Current Housing Market 2009 - Experiences?

I've had my house for sale for the past 6 months and it's still not sold. The situation has become very very frustrating because of the total inconvenience that having the house cleaned 100% of the time. I mean you can't even leave a dish out over night for fear that a buyer might come in while you're at work. I am having a hard time discerning whether the market, the buyers, the media, or my realtor is to blame. I've had several open houses, over 30 showings, 3 offers, and several people who were scheduled to put an offer in, and never followed through. Not once has my realtor been able to commence the sale. Every buyer and or buyer's realtor has left feedback; which has all been positive. The house itself is probably one of the nicer and most updated homes in the neighborhood. Things like the kitchen have been totally gutted and redone. All new paint, carpets, landscaping, etc, etc, etc.

Of the three offers we've had....

1. One made an offer, we countered, and then literally he fell off the face of the planet for over 3 weeks. The realtor would not answer calls from my realtor (or so I was told). That guy viewed the property on several occasions and never followed through.

2. Next person made an offer that was totally not even in the ball park because he was an investor. He explained that he was trying to rent it out in the mean time and eventually retire in the house later on. Because he couldn't make his numbers work for rental purposes, the offer obviously reflected that. No sale there.

3. Next person was a first time home buyer. She viewed the property at the open house and spent over an hour with my realtor. She said she wanted to stop back in 2 days to view it with her parents. No calls, never showed. 2 weeks later we get a showing with them again. She comes through and spends another hour there with her realtor and makes three calls to my realtor for various questions. All seems positive right? Especially when they said they were putting an offer in the next morning. Next morning comes and no offer. They fall off the face of the planet for over two weeks. Finally my realtor is able to reach out to them and their realtor said the father had issues with water in the basement?? No water has ever been present in the basement mind you. Then the realtor said he wanted a tree taken down in the front yard. Why? Because he had concerns that foundation damage would occur from the roots. Now the three has been there for over 50 years with no damage PERIOD! Either way, they put an offer in the following day 10% under asking. Ultimately I wanted to settle at 5% under asking. We counter and they come up 0.05%. Yes, 1/2 a percent. They didn't even want to negotiate.

Again, I have never seen anything like this before. Just in the past week we had 2 showings. We have interest out the wazoo, feedback is positive, but still no sale.

I am at a loss what to do. The wifey works the late shift at the hospital (don't ask why she likes the night shift) and for her to be inconvenienced by people viewing the home during the day, with ZERO notice, is just driving her up a wall. I can see her point because that's like us normal people having some potential home buyers come through at 3AM. I'm sure I wouldn't be too happy. The media doesn't seem to be helping either saying that it's a 'buyer's market' these days. Buyers think they can just walk all over the sellers and make unreasonable demands. I don't know what the deal is, but it's become very frustrating.

Any thoughts? What have others experienced in this market?

Doug

My across the street neighbor put his house up at the end of July and it was sold before the 2nd week of August at full asking price. He had to hurry up to find his new house. He knew where he wanted to go, but figured that his would be on the market for long enough for him to go shopping at his leisure.

Have you considered moving the house out of NJ?

I'm a Realtor in Maryland and in my county the housing inventory is eighteen months. This means if you place your house on the market today,on average it will take one and a half years to sell. (Four years ago inventory was five weeks.) Ask your Realtor what your areas inventory is. It does sound like you and your realtor are doing everything right. With my properties after 6 months I ask my sellers to lower the price. In this market,price sells. Know what your bottom price is and if time in your house is costing you money, then you can adjust your asking price for a quicker sale. Please talk to you realtor,we work for you and only get paid when the house sells.

Friend of mine owns a real estate agency, says high-end stuff is dead.
What's selling is the $50-$60K homes because they can be easily rented and provide a positive cash flow from the outset. The investor/owners are planning on holding looonnngg term.
Floored me- I said you can really buy a home for that price????
"Yup"...

Have you...can you lower your price?

Doug,

Being a Realtor in the North GA Mountains I can't really give specific details about your current home, but it sounds like your realtor is doing the right things. GIFF1 has given you some great advice. I assume your realtor has given you a current local true CMA (Not what is on the market, but what has sold in the last 3 months) and you've priced your home correctly. Not sure what price range you are in, but like TOBNPR said if the buyer is having to get a jumbo type loan you might as well take it off the market unless your willing to sell it for say 50 cent on the dollar. Jumbo loans are just not avl at this time. Heck I've had clients with 780+ credit scores turned down for conventional type loans. The underwriting rules are changing on a daily bases.

