270 SLX Rescued by SR Factory Team

[270SLX]

From my prior post, you may recall that my 2005 270 SLX became waterlogged between the hull and deck with a weeping crack on the bottom chine below the waterline toward the bow. I called Sea Ray Customer Service and the SR factory team was dispatched to Davenport.

As I understand it, the hull had a flex point caused by a design flaw that put too little heavy woven fiberglass in the right places. The flaw has since been fixed in later builds. Early 270 hulls with the flaw don't flex under way so much as when placed on blocks with the bow end of the keel on a block and the stern and sides on blocks or jack stands. I'm sure you've seen many a boat stored that way or supported that way while the boat is being serviced.

The factory team of Barry and Richard were forthright in explaining everything. I was very impressed with that.

Barry explained that the problem caused the hull to flex so that it "rolled in" along the bottom chine which is where my weeping cracks appeared. So, the water in my hull got there through the crack while under way. It did not come from rain water seeping in through a defect in the deck/hull seal as I had thought.

My boat had been on blocks and jacks several times as my various stress cracks in the deck and hull have been repaired. So, the theory is that it cracked when one of those repairs was being made and the crack remained undiscovered as it was hidden by my boat cradle and could only be inspected if I was brave enough to walk under the boat while it was on a forklift. (That's against OSHA rules at 29CFR 1910.178, by the way.)

The fix: Barry and Richard cut away nearly the entire bottom of the ski locker. They raked out and removed the waterlogged expandable foam. (They could not get 100% of the foam out, but assured me that what's left won't cause an expansion problem when the boat freezes this winter.) Then they built it up with the the strong woven fiberglass and screwed in and sealed a panel to seal the deal. They put in A LOT of new fiberglass. Instead of nonskid textured decking on the bottom of the ski locker, I now have a nice diamond plate type rubber mat that actually looks pretty nice. Barry assured me that the fix will make the boat at least twice as strong as it was and will be sealed so that it is absolutely impossible for water to get from the deck into the space below. The expanding foam was not replaced. It's only function was sound attenuation and the added fiberglass will double for absorbing vibrations so that the hull should be no less quiet than before.

I'll note too that the crack that the local tech fixed two weeks previous opened up again once the boat was put on the blocks so Barry and Richard had ground it all out again for a final and lasting repair.

I'm hoping the extra rigidity will also prevent any further recurrence of the cracks I've had between the windshield and the bow seats as well.

While they were at it, they waxed the boat partly in order to find any cracks or defects to be repaired. They fixed a crack in the deck and even some hull damage that was a total mystery to me. Maybe a forklift did it at the marina. They repaired the 3/4 full transducer in the waste tank, secured a sagging portion of the head ceiling and I don't know what else. In other words, they did everything I could think of and everything they could find to restore my satisfaction with Sea Ray. They really are great guys.

I feel that Sea Ray has identified the root cause and has effected a solution that will restore my confidence in the boat and cause me no loss in resale value.

Would I rather have had a new boat that didn't require major surgery? Sure. But, under the circumstances this is the best outcome I could hope for and I am more than satisfied.

Hooray for Barry and Richard of Sea Ray. Now if only the Mississippi River would slow down a bit from the recent floods, I'll be back on the water.

Dennis

 

[Alex D]

I am glad your repair wen this well and I certainly would also have worked with Sea Ray. My only concern when you have this much MAJOR sugery to your boat ... how will it affect resale or trade value? Most buyers would probably step back when they hear or see what was done to fix this. I hope not, but I would think they would. In any case I would have consulted my attourney and evaluated my options. I rpobably would have insisted on a replacement of the boat, especially since Sea Ray admitted a serious design flaw. At the very least Sea Ray should have offered a value gap compensation.

 

[comsnark]

The boat bottom has a foam (not solid) core? Hmmm.

If *I* was buying this boat, and KNEW about this repair, not only would I not buy THIS boat, but I would NOT buy any 2005 270SLX. Period. And I would want to understand (and be assured) that this flaw does not exist in other Searays.

Gives me the willies just thinking about it. My 280SS was stored last winter using the three-point method.

As far as resale goes. . . I would look into gettting another boat NOW. Broker the boat so that a *professional* can minimize the extend of this repair to potential customers. You do not want to talk to them, because you are morally obligated to disclose the repair.

