Radar Arch Cracking - Searay Poor Quality and Customer Service

So, we purchased a new 2009 270 Dancer with an in-service date of 5/11/11 and this spring noticed cracking occurring in the radar arch base - dealer says it should be under warranty. SR says it's not warranty since it is not "structural". I asked what does "structural" constitute - they said that it won't come off. I asked if they can guarantee that without looking at it (they have pictures) they said "no".
So, they need to look at it to determine if its warranty, but won't cover costs to look at it? I told the dealer I'll cover it - but he agrees SR is failing on this. The dealer is having no luck getting SR to cover the cost of repair.
Personally, I am disappointed - the arch is not identified anywhere in the warranty notice as covered or not. Seeing the water coming out from that location, dealership feels it may be part of a larger problem. It doesn’t appear Searay will cover the cost of the repairs.
Anyone else's ideas and opinions?

And why can’t I upload pictures anymore – 19kb? Really?

One lousy picture....that's it?

Excuse me, but posting a poll on this subject makes no sense at all. It is Sea Rays warranty so it covers what Sea Ray says it covers..........specifically what the warranty page in your owners packet says. Arguing the definition of terms is fruitless.

The truth of the matter is your boat is out of warranty for anything other than what the structural warranty covers. The radar arch isn't part of the vessel's structure.

Sea Ray is a great company that usually goes way beyond the norm to insure customer satisfaction. If you handle this correctly, you might get some help as a good will gesture.........but do you really want to "burn up" good will chips on a $150 repair?

If you want more photo space, consider contributing to the CSR site by becoming a sponsor. One of the benefits, other than supporting a great site where you get free valuable information, is lots of extra photo and message space.

Have you personally tried contacting SR customer service or just letting your dealer do it ??
I have always found them very helpful and responsive to customer needs.
and FWIW ....this can be a good place to burn bridges as well as build them...
the squeaky wheel sometimes DOES just fall off...not greased.

I would ask a moderator to take this down and work through channels. There are members here who can help you find those channels. It will be better for all to work this way. Good luck, MM

Interesting.
Yes, I contacted them - and they couldnt be less helpful. The rusty water could indicate bolts corrosion, water intrusion. Note this is a boat stored indoors.
Your opinion is that the warranty does not cover the arch. It is not identified on the warranty, if it was, I wouldn't contest it. Searay admits if the mount to the arch fails, its warranty.
Put it a different way, I will warrant your car only if the door falls off. The fact that the door hinges are cracked and getting worse doesnt matter.
Since this is a forum, I am looking for advice, and your recommendation is to not complain and remove this?
Seriously, I have dealt with wripped headliner, in-fill cushions for the wrong model, cabin doors that didn't close, engine hatch that wouldnt close, and broken stereo - all at delivery. Now this - and I'm the issue?
Where's the lemon law for boats?

Of course you are not the issue.....your approach is the issue.

Had you asked for help in working this out with Sea Ray, I would have been quick to tell you the 1,2, 3 & 4 of trying to get a Sea Ray to cover this repair or at least help, but starting a poll to vote on how wrong Sea Ray is in interpreting their own warranty won't win many friends among the guys who make the decision and can help you.

This is a guess, but based on your original punch list (all of which should have been dealt with before you ever saw the boat, much less before you took delivery), my guess is that your dealer could have been more help with the arch than they were.

Did you have a survey before purchase? Just curious.

Also, as others have mentioned it also sounds like your dealer may be part of the issue. Did you discover your list of issues before or after purchase?

Folks on this forum are glad to help, you just need the correct approach. I understand it can be frustrating to have something go wrong with your boat. We've all been there.

In terms of the arch, did your dealer give you a repair estimate? Fixing the Fiberglas isn't terribly difficult or expensive. They probably can also diagnose any other issue.

Blitzn, with all these issues you have listed....why did you take possession of this piticular boat? Granted these are mostly small issues but if you knew then why? Richmond SeaRay bent over backwards to make sure my 300 was fixed, even found some issues that I didn't and fixed them as well. Seems to me and my limited knowledge of SeaRay Corp, these are all things your dealer should have found and fixed, before you signed the bottom line. I'm not saying you're right...and I'm not saying they're right I am just asking

You can catch more flies with honey than vinegar, of course you can catch way more flies with horse manure. You seem to want to throw the manure around and when that happens, people (SeaRay in this case) tend to duck and run.

