 510 Sundancers get ordered with Zeus, from what I heard visiting the plant. While there's definitely a cost bump for pods, if they can be afforded, why wouldn't they be a natural choice?
 
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