500/520 DB official thread

[Jeremygavin]

i got some investigating to do in the hot water system. I will head down this week and start looking deeper into it.

Thanks

 

[my3sons]

I was looking this diagram this weekend after people had questioned whether it is correct or not. It is in fact not correct. On the diagram above I have the bow thruster thrusting in the wrong direction in both diagrams. You need to use the thruster to move the bow away from the dock as the engines are pivoting the bow towards the dock. With the rudder over about half way the engine in FWD pushed water across the rudder and helps crab the stern over. Sorry for the confusion.

Your first diagram was wrong, but what you described here moves the boat away from the dock, not toward it. It's how I pull away from a tie along dock when there is someone right behind and in front of me.
To pull up to the dock, I engage the shafts to the opposite of what's in the diagram. My experience is the rudders don't matter, they're too small on my boat. Maybe the size of your boat makes a difference.

 

[Woody]

I found this from previous discussion. http://www.clubsearay.com/index.php...-40-footer-sideways-without-a-thruster.36891/

While every boat is different, I have found the following to work under light conditions (i.e. not much wind or current), for twin screw inboard boats only.

If you want to crab the boat to a dock on the starboard, "cock" the engines with port gear ahead, starboard gear reverse, and the helm hard over to port. This works because to bow is brought around (in a clockwise spin) by the opposing propellors, but the stern is pushed to starboard by the port propellor discharge current hitting the rudder which is hard over to port. The starboard propellor discharge current is in reverse and this has no effect on the rudder. Of course, this is only true on an inboard configuration.

You may have to throttle up a bit more on port than starboard, and tunnel hulls can throw the effect off a bit. The opposite works for crabbing the boat to port.

There are other methods for walking the boat over, space permitting. You approach the dock (on starboard) going forward on an angle with the bow in. When the bow has almost reached the dock, engage port reverse, perhaps throttling up a little. Starboard should be in neutral. When the boat stops moving, go ahead on starboard momentarily and port reverse. The boat should be at the dock by now.

If this doesn't work then revert to profanity and vigourous arm waving. Gears should be in neutral. Take time to order a thruster.

Hope this helps, Jacob

Walking a boat sideways more than a boat width is easier when you have large asymetrical thrust found on boats with big props, lots of pitch and plenty of torque coupled with a large centerline to centerline distance between the shafts. To put this in Sea Ray terms, It works well on 50 -60 ft boats, on boats with a COG about in the middle of the length of the boat...sedan bridges, is somewhat more difficult on the mid-40 ft boats and is almost impossible to do on under 40 ft boats. The smaller boat will eventually go sideways, but not without a lot of jockying the gears and throttles, and usually not without moving ±1/2 a boat length forward or astern.

I was just eating breakfast reading CSR, saw this thread, and thought to myself "I wonder what people's expectations of walking a boat sideways really are". You can see above 2 experience posters and boaters added the caveat "when conditions are right". This basically means, no wind, no current, and plenty of time. Walking a boat sideways is when the boat is always parallel to the dock. Not where the bow and stern get closer one end at a time. Its really only useful as a last resort if you plan your docking accordingly and find your self a few feet away from the dock stuffed in between two boats. Why is it not useful otherwise? Because it would take far too long. The only time I ever use the technique is actually to get the boat away from the dock as I don't usually screw up on the way in. Of course there are those that think they can walk their twin screw boat sideways at 2 knots without a thruster. You guys please skip over this post. To everybody else with aspirations of doing this, its not going to happen. There are much more effective ways of moving a boat into a slip or T-Head.


