1999 454 Mag MPI just quits - videos

370Dancer said:
Sierra is 28 bucks, so no fear.
swapped distro with module, rotor and pickup coil intact. No change.
nothing went back in as advertised, so I wound up having to find TDC, setting the distro per #1, and then adjusting for 8 deg BTC. Starboard back to its usual self, port still hosed.
John, I think you are righter at the moment about harness and connectors. spraying them, but that's probably not enough.
I'm not a dummy, but I am feeling like one today......
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No reason to feel down.....it is much easier to solve a dead engine than one that works intermittently. Many of the symptoms fit multiple fuel and electric scenarios. What we do know is that once you get spark....that engine will fire.

I spent two weeks chasing an intermittent shut down on a brand new Westerbeke. It would run great and shutdown for no apparent reason. I talked to the Westerbeke guys probably 5 times and sent them videos.....they in turn sent me parts including a new control board. In the end, I was watching it run and started pulling on parts of the harness and it shut down. It was a simple single spade connector for the distributor that had been over crimped crushing and breaking the wire. It made intermittent contact because the only thing holding it in place was the wire's insulation.

When you find this issue....it will be something simple.
 
I didn't get a ruling from you or scoflaw on whether my fuel pressure reading would remain steady even if I had a rail full of air vs fuel. Seems to me that it would. I have a permanent mounted sensor in the end where the shrader valve was, so putting a gauge on it isn't that easy. Thinking about using the port on the other end to mount the shrader valve, if I can get enough clearance between the rail and the distributor.
Will do the test flow chart you posted this am.
 
Sure air or water. Thought you have a no spark condition, why the interest in fuel at this point?
 
Yeah, a couple of things:
First, Tuesday afternoon I got knocked off my feet for a couple of days with either COVID, or some virus. I'll spare you the details. Just got back on it today.
I followed the troubleshooting charts up to a point, ruling out the grounded tach line, or +12 in and out of the distributor module and so on. I am noticing that the Port Engine is getting slower and slower, even though the voltage was there, the gauge is dropping to 9 volts or so when cranking.
Another thing I did was to swap the distributors intact from one engine to the other.
Moving the stbd "good" distro to the port side yielded no start on the port. Now, I think that is because of battery.
Moving the port "bad" distro to the stbd side yielded no start on the stbd. Further testing of the distributor reveals that the pins on the pickup coil leads are pretty corroded, and the best resistance reading I could get was 2500 ohms. Spec is 850 to 1500, 850 being the preference. The good distributor coil resistance was 840 ohms. So, now I'm thinking that at least the coil is interfering, and this gives me more evidence that this engine got more water in it than I was led to believe when I bought them.
So, I think I'm in for a battery charger that isn't 22 years old, and will likely be kinder to my batteries, and a replacement distributor to be done with it. On another day, I'll buy the coil and replacement tang, disassemble the unit and replace the coil to have an emergency spare.
Talking with the Admiral just now, and as I explained it, I'm thinking that a definitive test could be to swap the battery feed at the battery switches, and put the STBD distro back in the port engine to see if it fires, or I missed something else.
I think I'm in for a new charger no matter what. Searching today, I came across a comment on the
Pro Mariner Sport charger that is so tempting at less than 200 bucks for 3 bank 20 amp rig. Pro Mariner forgets to tell you that you can't use that charger if you still have the batteries in service, ie running whatever 12 v is running. The correct unit is the Pro Mariner ProNautic at 2.5X the money, but made for constant service.
Now I'm just dreaming of replacing the distributor and getting back to both engines running right. That's been an up and down chase for 3 years. (part time)
I think I'm going to go do this now.
 
I'd start moving parts again from one motor to the other to confirm the exact part in question before you continue to throw money at your problem.
 
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I'm aware, and not just a parts change artist. I need a reason to suspect something before I go there. On a 22 year old boat, with 21 year old engines, regardless of their hours, there are things that need attention anyways. I've been questioning the charger for a while, and why my batteries are lasting 2 years. Could be my lifestyle, don't know for sure. 12V always on, always running something, but not much unless we are onboard, and ALL wiring and connections are suspect after 10 years in a salt environment.
I don't want to make maintaining this vessel my full time life's work, but, I do love the boat.
So that brings me to another thing. I swapped the port and starboard battery feed this morning, and the issue of slow start speed did not follow, so I didn't try swapping the Distro. The STBD engine is starting on 12v with or without assist from the Emergency solenoid, sounds like a normal crank speed, and immediately goes up to 13.6 on a running engine. Port still drags either way, and voltage now is dropping to 7-8 volts while cranking. That certainly starts moving the voltage issue towards the connections at the starter, and perhaps the starter itself. That's a 2 bolt test. I've replaced many a starter on vehicles, and other boats I've had. In fact, I might have one laying around. Thanks for continuing to check in.
 