Hope it helps.

I am a 10yr+ Home Inspector with RE Agents in the family. The last 3 months have been great mostly due to the 8,000 Tax Credit for 1st time home owners ( less expensive homes) The time to start a new deal to get the credit has past. The forclosures are still draging down the Home prices. Why buy now when the price of the home will be 20% LESS next year.
The Best way to find a good RE. Agent is to find the one who has the most Listing / Sales. Check around your town and you will be able to tell the person with the most success.
good Luck

JohnEGraham said:

The Best way to find a good RE. Agent is to find the one who has the most Listing / Sales. Check around your town and you will be able to tell the person with the most success.
good Luck

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IMHO - I have to disagree about having the most listings. You need to find an agent that has a high listing to sale percentage. I've seen too many agents lately just "buying" listings. They don't do a true CMA and just take the listing hoping they can get the seller to lower their price after they get the listing. IMHO in this market with so many foreclosure and short sales, unless you are willing to market your home at a correct price to start with there is no since even listing it. The problem you are going to have is even if the buyer is willing to pay your list price unless they are buying with cash they can't get the financing to complete the deal.

FWIW this is how I sold my place in FL. In the previous 6 months sales were few in the whole county. After talking to a few realtors I felt listing was pointless. They were picking up more listings and the group of potential buyers was shrinking at the same time. I eliminated the fat…realtors, lawyers. I did everything I could to save a buck and adjusted the price accordingly. In the end its about what you net. I asked everyone in the area to spread the word the place was for sale. I was on the phone each time I heard “so-sos brothers nieces daughters in-laws might be looking for a place”. I sold the place in 4 months to a guy from N. Georgia. My lower price attracted some buyers(good for them) and I came out the same(good for me). My buyer didn’t need a bank so I did get a little lucky there.

Woody said:

FWIW this is how I sold my place in FL. In the previous 6 months sales were few in the whole county. After talking to a few realtors I felt listing was pointless. They were picking up more listings and the group of potential buyers was shrinking at the same time. I eliminated the fat…realtors, lawyers. I did everything I could to save a buck and adjusted the price accordingly. In the end its about what you net. I asked everyone in the area to spread the word the place was for sale. I was on the phone each time I heard “so-sos brothers nieces daughters in-laws might be looking for a place”. I sold the place in 4 months to a guy from N. Georgia. My lower price attracted some buyers(good for them) and I came out the same(good for me). My buyer didn’t need a bank so I did get a little lucky there.

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Smart move. The Jumbo deal is a killer. People that bought pre boom ('02~03) are in ok shape if they stay employed. I moved into my place in '03 and bought well. Problem is that I did the HELOC dealio in '06 to expand my business. I was conservative for the times only going 70% LTV...but now I'm upsidedown about $150K.:wow: The house will sell only to a buyer from overseas with cash...that is the only action we are seeing in this market for $500K & up. I have been through these cycles before but never anything like this.

Of note...we have had 4: "Empty Nesters" do short sales in the last 4 months and go to Australia...no kidding...and got big $$$ jobs when they got there.

So we'll just hold on and pay. I am considering going to my mortgage holder and trying to get a principal reduction to ease the pain. I'm confident values will come back as the economy comes around...if it comes around.

giff1 said:

I'm a Realtor in Maryland and in my county the housing inventory is eighteen months. This means if you place your house on the market today,on average it will take one and a half years to sell. (Four years ago inventory was five weeks.) Ask your Realtor what your areas inventory is.

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I don't think it's really that simple. Houses don't move on a First-In/First-Out (FIFO) bases in the market. If your neighbor has an ugly busted up house with powerlines going overhead and is on the end of the airport runway, his house doesn't have to sell first before yours does. During this housing boom, there were a lot of cheap butt ugly houses built in crappy locations.

This is also a very local issue. I have a house in Florida and that thing would never sell unless I put it on the market for $60K. In Williamsburg, there is no such thing as a $60K house and houses that are priced below $750K are moving.. but the ugly houses are not moving in Williamsburg... only the desirable places are moving.

I think a few years ago you could build a house on the railroad tracks and it would sell in a 5 days because of speculation and easy credit. That house will not sell now. People are looking for well-maintained, unique, and houses that are hard to get in any market. No more "putty and paint make 'em what they ain't" housing flippers.

