420/44 DB Owners Club

fwebster said:
Uhhh, this is from the sidelines.......but before you guys go putting condoms on your hoses, have you considered cleaning the system thoroughly, installing valves at the holding tank, then leaving nothing but fresh water in the lines?
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:lol:

Hey Frank,

Can you elaborate what involves in the thorough cleaning process?

I flash my tank 90% (the exception is rare occasion when I use pumpout boats that don't allow to flash the tank) of the time twice during the pump outs, meaning that after I pumped it empty I add few gallons of fresh water and pump again. Then, I add more fresh water and pump again. Usually, by that time all I see is clear water coming out. I also run the fresh water by keeping the pedal down alllowing it to clean the lines (that's done right after initial pump out).

When all is set and done I add the SeaLand tablets in each bowl to help treating the waste tank. I don't have stinky smell and only once I had to change the "fart filter" on my 320. On my 420 I can tell just a little bit of smell when the waste tank gets close to 3/4. At this time I'm heading to pump-out station.

Am I missing something?

I get no smell anywhere else, but under the port side under the berth. It's not the obvious waste smell, rather weird odor that could be the permeate hose. I did another visual check and see nothing at all that could be leaking.
 
osd9 said:
Do they even have a 'verbal' section down in your parts?.....I mean...with the way ya'll talk and all.....
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I found a photo that speaks for me. I am trying to get it uploaded for you. I think this little girl is telling you that You are Number 1!
 

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You could have a water leak that's causing the smell. If you have sea water getting into the boat, that'll smell pretty bad in a short while. Fresh water and wood will smell bad too. Do you have any sea water in your bilge that is maybe working it's way into the cabin somehow? i'm always fighting oysters in my AC pickup and i'm taking the hose off and on and get sea water into the forward bilge. If I leave it there for a week, it'll smell bad by the next weekend. If you have a window leaking, it'll run down behind the vinyl and smell after awhile. I would think your hoses aren't old enough to be falling apart yet unless it's rubbing on something and wore a hole in one. I also had a fridge drain hose that wasn't draining right and that smelled. Water and organic material over time smells.
 
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Good idea, Mike. I totally agree on the smell from fresh water sitting for a while. But, I think that this one is something else, I just don't know what it is yet.

I did the wet rag test tonight and IMO it cameback negative. I soaked the rag in hot water and placed it on the hose. About 30 min later I picked it and the rag had almost no smell at all. I did noticed that very small part of the rag did have a little of smell that kind of matched, but this just gave me an idea that maybe I should do more tests like this in all the areas I can access the hose and see if it's something that's spreaded in different spots.

I'll do more testing when I'll get a chance.
 
How are you guys finding engine parts/numbers? Tried Cummins Web site. No luck yet, even with a registration. Need serp belt part numbers. Also, what about zincs? Time to start ordering those too.
 
John, did you try quickserve.cummins.com? Entering an engine serial number there should provide some basic manuals including a parts catalog for free. Buying a subscription will open up everything Cummins ever recorded about the engine including detailed maintenance and repair procedures. I highly recommend it for at least the first year of ownership.
 
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I did another wet rag test tonight and don't feel that the hose is bad. I don't even know if it's a good or bad news as I can't see any sign of a leak anywhere. Maybe it's just a new smell that's normal?:huh:

Oh well, maybe some folks can give me their opinions when we meet at AC.
 
Alex F said:
I did another wet rag test tonight and don't feel that the hose is bad. I don't even know if it's a good or bad news as I can't see any sign of a leak anywhere. Maybe it's just a new smell that's normal?:huh:

Oh well, maybe some folks can give me their opinions when we meet at AC.
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Alex, if you can't find the leak, you may just have to have your family change their diet.
 
Greg said:
Alex, if you can't find the leak, you may just have to have your family change their diet.
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:lol:

I'm not sure if it might help, but I think that another possible contributor to the weird smell could be the central vac hose. There's a long line that runs in to salon under that port berth. PO had dog and at first my wife thought it's the dog's hair smell. The unit works great and I don't notice anything clugging the hose or the unit inlet (the bag is obviously new). :smt017
 
Alex,

Is there carpet under the berth? If so, did you check to see if it smells? Is there any odor in the bilge? Is it possible there is mold or mildew your not seeing?
 
