2003 410 Sundancer 410 Shaft Seal

[EddieTrek]

I have a 410 Sundancer with Cat 3126 engines and noticed the Tide Marine Shaft sea is leaking on the Starboard Engine. There is no spare on the shaft so I will need to haul the boat. I was wondering if anyone could give me a little info on the process. I imagine the shaft needs to be unattached from the tranny. Does anyone know if installing the new parts I will need to take off the props as well? Or will the rudder not be in the way to pull out enough? Also if anyone has a mechanic in Dania BEach Florida area that may be able to do this for me at a reasonable price ? Ya I know the reasonable price is a joke lol ...Appreciate any help here. Also I imagine I should do the port engine as well since it's out of the water
Thank you
.

 

[Jimmy Buoy]

Not an expert with diesels, but the mechanics are probably similar. The props will have to come off, coupler removed from the shaft and the shaft slid back enough to fit a new seal over the shaft along with a second (or maybe two more) to be used as a spare for next time.

Sounds easy but in reality probably not. If you have V-Drives access can be a challenge. Also, the coupler doesn't usually just come off without some persuasion sometimes needing heat applied, slide hammers, or even cutting the coupler off.

With Tides the plastic housing for the lip seal can also be worn and if that's the case it might be best to replace with an entirely new Tides unit or even consider another type of unit like Lasdrop shaft seals.

Hope this helps point you in the right direction.

 

[EddieTrek]

Thanx for the input. I was hoping not to have to remove the props but so be it. I do have V Drives. That is a big issue I found . No room down there. I'lll look into those Lasdrop but I think I may be better off to stay with the same thing. I guess I'll figure it out

 

[Golfman25]

Just had my seals replaced. In my case I replaced with the las drop gen 2 seals. Props needed to come off to slide shafts down. In my case the came out and got polished. Also replaced cutlass bearings. I would do both sides. Definitely add spares if you stick with tides. This is when v drives definitely suck.

 

[EddieTrek]

Why did you go with Lasdrop? Was it the price? I think they are quite a bit less if I'm not mistaken. Or do you think they are better for some reason ? The port engine has a spare seal on the shaft. I'm gonna take a close look but I may be ok just using the spare. Lot easier anyway. Yes this is the first bot I've owned with V Drives. They are starting to Suck . SMH.. Thanx for the comment

 

[carterchapman]

The rudders are offset from the shafts so the shafts can be slid back (or removed if needed) without removing the rudders. When you add a seal, add an extra one on the shaft for "the next time!

 

[EddieTrek]

That's good to know. I had a feeling I wouldn't have to remove the rudders but I was hoping I wouldn't have to remove the shaft. And yes there will be an extra one or 2 seals on this shaft . Just in case
Thank You

 

[Golfman25]

So my boat originally had the tides seals. A lot of people don't like them because they can wear the shaft. At some point (before they used the extra seals) a previous owner put in the PSS mechanical seals. They are a good seal and don't directly touch the shaft. Problem is the bellows is used to provide compression and mine just weren't doing it any longer. I think one side had been completely compressed against the shaft log. PSS also recommend a 6 year replacement on the bellows, which is way too short IMO for all the work that is required. My marina has done the PSS for years as many of the manufactures they represent use them. When I spoke with them, they recommended I try the Las Drops - it's a better system that doesn't rely on the bellows to provide the seal presser. Rather they use a spring on the rotating face. We'll see how they do - I splash in May. I put some pictures at the end of my post here:

Shaft Seals, Replace?

So long story made short. Boat is a 1998 370 Sundancer with 7.4s and V-drives. It originally came with the Tides lip seals. At some point, a previous owner replaced the Tides with the PSS face seals. Pure speculation on my part, but probably done prior to 2016. So the bellows, while it...

www.clubsearay.com

 

[EddieTrek]

Gotcha .. OK I appreciate it .. Good luck with your new ones

 

[Jimmy Buoy]

So my boat originally had the tides seals. A lot of people don't like them because they can wear the shaft. At some point (before they used the extra seals) a previous owner put in the PSS mechanical seals. They are a good seal and don't directly touch the shaft. Problem is the bellows is used to provide compression and mine just weren't doing it any longer. I think one side had been completely compressed against the shaft log. PSS also recommend a 6 year replacement on the bellows, which is way too short IMO for all the work that is required. My marina has done the PSS for years as many of the manufactures they represent use them. When I spoke with them, they recommended I try the Las Drops - it's a better system that doesn't rely on the bellows to provide the seal presser. Rather they use a spring on the rotating face. We'll see how they do - I splash in May. I put some pictures at the end of my post here:

Shaft Seals, Replace?

So long story made short. Boat is a 1998 370 Sundancer with 7.4s and V-drives. It originally came with the Tides lip seals. At some point, a previous owner replaced the Tides with the PSS face seals. Pure speculation on my part, but probably done prior to 2016. So the bellows, while it...

www.clubsearay.com

That's why I mentioned Lasdrop if the seal units were going to be replaced.

I've had Tides on my 340 Amberjack. The issue with them is that they are a "lip" seal. The shaft spins on the seal's lip, but with that comes some friction. Sometimes a little friction but sometime a lot of friction like when you get sand or silt in the lip seal. That wears the seal but it can also wear a groove in the shaft itself resulting in leaks.

Lasdrop uses internal stainless springs to provide tension. The idea is that the springs don't degrade like PSS rubber bellows do with age.

 

[Strecker25]

Same boat as yours and did this job along with cutlass bearings at the same time a couple years ago.

If you do it yourself, make sure you have a puller that can put tension on the transmission coupler and you’ll need to wack it with a hammer to break the key loose. If they’ve not been off in a while, it won’t be fun. There is enough room to the bulkhead to at least work your way down there. Take the exhaust off for extra space.

Check alignment, check/replace cutlass bearings, balance and pitch props if it’s been a while. Those are all easier when combined as one job since they involve a lot of the same R&R

 

[Scott215]

That's a crazy amount of work just for a seal and for a v drive. A friend of mine used to have a 40 ft wood Chris-Craft and I remember where the shafts went through to the underside of the boat the stuffing boxes and you just put that cottony stuff on and tighten the nuts up and hope for the best

 

[EddieTrek]

Same boat as yours and did this job along with cutlass bearings at the same time a couple years ago.

If you do it yourself, make sure you have a puller that can put tension on the transmission coupler and you’ll need to wack it with a hammer to break the key loose. If they’ve not been off in a while, it won’t be fun. There is enough room to the bulkhead to at least work your way down there. Take the exhaust off for extra space.

Check alignment, check/replace cutlass bearings, balance and pitch props if it’s been a while. Those are all easier when combined as one job since they involve a lot of the same R&R

So I need to order a new tides unit for 1 side. It is a Fsk1750-3500-1. I know the blue hose is bigger in one side. Do you happen to know the the big side. Is it 3 1/2 "? Im pretty sure it is however I can't see any numbers on the old one.