1986 340 Dancer

[twinscrewzz]

Well my search for another Sundancer continues.

Owned a 270 while the kids were growing up and now Grand Kids. Time to create more memories.

On to my questions

Looked at a 86 340 today.

Twin Crusader 350's Direct drives Kohler genset

engines 900 hours.

Genset 30 hrs.

Marine AC currently not cooling.

I know nothing about direct drives other than less performance than IO's
Main concern is hours on gear box.

Sure could use some input from mid 80's 340 owners on what to look for or ay random comments.
thanks
Mike

 

[twinscrewzz]

I'm suprised no comments from any 80's 340 Sundancer owners. in 4 days. Must be on the water.
Still looking for thoughts.
thanks

 

[1956olds]

I dont own a 340,but just curious what drives are in it ,inline or v.Inline can be removed for repairs without removing the engine,v drives cant.I havent heard of a sundancer with inlines either because the engines are set farther forwards in the bilge so i am thinking inlines =express cruiser not sundancer.

 

[northshore]

I'm suprised no comments from any 80's 340 Sundancer owners. in 4 days. Must be on the water.
Still looking for thoughts.
thanks

Were here! Greetings Mike! - Sorry I missed this!

Start here for damn near everything you wanted to know about 340's of the vintage you are looking at

The big old 80's 340 owners thread

I would not trade mine for the world - love it!

The 'Grand Poo-bah' of the 'Hole in the water club' is Jim aka 'Mopar'

If you post in the forum mentioned above, I'm certain he will chime in.
I know he has Crusaders on his 340 and it moves! (We are trying to get him to put an arch on his 340 to slow him down)

-Mike

 

[DanW]

I've got an '88 340 Sundancer, but with 454s and v-drives. So, I can't really speak to your questions. (I thought sundancer a had v-drives and expresses had straight drives, but I could be wrong). Anyway, I love my 340!

Good luck with your boat!

Dan

 

[twinscrewzz]

It is a dancer. And I'm learning already. Must be V Drives. I have always had IO's so know nothing about V Drives.

I have been working my way through the other thread. into 2012
thanks for the input

 

[julietbravomike]

I have an '89 340 DA with 7.4l closed cooled Merc's and Borg Warner v-drives - 850 hrs - along with an Onan 6.5 MCCK . I don't think anyone will tell you 900 hrs is excessive, but it all depends on how the boat was used and how it was maintained. Probably best to get a survey and a good sea trial. The condition of these boats vary wildly depending on how they've been maintained, but generally speaking, they are great boats with a ton of room. A quick peek in the engine room will tell you a lot, but you'll definitely want to ensure the stringers that hold the engines/transmissions are sound and not wet with moisture or rotten. Those stingers have "limber holes" in them, circular holes that water drains through. Sea Ray siliconed PVC pipe in these holes, and over time, the silicone can degrade and let water seep into the wooden stringers. Prior to spending the money for a survey, you might consider going out to the boat (assuming it's in the water) start the engines, run the genset with a load, open the engine hatches, take it for a spin, then make a list of specific questions to post here. You might also take photos of the engine room/boat and post here. You'll get a ton of interest that way, and a lot of good info.

Also, 30 hours on the genset seems really low. I'd suspect it has something wrong with it and was never used, or the hour meter is disconnected.

 

[twinscrewzz]

JBM
typo on my part. 282 hrs on Gen set trying to type 300 and fat fingered the keyboard. Boat is and has always been wet slipped with shore power. I have been on the boat and stuck my head into the engine compartment. Started up both the engines and genset. Put my hand on both prior to startup to make sure they had not pre started prior to my visit. maintinence records kept on the boat going back 10 years. In AZ and the AC was not functioning so did not spend any time reviewing. Last owner only owned for 4 months before passing. Had it out of the water for work at a shop 1 mile from my house that I am familiar with so planning on discussing with them what they worked on.
I'll get back out there and get somemore pics up this weekend.
Short of a survey $15 per foot here excluding engines and trans.

 

[julietbravomike]

JBM
typo on my part. 282 hrs on Gen set trying to type 300 and fat fingered the keyboard. Boat is and has always been wet slipped with shore power. I have been on the boat and stuck my head into the engine compartment. Started up both the engines and genset. Put my hand on both prior to startup to make sure they had not pre started prior to my visit. maintinence records kept on the boat going back 10 years. In AZ and the AC was not functioning so did not spend any time reviewing. Last owner only owned for 4 months before passing. Had it out of the water for work at a shop 1 mile from my house that I am familiar with so planning on discussing with them what they worked on.
I'll get back out there and get somemore pics up this weekend.
Short of a survey $15 per foot here excluding engines and trans.

View attachment 40811

300 sounds more like it. Mine has 680 ish. I really don't know that much about the a/c systems, other than they won't cool without water flowing through them. Good luck to you and let me know if I can help.

 

[twinscrewzz]

300 sounds more like it. Mine has 680 ish. I really don't know that much about the a/c systems, other than they won't cool without water flowing through them. Good luck to you and let me know if I can help.

Owners brother is having ac looked at. Interested in thoughts as to how to determine if stringers are wet? I can look at the bildge for standing water. short of that clueless.
Given the quick once over eye test no real issues visable. It needs some teak work. It does look like a well kept 30 year old boat. 2 year old bottom paint. Gel coat a bit oxidized and in need of a polish. original windless.
Again my concern is the V Drive I know nothing about.