If you do keep the boat. . .plan on keeping it a LONG time. The only way to PROVE the repair worked would be to see the results after 10 years. Even then. . . . I would make my surveyor take extra care in his work.

 

[270SLX]

My plan is to keep the boat a LONG time. I still love the boat. As time goes on, there will be little or nothing to disclose to a prospective buyer.

Bear in mind that this was simply a warranty repair. I'm convinced that the boat is stronger now than anything else in its class. I'm thinking of naming it "Mucho Fuerte" (very strong).

I did evaluate the "other options". Sea Ray has honored its obligations under the warranty.

 

[Alex D]

My plan is to keep the boat a LONG time. I still love the boat. As time goes on, there will be little or nothing to disclose to a prospective buyer.

Bear in mind that this was simply a warranty repair. I'm convinced that the boat is stronger now than anything else in its class. I'm thinking of naming it "Mucho Fuerte" (very strong).

I did evaluate the "other options". Sea Ray has honored its obligations under the warranty.

:thumbsup:

'nother name could be "Heavy Hitter" or "Led Zeppelin" :lol:

 

[fwebster]

The foam is never used as a structural member of the hull.........re-read 250SXL's post, the foam is there to deaden sound, not as part of the structure.

I know it is common practice, but I am continually amazed that more boats are not damaged by the 3-point blocking method used at some dealers and boat yards. The boat's structure is not adequately supported......and the bigger the boat, the worse the risk for damage. If you are in doubt, check with Sea Ray customer service for the recommended storage method for your hull.

While the description of the repairs seems drastic, Sea Ray would not have done this locally if it were beyond the scope of doing it properly that way. They would have returned the boat to the factory for repairs. As far as disclosing the repair to anyone for any reason......why? This was nothing more than a warranty repair, and having seen the type work Sea Ray does in the field, I'd prefer to keep this boat over having an new one just like it. You are much less likely to have a recurrence with this boat since the repaired area is probably stronger than a new one with the revised layup schedule would be.

The only reason to trade this boat would be if you are ready to move up.

I am worried that your dealer was not able to diagnose this problem after multiple failures and repairs..be careful with their fiberglass knowledge and advice in the future.

 

[Dave S]

Glad to hear of your great experience with Sea Ray and I am glad they have fixed your boat to your satisfaction. While none of us wants to have problems like you had, it just goes to show you what Sea Ray is willing to do to make things right. :thumbsup:

By the way, 280 Sea Ray had the same experience awhile back with the factory team and he too was very pleased with the outcome.

 

[kev88]

Dennis:

Congrats on your repair! THANKS for your positive attitude....sounds like you (and your boat) are going to be just fine!

Kevin

 

[Stray Cat]

Dennis - Glad to hear the factory guys came to the rescue. I'm sure "Tom and his guys" learned a lot in the process too :thumbsup:

 

[comsnark]

I know it is common practice, but I am continually amazed that more boats are not damaged by the 3-point blocking method used at some dealers and boat yards. The boat's structure is not adequately supported......and the bigger the boat, the worse the risk for damage. If you are in doubt, check with Sea Ray customer service for the recommended storage method for your hull.

I would be more interested in hearing about this. Many people in my area block large boats using the three point method. Is it written anywhere? My owners manual only talks about using a cradle, which in my mind is far different than 6 point blocking.

I made a number of inquires last year (although, admittedly not to SeaRay direct), and nobody shied away from three point blocking.

_______________________________________

Back on topic:

I am sure this repair is fine. And yes, it is good to know that SeaRay stepped upto the plate. That means I would willingly buy a SeaRay. Just not a 2005 270SLX.

In car terms, it is just like buying a car that had it's transmission replaced under warrenty at 20,000 miles. Given the choice. . . I would buy a car that did NOT have that kind of history over one that does.

I am sure this boat (now fixed) is fine. If it were my boat. . I would keep it.

 

[widowmaker]

Glad to hear Sea Ray stepped up and fixed it. Your warranty is still intact. Watch out for those "Mississippi Toothpicks".... barge Captains term for logs.

 

[Nehalennia]

As much as my previous opinions were for you to demand a replacement boat, the comments that would have convinced me , like you, to keep it are

.......This was nothing more than a warranty repair, and having seen the type work Sea Ray does in the field, I'd prefer to keep this boat over having an new one just like it. You are much less likely to have a recurrence with this boat since the repaired area is probably stronger than a new one with the revised layup schedule would be.