I watched a Sotheby's training presentation the other day and houses in the $750K-$4M bracket are hard to sell now. Under $750K and over $4M seem to be doing fine but it depends on location.

You can always go to zillow.com and check out the sold houses in your region... but that doesn't account for the "ugly house" factor. I think there is a 3-year inventory here in Williamsburg of houses in the $750K-$4M bracket... but I know people that have sold their house in that bracket in less than 2 months.. but that 1980's house with mauve carpet in the living room, sea-foam green carpet in the bathroom (with custom vinyl cushion toilet seats), paisley bathroom wallpaper and border and under-counter black&decker appliances is not going to move anytime soon.

Also, I know there are a lot of people moving into our area from the northeast for some reason... Is something wrong with New Jersey?

The question would be better asked "Is there anything right with New Jersey".
PS. I escaped from NJ in '08 !!!

Why is no one being captain obvious?

To be blunt…..take offer #3 or continue to wait and hope. #1 would have worked as well.

It’s really that simple.

Let me explain.

I use Craig’s List to sell items and buy items.

I sold several items I just wanted to get rid of. So far every item sold in 1 day. That’s one day!

Now I could have asked more money and held out for top dollar. Screw that!
When the engine blew in my 14 year old Murray 42” riding lawnmower I asked $150 for the thing for parts. Sure I could have asked for $250 or more and messed around. Nope, ask a fair price, got it done, and move on.

When my wife got the new fangled “Sole” brand treadmill with its Cushion Flex Shock Absorption Whisper Deck (don’t get me started on that!) I wanted her old “Health Trainer” treadmill gone, now! $200. It was gone in under 2 hours.

I could list more examples as well.

In all cases the first person took it.

Look, if you made your asking price $1 would it sell today? Of course! How about $2? How about $3? Keep going until the dollar value and time you are willing to wait collide then accept that price.

If you want, need, have to have that last 5% of the selling price then be prepared for the risk that we may soon be entering “The Great recession II” or we could be entering a time of hyperinflation that would make the late 70’s look tame.

Consider doing a FSBO and dropping your asking price by the % the realtor is charging.

Keep doing what you are doing and hope.

Pick your poison.

Four Suns said:

I......that 1980's house with mauve carpet in the living room, sea-foam green carpet in the bathroom (with custom vinyl cushion toilet seats), paisley bathroom wallpaper and border and under-counter black&decker appliance....

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Gary, what are you saying? We are remodeling and that’s exactly what we are putting in.



:smt043

Four Suns said:

This is also a very local issue. I have a house in Florida and that thing would never sell unless I put it on the market for $60K. In Williamsburg, there is no such thing as a $60K house and houses that are priced below $750K are moving.. but the ugly houses are not moving in Williamsburg... only the desirable places are moving.

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I think Gary's whole post mirrors the Twin Cities. Houses are moving pretty well up here in general. My wife is a loan officer and she has 14 purchases for October in addition to some re-fi's. The prices vary but most are in the $500-$800k range. This has pretty much been the case all year for her.
.

Presentation said:

...Consider doing a FSBO and dropping your asking price by the % the realtor is charging.

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IMHO - I don't know what % the Realtors are charging in your area, but if the 5% to 8% is going to make that much of a difference your place is over priced to start with. Your Realtor should be bringing more to the table than it is costing you.

Do you have the option to leave work at any time to show your place?
Do you want just anybody coming into your home and scooping it out?
Are you talking with buyers all day long?
Are you networking with other other people that are dealing with buyers all day long.
One of the reasons why buyers go to FSBO is that they want to save the realtor fees. Only one person can save the fees, not both. So the buyers are going to try and reduce your price X% since you don't have to pay a realtor.

I'm not saying FSBO don't work, but over 85% of the homes sold have a realtor involved.

IMHO you need to decide whether you want to sell the home or not. Look at it this way, what ever your loses on your current sale you should be able to make it or more up on your purchase. I ASSUME you are looking at a bigger home. The price has dropped more on bigger homes than smaller homes in most areas.

chuck1 said:

......I'm not saying FSBO don't work, but over 85% of the homes sold have a realtor involved.......

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Thank you for posting your reply. My goal was not to say realtors are not worth it. I was listing options.

Since you listed some of the reasons to hire a realtor, please allow me to balance it out a bit.