I have to agree with everyone here, you have gone about this the wrong way. This is a very simple cosmetic fix as of right now. Document this, try to get SeaRay or your dealer to help in the repair and keep an eye on it. Fixing this small area is, as Frank said $150 (if that), a very easy project. Burning bridges is not the way to handle this problem. Listen to everyone here as they know what they are talking about for this type of stuff. Your analogy or a door falling off is not quite the same problem you have here as it is not life threatening or dangerous. But again, keep and eye on it and document the progress because if further problems to occur (highly doubt it) then at least you have documentation.

Trit21 & dwna1 – thanks for constructive comments and what a great answer. Sure, honey is better. I usually try that – and it has gotten me nowhere…..so now what?
I never said it was cosmetic or $150. So far the quote is around $470 before they open it and find it may be worse….for $100-150, yeah I probably wouldn’t bother either. Plus I have to drive it down 40 miles to the dealer, with an unknown timeframe, and yes – winter up here is approaching quickly. I don’t want to have to bring it back in a snowstorm.

I’m ticked and irritated both with the dealership and the brand – and this was kind of my last idea to get your insights. Instead I’ve seen brand loyalists who threaten to remove your thread and membership? Really? While this may not be the best way to approach the issue – I am open to ideas – but no one has given any. To answer your posed questions:
No, I did not get a survey. Being as the boat was new, never owned, and admittedly my first boat purchase - perhaps I was naïve (or dumb – I don’t mind). Certainly with such a storied legacy in boating, - guess I expected things to be like the auto industry where such poor quality would have been screamed about from JD Power and every other quality ranking (yes, I admit I used to work at GM – I’ve seen poor quality). Why a Searay? it’s a local dealer and with the downturn in 2007 many left the area – and I try to support local and US companies.
The dealer has worked to make all the repairs - but yes, I made the punchlist as items were identified when I took delivery - I forgot to mention the cracked dash, ill-fitting & rubbing cockpit door, and what I would refer to as fit- and finish items. Should these have been fixed before delivery - I'd of thought that too. However – with a true ISO quality process – these should never have made it through production (really - I couldn't use the V-berth since the cushions didn't fit? table support posts were missing). I feel bad bringing issues to the dealer – since dealers pay for the repairs and are reimbursed a reduced hourly rate punish the dealership for the faults of the manufacturer. Certainly better for all if the vehicles are built right in the first place?
Why this model? We liked the balance of size and amenities - also debated a leftover 2008 260. Yes, I am also irritated with the dealer - who started this process in July, and here it is October and I'm the only who continues to follow up on things. Searay agrees it may be warranty, but needs to have it looked at first. The arch is NOT on the warranty sheet – don’t tell me to check it. I already did – it is neither included NOR excluded from the warranty. Guess it gives lawyers something to argue if it ever came to it.
Interesting, the prevailing attitude seems to be simply pay for it and shut up. Certainly I’ve seen that expressed by some. Then I note that you’ve removed the poll “for my own good”. Really? Wow. I’m man enough to admit if I do something wrong – perhaps this thread isn’t the right approach – but no one has offered any constructive comments either as a better way to proceed.
I created this thread to get some membership input – and I am amazed at the responses:

1. The warranty covers what it says, so shut up and pay for it (actually – warranty doesn’t say it)
2. Handle it yourself, shut up and pay for it
3. Contribute to the website, shut up and pay for it
4. We are omnipotent and disapprove of the way you are approaching this – thou shalt not complain about Searays. Keep complaining and we’ll boot you from the forum (fall off)

And yet few have sent any comments about a better way to address this….attack the messenger, live with poor quality.
My father bought a FourWinns new, and never had issues like this. Guess I expected better.
This thread will probably be deleted. Ah well - sorry.

I agree with pretty much everything said by the contributors to this thread so far. I had a similar crack in my arch in 2010, maybe a little smaller. The dealer said they would check with Sea Ray for warranty. Not sure if it was covered or not but assuming it was because the dealer fixed it free of charge. Who knows, maybe the dealer just fixed it since it was a minor repair and they have their own gel coat guy? Either way it got fixed and never came back. I have kept a great relationship with my dealer. Honestly, if you bought the boat new and have kept a good relationship with the dealer, I cant imagine them not fixing it for you if Sea Ray won't. As another said, you will catch more flies with honey.....

Thanks Jason. I suspect the dealership doesn't want to fix it since they are uncertain how much it will cost too, plus they don't have a fiberglass person. I know service said they had to bring one in to look at it.

If the boat was new, but you bought it in 2011 did the dealer use it for demo purposes? Did it have hours on the engines. I doubt SeaRay would allow a defective product with visible blemishes out the door. I just wonder if some of the issues creeped up after the dealer took the boat.