370Dancer said:
I'm aware, and not just a parts change artist. I need a reason to suspect something before I go there. On a 22 year old boat, with 21 year old engines, regardless of their hours, there are things that need attention anyways. I've been questioning the charger for a while, and why my batteries are lasting 2 years. Could be my lifestyle, don't know for sure. 12V always on, always running something, but not much unless we are onboard, and ALL wiring and connections are suspect after 10 years in a salt environment.
I don't want to make maintaining this vessel my full time life's work, but, I do love the boat.
So that brings me to another thing. I swapped the port and starboard battery feed this morning, and the issue of slow start speed did not follow, so I didn't try swapping the Distro. The STBD engine is starting on 12v with or without assist from the Emergency solenoid, sounds like a normal crank speed, and immediately goes up to 13.6 on a running engine. Port still drags either way, and voltage now is dropping to 7-8 volts while cranking. That certainly starts moving the voltage issue towards the connections at the starter, and perhaps the starter itself. That's a 2 bolt test. I've replaced many a starter on vehicles, and other boats I've had. In fact, I might have one laying around. Thanks for continuing to check in.
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I'm with you regarding replacing the battery charger if it is original. Anything before 2000 simply did not have the electronics to properly charge a battery. Wet cells in my boat were cooked after 2 years until I changed the charger and then they went 5 years with the very same Costco battery type. I went with a previous version of this one that was a 30 amp model: http://www.xantrex.com/power-products/battery-chargers/truecharge-2-2.aspx

It paid for itself given I have 6 batteries (they are all Optima now). Being able to select what battery you have (AGM or wet) is great.

It won't solve the no start problem but it will be a positive improvement.:)
 
370Dancer said:
That's the one I bought. Will be here tomorrow.
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We probably have 7 or 8 sea rays we boat with from 300’s to 380’s and all but one or 2 have went with this charger. One that I know went with another brand is struggling with theirs still
 
Chris-380 said:
We probably have 7 or 8 sea rays we boat with from 300’s to 380’s and all but one or 2 have went with this charger. One that I know went with another brand is struggling with theirs still
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Basically any modern charger is a material upgrade from the old technology. Promariner Pronautic is top of the line.

Their only weakness is their remote display. Other manufacturers have the ability to monitor any of the three banks and provide you alarm information whether you are connected to shore power/running generator or not. Allegedly, the 63100 ProNautic Helm Remote Display only lets you view one Bank...hopefully that has changed.
 
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I could def use a remote display, thank you for this inf

this it?

https://www.batterystuff.com/all-pr...er-pronautic-p-helm-remote-control-63100.html


PlayDate said:
Basically any modern charger is a material upgrade from the old technology. Promariner Pronautic is top of the line. The remote display is a nice add on if you have space on your helm for it. It gives the status of each bank and what condition it is in.

It also gives you a relative load on each of the banks. For example, if you have your high amp stereo system and dc refrigerator both working on the House bank, the display will show you how many amps are required to keep the battery level. It is a relative measure when you are connected to shore power or running the generator.

Particularly useful is the voltage display when you are not connected to shore power or running a generator. That can tell you pretty quickly if you are depleting a bank.
Click to expand...
 
Chris-380 said:
I could def use a remote display, thank you for this inf

this it?

https://www.batterystuff.com/all-pr...er-pronautic-p-helm-remote-control-63100.html
Click to expand...

Chris,

Amazon has it for a bit less:

https://www.amazon.com/ProMariner-63100-ProNautic-Display-Battery/dp/B009PIR0EW


I actually updated my comments on the ProNautic remote display. My Xantrex charger's remote display gives me rolling data on each bank (amps/volts/charging status). It also allows me to program battery type and alarms. I thought this was the case for the ProNautic as well.

Allegedly......based on the feedback associated with the ProMariner 63100 (the manual for it only explains how to change the language).....it only does that on one Bank which hopefully they have or will address. One of my slip mates has the 63100 remote display on his boat so hopefully I can find out what it can actually do.
 
Please don't hijack the thread too far off the original title.
Someday I, and others will want to read through this.
Patiently awaiting game changing parts, and of course ETA, who will douse my activity for a few days.
 
370Dancer said:
Please don't hijack the thread too far off the original title.
Someday I, and others will want to read through this.
Patiently awaiting game changing parts, and of course ETA, who will douse my activity for a few days.
Click to expand...


We are just entertaining ourselves in the meantime.:) Some guy wants to install air in his boat and use a Honda EU2000 to power it......so we might go spend some time on that thread.
 
370Dancer said:
Only if he puts the Honda in the engine room to keep the noise and smoke down........
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