In my opinion, as a profession, realtors are no longer professional. It’s no longer a valid occupation. Yes you can cite examples of realtors that are in the business today and are professional but they are the exception not the rule. Today most realtors are female bimbo dingbats that sell a dozen or less homes a year as a part time job. They lack fundamental housing knowledge, market knowledge and sales skills. Sure, they passed a test to sell a house ‘legally’ but I think that test is about as bad of a joke as the boaters safety test that exists in our boating hobby.

To get professional realtors today you need to look toward commercial real-estate and that profession is being decimated right now.

Just to site an example, I was at a open house. I overhead a person asks the realtor where the service entrance was located. The realtor replied “They can just come in the back door.” I didn’t know if I should laugh or cry. Gone are the days where the realtor knew the homes features, the buyers desires and the realator sold the sizzle not the steak. Today a walk thru typically goes “Well this is the dining room. Next we have the kitchen. Over there, why that is the bathroom.”

The industries dominate association; the National Association of Realtors has not helped the matter nor their cause by making and supporting wild, crazy, non-sustainable claims. Remember the NAR’s ads of 10% annual returns just a couple of years ago?

Up to about the late 70’s I would have always said to sell thru a realtor.

Now about your numbers claims:

According to a press release by the National Association of Realtors (NAR) regarding their 2005 annual survey of real estate consumers, 2005 Profile of Home Buyers and Sellers:

• 12% of 2006 US real estate transactions were FSBO.
• 13% of 2005 US real estate transactions took place via FSBO (down from 14% in 2004).
• The record percentage of 20% of US real estate transactions (since tracking started in 1981) took place in 1987.

Critics have pointed out that the National Association of Realtors report's suggestion that FSBO transactions are declining, may be misleading because NAR has also reported that flat-fee MLS now makes up 10% of transactions, and flat-fee MLS sellers are in substance FSBO sellers.

Unlike traditional real estate agent clients, flat-fee sellers are not committed to paying a commission and still advertise their homes as being for sale by owner.

Some critics of the report suggest that the true size of the FSBO market is closer to 22%.* Sourse Arian Smedley, "Selling your own home in a tough market", June 21 2008 on LoHud.com and reported by the Associated Press

skibum said:

Have you considered moving the house out of NJ?

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Like physically have a company move the house off the lot to another location? This house is on the cusp of being too small for our needs. It was built back in the 60's and lacks storage and bathroom space.

giff1 said:

Ask your Realtor what your areas inventory is. It does sound like you and your realtor are doing everything right. With my properties after 6 months I ask my sellers to lower the price. In this market,price sells. Know what your bottom price is and if time in your house is costing you money, then you can adjust your asking price for a quicker sale. Please talk to you realtor,we work for you and only get paid when the house sells.

Click to expand...

I would question whether or not my realtor is doing everything right. I have called him on it point blank before. Let's just say he's not as responsive and he doesn't follow through with what he tells me he will. I will not say anything further about him on a public forum though. I do agree that price sells, and that may be exactly why it hasn't sold. What surprises me is that homes similar to mine in the area that aren't updated at all (read 60's to 70's decor) are priced about 10%-15% less and they haven't sold either, yet when you hear from other realtors, they use those homes are comps when advising their clients on pricing strategy for offers. From my point of view, the homes aren't even in the same bracket to compare. Maybe I'm full of it?

katricol said:

Have you...can you lower your price?

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I have lowered my price once in 6 months (about 3 months ago). I think the price right now should be within 5%-8% of actual selling price. I would think this provides some negotiating room for both parties to come out feeling like they got a 'good deal' but again, maybe the asking price is too high.

Four Suns said:

I don't think it's really that simple. Houses don't move on a First-In/First-Out (FIFO) bases in the market. If your neighbor has an ugly busted up house with powerlines going overhead and is on the end of the airport runway, his house doesn't have to sell first before yours does. During this housing boom, there were a lot of cheap butt ugly houses built in crappy locations.

This is also a very local issue. I have a house in Florida and that thing would never sell unless I put it on the market for $60K. In Williamsburg, there is no such thing as a $60K house and houses that are priced below $750K are moving.. but the ugly houses are not moving in Williamsburg... only the desirable places are moving.

I think a few years ago you could build a house on the railroad tracks and it would sell in a 5 days because of speculation and easy credit. That house will not sell now. People are looking for well-maintained, unique, and houses that are hard to get in any market. No more "putty and paint make 'em what they ain't" housing flippers.