The only reason to trade this boat would be if you are ready to move up.

I am worried that your dealer was not able to diagnose this problem after multiple failures and repairs..be careful with their fiberglass knowledge and advice in the future.

Especially since you plan on keeping this boat for a long time, you can now lean on SeaRay and their repairs.
Kudo's to SeaRay for handling this as we all hoped and trusted they would. Now let the Mississippi drop for a little for you so you can salvage your summer. :thumbsup:

 

[fwebster]

I'll let Sea Ray speak for themselves, but their usual response is to store the boat on a storage cradle specifically designed for the model boat you have, however, Sea ray also makes and sells the cradles. A customer of our dealer owns a 330DA and keeps it out of the water most of the year. He bought a Sea Ray cradle and it is very nice and provides support along the keel and at the main bulkheads or lifting points.

When boats in the 30' category are blocked in a boat yard down here, there are at least 3 12"X12"X 3' wooden blocks placed under the keel then 3 adjustable jack stands placed down each side. As the boats get bigger, the blocking increases.......when my 450DA is hauled and blocked, there are 5 blocks under the keel and 4 adjustable jack stands down each side.

I'm not the one to tell your boat yard or dealer he doesn't know what he's doing, but he's concerned about the cost and space of winter storage, not protecting your boat. Three stacks of concrete blocks and a hunk of waste plywood are a lot cheaper than 6-7 adjustable stands and 12"X12" pressure treated timber. How can 3 point blocking no where near the sling marks or a bulkhead and only one block under the keel support the internal structure of the boat?

 

[comsnark]

That's a very good queston indeed.

Heck. . .I don't know where the "sling points" are on my 280SS. I should consult the manual.

I have to take a wander down to the local searay dealer, and see how they block boats (I admit I didn't do that last year). Certainly, they are NOT interested in being price competitive, and will with certainty past any increased costs onto the customer.

My boat hauler (I have used two different guys) are probably not a very authoritative source. But they are not very interested in conserving space and materials (I buy the materials -> and they will sell me jack stands). They see no problem in "three point" blocking.

I will look in my manual for the sling points. I was thinking about jack stands for this year anyway.

 

[jg300da]

Look at the yard of any boat dealer and you will see hundreds of boats blocked the same way, at three points. Been done for many many years like that without structural damage. Is it perfect? Nope. Sure it would be wonderful to have a custom cradle for each boat, it's just not realistic from the boat yards perspective. I guess you could have one made specifically for your model if you could afford the cost and have some place to store it when not in use.

Comsnark, jackstands are not meant to support weight, only to stabilize the load from any lateral motion. The question in this thread concerns support of the hull, which is a common misconception.

 

[270SLX]

Bear in mind that my 270 SLX has never been STORED in a 3-point system. It is stored on a non-custom cradle (on the edges of two carpeted 2 x 12s). Only at the dealer was the 3-point system used when the boat was in for stress crack repairs. The Sea Ray manual does recommend specific dry storage methods and the 3-point system is not the recommended system.

I am interested in the difference between the 2 x 12 cradle like mine and the custom SR cradle. I know of no problems with storing boats of any size on non-custom cradles, however.

Dennis

 

[fwebster]

The 2 cradles I've seen were basically 2 bunks (about a 2X12) under the hull running forward to aft and 2 precisely cut cross supports (2 pieces of 3/4" plywood fastened together ='ing 1-1/2" wide) that exactly match the hull shape and are positioned at the hull lifting points, which is usually at a main bulkhead.

 

[comsnark]

I've seen the cradles with the 2x12 beams. . . .WITHOUT the cradles at the lift points.

 

[fwebster]

The 2 cradles I mentioned above were factory cradles sold with the boat.

Boat yards and dealers here all use "racks" like you described or made of steel square tubing for storing boats out of the water.

 

[Stray Cat]

Sorry off topic here but....

The September issue of BoatUS magazine has an article on how NOT to crib a boat. Boy there are some gutsy folks out there!

Last winter I saw a 30 + ft house boat cribbed on (4) 55 gallon drums, on dirt...it made it through the spring thaw.