No carpet, it's just a gelcoat. The whole area is clean with not much of stains that would lead to a clue.

Is it possible that the rag test on the vacuuflush hose I did was wrong? I put the rag in the hot water, rinsed it and placed it for 20-30min on the hose. Did this twice in different sections of the hose and the rag didn't smell much.
 
Yes, I have. They only give you directions about how to measure it.

EDIT: This was supposed to be a quote about checking the online Cummins site.
 
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Hose is indeed often a source—but not the cause—of odor. If sewage stands in any hose, it will eventually permeate the material, so if possible, run your hose without any low spots where sewage can stand, and always be sure flush the head sufficiently to push all the sewage out of the hose and rinse behind it. As part of the routine of closing up the boat, close the intake seacock, flush the head dry, then pour about a quart of fresh water into the head and flush that through the system completely. If limited holding capacity makes extra flushing each time the head is used impractical, following this routine when leaving the boat will solve most odor problems.

How do you know whether your hose has permeated? Wrap a hot damp cloth around it—preferably at the lowest point in the hose run; leave it there till it cools, then smell the cloth. It you cannot smell sewage on the cloth, that section of hose is fine. Test all sections—the sea water intake line, the toilet discharge line, and the holding tank vent line. All should be plumbed with hose rated for sanitation. If there Is clear water hose anywhere, replace it with sanitation hose…if it hasn't permeated, it's only a matter of time.

As for using rigid PVC—schedule 40 PVC is meant to be buried, not exposed. Yes, it's used in buildings, but buildings (except in earthquake prone areas) don't flex and torque; boats do. Just the battering from a heavy wake or a moderate chop (much less really rough seas) puts conflicting strains on a hull at anchor. Imagine the stresses boats endure in even moderate wind conditions and heavy seas! Furthermore, schedule 40 PVC becomes more brittle as the temperature drops. A windy winter day in the parts of the country where we leave boats in the water all year can cause a boat to bounce around in its slip enough to crack the pipe—which you won't discover till the first time you use the head in the spring, and you don't want to deal with that. We recommend against the use of hard pipe altogether, but If you must--use only schedule 80 or ABS, and "soft-couple" (use hose) all connections to installed devices to reduce stress and shock that can result not only in cracked pipe, but damaged fittings and equipment.
Sanitation hose should be flexible smooth-walled PVC with an ID (inner diameter) of 1½" --except for the discharge from a macerator to an overboard through-hull--(installed below the waterline, please!) which is typically 1"). Since the standard fittings on holding tanks are 1½", when coming off a macerator to a holding tank, it will be necessary to break the hose, using a 1" to 1 ½" adapter. The standard size of the hose from a holding tank to the deck fitting is also 1 ½" ID.

http://www.marine-surveyor.com/newsletters/9910.html
 
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Can someone with 450Cs or 480CEs post your cruising numbers on your 420DB? I'm trying to find a true sweet spot for mine. I was using these numbers from boattest.com, but it looks like I'm way off.

420DB_Boattest_results_2000RPMs.jpg

While running at 2100-2150RPMs I travelled about 110NM and used just under 200gal. This makes the boat run at the rate of about .55MPG. I tried to take it slower just a bit and dropping it to 2000RPMs, but it seems like the numbers don't improve at all. My speed seems to be slower (16-18kts depending on the seas/wind/currents) than the boattest numbers as well. Finally, I tried to run more agressivelly and I think it should work better as I gain much more speed with only 300RPMs extra. Running at 2300RPMs I see 24.3kts on the clock. The boat feels much lighter and glides on top of the water instead of pushing more water at the slower speed. At this speed I'm able to make some adjustment with the trim tabs while at 19kts I have to keep them fully deployed. I plan on running at around 2300-2350 to maintain speed over 23kts and hope that extra speed will compensate the higher GPH usage and will improve my MPG numbers.

I would appreciate if 420DB owners could share some thoughts and info.
 
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