I watched a Sotheby's training presentation the other day and houses in the $750K-$4M bracket are hard to sell now. Under $750K and over $4M seem to be doing fine but it depends on location.

You can always go to zillow.com and check out the sold houses in your region... but that doesn't account for the "ugly house" factor. I think there is a 3-year inventory here in Williamsburg of houses in the $750K-$4M bracket... but I know people that have sold their house in that bracket in less than 2 months.. but that 1980's house with mauve carpet in the living room, sea-foam green carpet in the bathroom (with custom vinyl cushion toilet seats), paisley bathroom wallpaper and border and under-counter black&decker appliances is not going to move anytime soon.

Also, I know there are a lot of people moving into our area from the northeast for some reason... Is something wrong with New Jersey?

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Gary you bring up good points. I don't have the best house on the block, but it sure as hell isn't the worst either. Thankfully all my neighbors have presentable houses. As far as something being wrong with NJ? Hell yeah! To put it bluntly, it sucks. I moved here for a job about 4 years ago. In that time I have found this state to be totally ass backwards on a ton of items. I am looking to ultimately get back to PA, but I'm unsure if that will happen on this move, or on a subsequent one.

Presentation said:

Why is no one being captain obvious?

To be blunt…..take offer #3 or continue to wait and hope. #1 would have worked as well.

It’s really that simple.

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Could I have gone with that offer? Sure could have. The problem is the father's demands were completely off base and without reason. His demands were part of his strategy to 'help' his daughter get a good deal. Make unreasonable demands, hope the seller has to unload the house, and we get a great deal in the process. I personally work on logic. If I can't see the logic in something, I won't deal with you. He says he's concerned about water intrusion. Do you see water stains? Do you see any moisture? How about mold? Dehumidifier is present. Vents are present. He wants a price reduction because of this 'water'. I don't see the logic. He says he's concerned about the tree in the front yard and the 'potential' that foundation damage could occur. Do you see roots protruding into the foundation now? Nope. Do you see any disease on the tree? Nope. How is the foliage? Healthy last time I checked. Do you see any cracked sidewalks or raised grouding near the tree? Nope. The tree has been there for 50 years... if foundation damage was going to occur, it would have occured by now. Again, not seeing the logic. The REAL issue at hand is, they don't have the money for the house. The house is above their budget, they made an offer, and hence why they can't come up. Sounds like it was time for me to move on and quit wasting my time. That's exactly what I did.

chuck1 said:

IMHO - I don't know what % the Realtors are charging in your area, but if the 5% to 8% is going to make that much of a difference your place is over priced to start with. Your Realtor should be bringing more to the table than it is costing you.

Do you have the option to leave work at any time to show your place?
Do you want just anybody coming into your home and scooping it out?
Are you talking with buyers all day long?
Are you networking with other other people that are dealing with buyers all day long.
One of the reasons why buyers go to FSBO is that they want to save the realtor fees. Only one person can save the fees, not both. So the buyers are going to try and reduce your price X% since you don't have to pay a realtor.

I'm not saying FSBO don't work, but over 85% of the homes sold have a realtor involved.

IMHO you need to decide whether you want to sell the home or not. Look at it this way, what ever your loses on your current sale you should be able to make it or more up on your purchase. I ASSUME you are looking at a bigger home. The price has dropped more on bigger homes than smaller homes in most areas.

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The realtor is getting 6% commission on this sale. I agree that you can sell low, then buy low on the next. The problem is the house that we want is hard to obtain in PA at our price point. It's on the cusp. In NJ, they are very easy to find. The problem with NJ is that the taxes are about 50% more than PA for the same home. It's a tough window that we are fighting. The only good thing is, I don't HAVE to move. It's more of a convenience thing at this point. It's just been a frustrating 6 months.


Thanks for everyone's input. Keep it coming if anyone has things to add.

Doug

douglee25 said:

.....The only good thing is, I don't HAVE to move. It's more of a convenience thing at this point. It's just been a frustrating 6 months

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Consider taking a break.

If the house does not sell by the end of the realtor contract simply take a break from this.

Take some time. Think about other stuff.

Then when its correct for your family come at this again, on your terms.

Presentation said:

Consider taking a break.

If the house does not sell by the end of the realtor contract simply take a break from this.

Take some time. Think about other stuff.

Then when its correct for your family come at this again, on your terms.

Click to expand...

Good point. That may be what it comes to.

Doug