With that said I always start with my dealer. I'm not sure what you're really looking for from this forum. You seem pretty defensive and trashing the brand. Boats are never perfect and they require a ton of maintenance. Every brand, including SeaRay.

Blitzn said:

Thanks Jason. I suspect the dealership doesn't want to fix it since they are uncertain how much it will cost too, plus they don't have a fiberglass person. I know service said they had to bring one in to look at it.

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I do wish you the best with this. I am not a fiberglass pro by any stretch but the user "fwebster" who initially referred to this as a $150 dollar repair is probably considered the top expert here (and other places) on boats in general so please understand he did not likely just pull that number out of thin air. May end up being more, who knows, especially considering you can't tell 100% from a picture. I will say I agree this "looks" to be a cosmetic gel coat crack. This is not the first time someone reported one on the base of the arch. As I stated, I had one myself. I suspect your dealer may in the dark on this too since as you say it does not sound like they have any experience with fiberglass. I would encourage you to find someone local to have a look at it. It may put your mind at ease.

WDCboater said:

If the boat was new, but you bought it in 2011 did the dealer use it for demo purposes? Did it have hours on the engines. I doubt SeaRay would allow a defective product with visible blemishes out the door. I just wonder if some of the issues creeped up after the dealer took the boat.

With that said I always start with my dealer. I'm not sure what you're really looking for from this forum. You seem pretty defensive and trashing the brand. Boats are never perfect and they require a ton of maintenance. Every brand, including SeaRay.

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With the downturn in the economy (recession, depression, whatever) - there were many boats sitting around. I think it had like 2 hours on it when we got it. Had been to a couple of in-water boat shows and the like. The cracked dash, they attributed to a boat show. However missing table post and filler cushions not fitting they said came straight from the factory. Not trying to trash the brand - but dagnabbit - I want to know how others handled this. Jason said his dealership did it - that's helpful. If saying that a vessel/vehicle has poor fit and finish is trashing a brand - well truth hurts I guess. I've applauded all the dealer has done to make things right actually elsewhere.

jason78 said:

I do wish you the best with this. I am not a fiberglass pro by any stretch but the user "fwebster" who initially referred to this as a $150 dollar repair is probably considered the top expert here (and other places) on boats in general so please understand he did not likely just pull that number out of thin air. May end up being more, who knows, especially considering you can't tell 100% from a picture. I will say I agree this "looks" to be a cosmetic gel coat crack. This is not the first time someone reported one on the base of the arch. As I stated, I had one myself. I suspect your dealer may in the dark on this too since as you say it does not sound like they have any experience with fiberglass. I would encourage you to find someone local to have a look at it. It may put your mind at ease.

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THANK YOU!!!!!!! Now to find a local fiberglass fellow.....

So if I (we) may ask, what are they fixing for $470? I know you were only able to post one photo and that is all we have to work on at this time. That repair if it is all you are showing, which for $470 it better be more, is not a $470 repair. If is all they are fixing is the gelcoat, then that quote is way way high. If there is something else I have not seen it written here (unless I missed it above). Radar arches (SP?) are not structural for the operation of the boat. As a matter of fact, some come without them entirely. So please let us know what they have quoted you as I think some information must be missing.

EDIT: Obviously I am not brand loyal but have owned 2 SeaRay's. Just trying to help a fellow boater regardless of what type of boat you own.

Nope, that's it. My understanding is remove the arch, repair the fiberglass, re-install the arch and canvas. I do find the dealership is typically higher priced admittedly (GPS installation, etc) and they are a high ranked Searay dealer. They think the crack goes all the way through and the mount may be an issue. I'd love to see a schematic of how these are installed.

In addition, for what it is worth, it is my opinion, based on what you have shared, that your dealer probably is causing you more frustration than Sea Ray. I would imagine a certain expectation exists that dealers will handle the "Tier 1" issues that come up. It is just part of doing business and customer service. If you think about it, Sea Ray can't fly someone up from Knoxville to fix what very well may be a cosmetic crack simply because the selling dealer does not have anyone in house capable of doing glass/gel work, or even assessing the problem- Or to pay retail cost for a third party to come in and do it. As before, my advice would be find someone independent to look at it, then you know what you are dealing with. I just cant understand $470 to walk up and look at a crack then issue an estimate. Maybe if you have a reasonable repair cost estimate, your dealer will work out some way to credit you for doing the repair? Check, service credit, parts, etc.