 

[julietbravomike]

For the stringers, a survey would probably include a moisture test. I don't know much about the science behind how they work, but I read lots of different opinions on how useful and accurate those tests are. If the current owner doesn't mind, you could try to remove the PVC and see if there is moisture trapped b/t it and the stringer. Some people drill into the stringer and look at whether the wood shavings are dry/wet/rotten/normal, but I could never get comfortable with that. Others take a big screwdriver, hammer, etc. and tap lightly all over the stringer and listen for dead spots. I don't think this method would detect moisture, but would help detect delamination or a complete crumbling/void type scenario.

For the v-drives, they are likely Borg Warner 72c's / 10-15-xxxx. Although it's really one "unit" - in reality, you have a transmission section and a v-drive (gearbox) section. You can google for service and overhaul manuals. I had to overhaul my port v-drive last year due to a seal failure that allowed most of the oil to leak out. In my experience, they are really tough units and will last a long time if maintained properly. But, when they fail, you have to remove the engine + v-drive as an assembly. It isn't terribly difficult, but it requires heavy equipment. There's just no practical way to get one out without the other. An overhaul kit for the transmission (clutch plates, seals, etc.) is relatively inexpensive, but the gearbox is a different story. The gearboxes are either chain drive or gear drive (mine are both gear) and the two parts most prone to failure (intermediate shaft and lower shaft) are matched sets that go for around $2500 used and $4000-ish new. If you are lucky, you can find a good used take-out for something less.

Here's a perfect world way overkill list of things you might consider doing to the transmissions/v-drives (in no particular order):

1) put an oil pressure gauge on the transmissions as described in the manual and make sure it's close to specs
2) disconnect the shaft flange and turn the transmission output shaft flange and listen for any rumbling
3) see if there's any in/out play in the output shaft
4) check the oil and wipe it on a white towel to see if it's clean (these transmissions MUST be kept full to slightly over filled)
5) check to see if the shaft alignment is close - if it isn't it should be adjusted soon
6) maneuver around the dock/slip with the engine hatches off so you can hear the transmissions - they all whine in reverse, some give a little clunk when they engage in either direction, but there shouldn't be any rumbling, grumbling, thumping or shaft wobbling.

I hope that helps...

 

[twinscrewzz]

For the stringers, a survey would probably include a moisture test. I don't know much about the science behind how they work, but I read lots of different opinions on how useful and accurate those tests are. If the current owner doesn't mind, you could try to remove the PVC and see if there is moisture trapped b/t it and the stringer. Some people drill into the stringer and look at whether the wood shavings are dry/wet/rotten/normal, but I could never get comfortable with that. Others take a big screwdriver, hammer, etc. and tap lightly all over the stringer and listen for dead spots. I don't think this method would detect moisture, but would help detect delamination or a complete crumbling/void type scenario.

For the v-drives, they are likely Borg Warner 72c's / 10-15-xxxx. Although it's really one "unit" - in reality, you have a transmission section and a v-drive (gearbox) section. You can google for service and overhaul manuals. I had to overhaul my port v-drive last year due to a seal failure that allowed most of the oil to leak out. In my experience, they are really tough units and will last a long time if maintained properly. But, when they fail, you have to remove the engine + v-drive as an assembly. It isn't terribly difficult, but it requires heavy equipment. There's just no practical way to get one out without the other. An overhaul kit for the transmission (clutch plates, seals, etc.) is relatively inexpensive, but the gearbox is a different story. The gearboxes are either chain drive or gear drive (mine are both gear) and the two parts most prone to failure (intermediate shaft and lower shaft) are matched sets that go for around $2500 used and $4000-ish new. If you are lucky, you can find a good used take-out for something less.

Here's a perfect world way overkill list of things you might consider doing to the transmissions/v-drives (in no particular order):

1) put an oil pressure gauge on the transmissions as described in the manual and make sure it's close to specs
2) disconnect the shaft flange and turn the transmission output shaft flange and listen for any rumbling
3) see if there's any in/out play in the output shaft
4) check the oil and wipe it on a white towel to see if it's clean (these transmissions MUST be kept full to slightly over filled)
5) check to see if the shaft alignment is close - if it isn't it should be adjusted soon
6) maneuver around the dock/slip with the engine hatches off so you can hear the transmissions - they all whine in reverse, some give a little clunk when they engage in either direction, but there shouldn't be any rumbling, grumbling, thumping or shaft wobbling.

I hope that helps...

Huge help
Just the kind of information I was looking for. I don't want to get into rebuilding trans. for at least the first couple of seasons. Nor do I want to drop 5 to 10K without factoring into the price. which of course doesnot leave much of an offer.

 

[julietbravomike]

I don't mean to discourage you though. These are seriously great boats and I love mine. You'll be hard pressed to find something as roomy for anywhere close to the same money. Don't walk just b/c of what I said!!!

 

[twinscrewzz]

I don't mean to discourage you though. These are seriously great boats and I love mine. You'll be hard pressed to find something as roomy for anywhere close to the same money. Don't walk just b/c of what I said!!!

Sorry if I gave that impression. Not planning to walk just want to make an informed decision. I expect to make an offer but want to know what i'm getting into to determine my offer. Will be crawling around it this weekend.
Not new to boats or sundancers as I owned a 270 sundancer for a number of years. I don't expect a 30 year old boat to be perfect. I was a purchasing agent in the aerospace world for 30 years so I have a number of boxes to check prior to making an offer. Old habits die hard.