Bow thrusters. Any salty skipper would never use one on a twin screw boat pulling into a slip but there is a lot to be said for them when parallel docking on a T-Head and doing to right. This is an effective way of moving a boat sideways. There is an art to putting one engine in forward, one in reverse, adjusting the throttle on one or both, then using the thruster to get the boat moving exactly sideways while only using thruster inputs until almost touching the dock and everything going back to neutral. The art of great docking is like chess, as few moves as possible. For example, pulling into a slip can be reduced to idling up to it, putting one engine in reverse with some throttle to get the stern moving around and into the slip, then bring the other engine to reverse to back straight into the slip, then bumping both in forward to stop. Three inputs, done. A T-Head you head into it at 45 degrees, coast into it in neutral, pull the outboard engine into reverse, neutral, tie up. 2 inputs or 3 inputs depending on how you look at it. Trying to walk a boat sideways without a thruster requires a constant parade of inputs for very little movement, which is why a good captain will only whip out that trick to make up for something not done right prior.

Was supposed to be a short post, sorry. I could talk about boat handling around docks for days.

 

[my3sons]

Figures, size really does matter

 

[spikedaddy99]

Agree. Takes time to get to the galley, but it's pretty hot. On a side note, docked well this weekend with a mild port wind. After I realized Jeremy's diagram was wrong

 

[Jeremygavin]

Agree. Takes time to get to the galley, but it's pretty hot. On a side note, docked well this weekend with a mild port wind. After I realized Jeremy's diagram was wrong

Sorry, my attention to detail is not the best. My teachers always told me to double check my work before handing it in. I need to start listening to them.

 

[spikedaddy99]

Forgot to reply, weekend run with EGT's installed. Port is at 950 degrees with 20.4GPH @ 1880 RPM's, SB is 850 with 19.8 GPH @ 1880 RPMs. Full fuel, water, teenagers crap etc. Flat lake. Reading back, I asked someone how to tell if gaskets are leaking, and was told to look for soot. None found, so I am happy so far. Here's to many hours this summer! Mike

 

[Jeremygavin]

Spikedaddy99’s post reminded me I should post my numbers.

I had the props repitched this winter. I had them taken down from 31.5” to 30” pitch so. Now they are 28”x30”. I did this In an effort to get my fuel burn down to prevent exhaust manifold leaks. I didn’t get around to adding EGT sensor, that will come next winter.
Last fall before repitch my numbers where: @ 2000rpms.

Data Port. Starboard
% throttle 80%. 80%
% load. 78%. 77%
GPH. 23.9. 23.7

After repitch

Data Port. Starboard
% throttle 80%. 80%
% load. 69%. 70%
GPH. 21.2. 21.5

I am now cruising at about 25mph with 90% fuel, 50% water, empty waste, pretty well loaded with gear and 2 people on board.

So I am getting close to the magic fuel burn rate of 20gph @ 2000rpms.

 

[Jeremygavin]

Does anyone have issues with their hot water? The water is not hot hot and takes a while (30 secs) to even get warm at the galley and bath sinks. I have less pressure on hot side than cold side at the galley sink. The stern sink in the outdoor kitchen area gets warmer faster and is hotter than the water in the cabin sinks but still not what I consider hot. We didn’t get to use it much last fall, hot water was ok at the survey so I don’t know if this is a new issue or not. I changed out the element this weekend with no change. I check all the lime shut offs on the water manifolds and they all seem to be in the correct position. Next step is a thermostat but it just seems like I have something else going on due to the differences in temps between the stern sink and cabin sinks and also the lower pressure on the hot side.
I had great hot water on my 340da with a smaller tank so there is no reason why this one should produce hot water as well.

Let me know your thoughts on things to check out.

I figured out my hot water issue tonight. Turns out to be a plug in the water manifold that splits the hot and cold sides of the manifold. I figured it out because I turned off the water supply to the water heater and I was still getting water out of the hot water lines. So water pressure was back feeding into the hot water side somehow. I kept tracking it down till i eliminated all the lines and it had to be the manifold. I pulled the manifold apart and the plug had pushed into the cold water side and was letting cold water by it into the hot water side and diluting the hot water. I assume it happened when I used compressed air to clear out the lines last fall. I set the pressure at 50psi but the plug is slides pretty easy so if I had 50psi on the hot side and no pressure on the cold side I could see it getting pushed that way.
At least the wife will be happy we have hot water.

