What to do?

Hi all,
We have serious mechanical issue that seems to just keep growing.
Beginning of March we prepared to take the boat down to Venice for the weekend. Started her up, (which she did perfect) ran her for 20 minutes (up to temp) shut her off, drove to gas station filled up with non-ethanol and drove the 3.5 hrs to get to Venice. When we got to boat ramp my husband went up into cabin and smelled gas. We knew this was NOT good, so we opened all the windows, turned everything off and drove home. Called our mechanic as we had some scheduled items to be replaced. Our mechanic came over and said gas smell issue was fuel sender gasket (that he replaced last summer) compresses with time and has to be tightened repeatedly. He said that was good to go although we should check the gasket before we take it out everytime. Ok now we know. He then replaced the gauges and u-joint bellows as we had planned for all winter. He also decided to read the code from an alarm we had go off in the keys the summer before to see if we could tell why. He said there was no error code. So everything got buttoned up and he tried starting boat. It would NOT turn over. After quite a few starting attempts I noticed the run (safety) switch was off. So he tried again and off course said it was now thoroughly flooded. We waited awhile still no start. As of now we have replaced the spark plugs, new distributor cap and rotor, ignition coil and now he is telling me the ECM could be the problem. How does an ECM go bad? What I have read shows that it goes with time, rough, misfire ect. The one thing I know about this boat is that it has NEVER not started on 1st try since we have owned it. ECMs are like $1500 and what if thats not it? I am feeling frustrated and thought you all might have seen or heard about this. The engine block is new as of 2012 I feel like I paid a $1800 mechanic bill and now my boat dosen't run. Mechanic is a really nice guy who has a cult following in Florida. He has worked on this boat with the past owner too. Would replacing guages cause something to not work? Could reading a code cause this? What do you all suggest? Suck it up and buy the ECM and HOPE it works?

In the beginning, when you ran it for 20 minutes, can we assume the boat was in the water or on a water hose with muffs?

My first thought on the gas smell would have been overflow from the vent due to the fill-up. But I suppose the sender could have also been leaking... not so sure it requires constant tightening though.

Then you say "it would NOT turn over"... to most of us that means that the starter would not rotate the motor. But maybe you mean it would turn over (rotate), but would not fire?

To me, it's unlikely that the ECM would just fail. I question why the mechanic would just start throwing parts at it with out a better evaluation of the problem. Plugs would have been the last thing I would have tried. Now I might have looked at a couple of them to see if they were wet with fuel.

Replacing the gauges and reading a code should not cause the ECM to go bad.

My question is are u fuel injected or carbed. You mechanic tried to start it with the kill switch off then told u it was flooded. From my understanding u can't flood a fi motor. And if it is carbed u don't have an ecm. If I'm following u correctly that would b my que to find a new mechanic

Hi Summer Daze,
Boat was ran at home on hose and muffs. Mechanic exact verbage on the bill is: When an attempt was made to start the engine it would not start. Engine was getting sprk but may have been to weak. Spark plugs were heavily carboned up-replaced spark plugs-no help Will order new distributor cap and rotor.

Replaced distributor cap and rotor-no change Rechecked spark going into distributor cap-was very strong. Absolutley no spark coming out. Next thing to try in the chain is the coil and module.

Hi Summer Daze,
His exact verbage on the bill is: When an attempt was made to start the engine it would not start. Engine was getting sprk but may have been to weak. Spark plugs were heavily carboned up-replaced spark plugs-no help Will order new distributor cap and rotor.

Replaced distributor cap and rotor-no change Rechecked spark going into distributor cap-was very strong. Absolutley no spark coming out. Next thing to try in the chain is the coil and module.

Now honestly to me that sounds like a coil. Very easy to check and change yourself. Go but one open the box nicely and neat install and crank. If it works great your done if it doesn't go ahead and return it. But before u buy it pull a plug ground it to the motor with the wire attached and have somebody turn the key. Make sure u have spark at the plug. ( disconnect all other plugs so the engine doesn't magically start) if no spark then buy the coil. If u have spark move to fuel. Check fuel pressure and make sure its up to spec. If thats good make sure it getting into the engine by seeing if plugs are wet after cranking if that's good well I'm out of ideas.

Sorry page 2 of the bill has pickup coil, ignition and ignition module. So that was done too! Now we are on to ECM

The distributor has a set of pickups in it. Under the rotor. (mine does) you should see three wires come from it and on to other areas. First do you have a pickup, second was it replaced? I will post a photo of the part in question here in a second.

OK, so this may be a long shot but the boat ran fine up to temperature and fine to the fuel dock. Assuming the mechanic was correct about the fuel smell and that part is now fixed (this is important because diagnosing a bunch of floating fiberglass splinters, and some sunken mechanical components really takes you to a worse place). What are the odds the fuel attendant fueled you up with diesel?? I say this was a job for the mighty can of Diethyl Ether (Starter Fluid). You needed to determine if the problem was truly fuel or spark. Reading your previous post the mechanic has stated that "the spark going to the distributor caps is strong, but no spark coming out" and recommended and ECM?? am I following that correctly?? Because if I am, plus one on the 'get a new mechanic'. if you have spark to the cap but not from the cap you have a rotor issue. Wrong rotor, dude left them in his tool box, spark able to ground somewhere besides the rotor and wires. I am going to take my long shot here. Schmo number one put in the wrong fuel. Schmo number two diagnosed it as a spark problem and did something in the cap rotor swap that added to the problem.