 

[spikedaddy99]

View attachment 64512 Speaking of filters my neighbor talked me into running water through a water softener and pre filter before it goes into the tank I keep it in the transom trunk. No more water spots and the women say their hair is nicer hahahahahah
I also have 3 more spin on filters after the tank that I get from Lowe’s

https://www.lowes.com/pd/A-O-Smith-...ock-Whole-House-Replacement-Filter/1000575895

Joe, educate me here. Where are the spin on filters located in our boat? Mike

 

[Havana Shamrock]

Spikedaddy there’re are 2 spin on water filters between the water heater and water pump mounted high then theres another near the water heater for the ice maker. I believe these where all added afterwords
Also another pre filter before the water softener just replaced it and it was black and slimy.

 

[spikedaddy99]

Spikedaddy there’re are 2 spin on water filters between the water heater and water pump mounted high then theres another near the water heater for the ice maker. I believe these where all added afterwords
Also another pre filter before the water softener just replaced it and it was black and slimy.

Water softener? Was that added after too? I don't have these. M

 

[Havana Shamrock]

The water softener I put in the trunk no water goes into or on the boat without passing through it first my dock neighbor is a “food scientist” who makes up the chemistry for foods we eat daily he has one on his new Viking and explained to me how and why it works anyway it takes the metal out of the water and makes it much nicer for showering and cleaning the boat etc. he tested “the wet spot” device that sells for much more than this RV version and they are exactly the same as far as filtering capabilities.
A few boats at our dock now have these because of him.

 

[spikedaddy99]

The water softener I put in the trunk no water goes into or on the boat without passing through it first my dock neighbor is a “food scientist” who makes up the chemistry for foods we eat daily he has one on his new Viking and explained to me how and why it works anyway it takes the metal out of the water and makes it much nicer for showering and cleaning the boat etc. he tested “the wet spot” device that sells for much more than this RV version and they are exactly the same as far as filtering capabilities.
A few boats at our dock now have these because of him.
View attachment 70499

I have that too. I thought you were referring to one built in to your FW system. Mike

 

[Havana Shamrock]

Ahh. Nope

 

[bmac]

The water softener I put in the trunk no water goes into or on the boat without passing through it first my dock neighbor is a “food scientist” who makes up the chemistry for foods we eat daily he has one on his new Viking and explained to me how and why it works anyway it takes the metal out of the water and makes it much nicer for showering and cleaning the boat etc. he tested “the wet spot” device that sells for much more than this RV version and they are exactly the same as far as filtering capabilities.
A few boats at our dock now have these because of him.
View attachment 70499

Joe, where did you buy that and how much was it?

 

[Havana Shamrock]

Brian here ya go
On The Go OTG4-DBLSOFT-Portable 16,000 Grain RV Water Softener https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00KVPNVJ6/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_tai_3A97CbSWC5E7C

 

[spikedaddy99]

And put this in line before the softener:
https://www.amazon.com/Camco-TasteP...r&qid=1559223466&s=gateway&sr=8-1-spons&psc=1

Mike

 

[Havana Shamrock]

Agreed I was told just use this from Lowe’s and put a good filter in it. Same result I guess
Pentek 3G-STANDARD-CLEAR-34-PR10 Whole House Water Filtration System Housing https://www.amazon.com/dp/B004H36LIQ/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_tai_P.d8Cb02W6GX6

 

[Charlesoceanone]

I was out on anchor today and when I went pull up the anchor I caught a small mushroom anchor with a to of rope some chucked in the water. I got it all untangled and got the anchor up then it went dead. The switch on the helm doesn’t even light up. I’m assuming there is a breaker somewhere but unable to locate it. Anyone have any thoughts?