There is a possibility that the rotors are not turning inside the distributor caps, but I would say that is unlikely because the boat was running good on warm up and to the fuel dock. I am with JimG on the ECM being unlikely for the same reason.

sorry if this wasn't clear, we trailer the boat. We ran the boat on the muffs for 20 minutes or so at home. It was the first start after a month and a half. She started like she always has, perfect. We then went to the gas station and filled it ourselves from the non-ethanol pump at the gas station. There is only one so the diesel is not the issue. But I sure appreciate all the problem solving help. We then drove the 3.5 hrs down to venice- had the gas smell -drove home- called the mechanic. To be clear he did the spark plugs, distributor cap and rotor, ignition coil, pickup coil,ignition and ignition module. As per the bill.

OK so no diesel fuel. I am down to why there is spark to the cap but nothing out from the cap. The job of "pickup coil, ignition and ignition module" is to tell the "ignition coil" when to fire, and we have a strong spark now to the distributor correct? If no spark to the wires, something is goofy with the new cap or rotor. Can you easily compare the new cap and rotor to the old ones that were removed? Also, just for GP, I would like to see if the rotor turns when the engine is cranked. If I am reading this correctly the distributor is not 'distributing' the spark, it is finding another route for the spark that is not helpful. Once you have spark FROM the distributor, you may be back to fuel fouled plugs. A little ether might get you going and allow the plugs to clean out. If this is a fuel injected motor, there is a possibility of a weak fuel pump. GM Poppets require about 55psi to work. I am assuming this is not the problem because the original plugs were fuel fouled.

Honestly Im very confused. I think u should completly start over. R u mechanically inclined and physically able to work on your engine? If so Climb down remove all plug wires calls rotor ignition wire ect. Check all ends to make sure they will all seat correctly and are not damaged. Reinstall everything slowly tightly and correctly. Make sure the rotor spins freely and makes contact with the cap. Make sure the cap is not defective. Then move in to the wires. Make sure there all seated tightly and securely and make sure the firing order is correct. If that fails then umm well take it from there. I honestly think there was an honest mistake that somebody maid when reinstalling everything. And also make sure your in neutral at the stick!

And also make sure your in neutral at the stick!

I think this would be a good place to start that and the kill switch

It sounds like you really need a better mechanic. He's just shooting in the dark throwing parts at an undiagnosed problem. The timing did not change on its own so that was not the original problem. It could be now that the mechanic has replaced the pick up coil though. When timing is even approximately correct, there are only two reason an engine does not start (assuming it isn't blown up or seized up) and those are no spark or no fuel. Both are easy to check and you work back from there. You don't just start buying parts and hoping you get lucky replacing the right one. The fuel smell could have come from several places, and that fuel sender gasket is a possibility, but they do not usually need constant re-tightening. A more likely place would be a vent or even a stuck carburetor float causing an overflow. Tat happens a lot when a boat sits and That could also definitely prevent an engine from starting, either through fuel starvation or fuel flooding. All easy to check and usually easy to fix. Start from scratch again.

M99 said:

It sounds like you really need a better mechanic. He's just shooting in the dark throwing parts at an undiagnosed problem. The timing did not change on its own so that was not the original problem. It could be now that the mechanic has replaced the pick up coil though. When timing is even approximately correct, there are only two reason an engine does not start (assuming it isn't blown up or seized up) and those are no spark or no fuel. Both are easy to check and you work back from there. You don't just start buying parts and hoping you get lucky replacing the right one. The fuel smell could have come from several places, and that fuel sender gasket is a possibility, but they do not usually need constant re-tightening. A more likely place would be a vent or even a stuck carburetor float causing an overflow. Tat happens a lot when a boat sits and That could also definitely prevent an engine from starting, either through fuel starvation or fuel flooding. All easy to check and usually easy to fix. Start from scratch again.

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I was starting to feel bad about saying he needs a new mechanic lol glad I'm not the only one

Do not feel Bad 'Xplicitlnck' I am also usually reticent to call out the mechanic based on a thread, but you will note my earlier post ("Reading your previous post the mechanic has stated that"the spark going to the distributor caps is strong, but no spark coming out" and recommended and ECM?? am I following that correctly?? Because if I am, plus one on the 'get a new mechanic'.") I am thinking this was a fuel problem, that has now been compounded by a wrong, or faulty, electrical component.

Xplicitlnck said:

I was starting to feel bad about saying he needs a new mechanic lol glad I'm not the only one

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I was thinking 'new mechanic' when he told them to check the fuel sender for leaks every time they want to use the boat...c'mon. The boat ran when they let him have it to do some other work...it hasn't run since. Yup, new mechanic and send the old one the bill.:lol:

Ouch lol well any updates?

Does your boat have a electrical soleniod in the fuel line next to the fuel tank? If so, there should be a manual bypass knob on it.