Yikes.......$104 a Barrel !!!!!

Discussion in 'The Tiki Bar' started by Dave S, Mar 5, 2008.

  1. Bottom Line

    Bottom Line Active Member

    Oct 6, 2006
    Table Rock Lake(Branson MO)
    2003 360 Sundancer
    2002 Sea Doo GTI
    Twin Mercruiser 8.1L
    Westerbeke Generator

    Tim...let it all out...tell us how you really feel....:lol::lol:
     
  2. highslice

    highslice Active Member SILVER Sponsor

    Mar 28, 2008
    Table Rock Lake, Hollister Missouri
    270 SLX
    496 Mag
    Bravo III
    Corsa
    Yeah, I know, disproportional response. But man, the stupidity pisses me off...
     
  3. fc3

    fc3 Well-Known Member TECHNICAL Contributor

    Nov 12, 2006
    Northern NJ
    1999 Sea Ray 330DA
    Twin 7.4 MPI (310 propshaft HP) V-drives
    Twin Mercury Marine marinized 7.4L L-29 V8s
    Cast iron block w 4-bolt mains
    4.25x4.00 bore & stroke
    Cool down dude. You survived:
    • 4 years of Bush stupidity
    • 8 years of Clinton stupidity
    • 8 years of Bush stupidity
    So what's a few more years? We can only hope that in two more years that they'll be another renaissance and we'll get a Contract with America Part II. The downside of that would be that it would make Osama seem a savior. The CwA made Clinton look better than he deserved.

    There is no objectivity in the news. It's all opinion pieces. Read Bernard Goldberg's Bias. Goldberg, a former liberal, has a few other books that might be worth reading, but I've not reviewed them yet. His latest is A Slobbering Love Affair: The True (And Pathetic) Story of the Torrid Romance Between Barack Obama and the Mainstream Media a title which I would a hard time arguing. I might get it. Hell, just the word "Slobbering" is probably worth the $16.52.

    Actually, prices have dropped. The CPI is down. Check Bloomberg, a pretty good news source. While I don't think much of Mike as mayor, he's a good businessman and he treats his employees pretty well. Nice offices, too.

    Best regards,
    Frank C
     
    Last edited: Jan 16, 2009
  4. jitts3

    jitts3 New Member

    Dec 16, 2008
    Monroe Twp. NJ & Fon Du Lac, WI
    1973 SRV 240 and 1978 SRV 200
    73" 307 CID Chevy OMC Stringer, electric shift. 78" 350 Mercruiser
    Sad thing is now that Fuel is down, My fuel surcharge went down as well. (As a trucker) Now stores have been getting a higher price and now the stores figure we are used to paying the higher price, so we will continue it. I think this will end eventually when the retailers go to the mattresses in sales and price wars. I'll be waiting.
     
  5. comsnark

    comsnark New Member

    Apr 10, 2007
    NJ Shore
    SeaRay SunSport
    5.7LX
    Dude! This is the scenario I am banking on!

    Let the Republicans rediscover fiscal responsibility! Let them practice it! Let them make a few budgets with a President that actually is willing to veto some of their more boneheaded pork.

    If it makes some random president look good in the process. . .who cares?
     
  6. fc3

    fc3 Well-Known Member TECHNICAL Contributor

    Nov 12, 2006
    Northern NJ
    1999 Sea Ray 330DA
    Twin 7.4 MPI (310 propshaft HP) V-drives
    Twin Mercury Marine marinized 7.4L L-29 V8s
    Cast iron block w 4-bolt mains
    4.25x4.00 bore & stroke
    Well, I care. I care because the idiot republicans will forget what saved their asses (fiscal responsibility) and the electorate will forget why they voted for guys who pledged responsibility. Guess what comes next?

    Best regards,
    Frank
     
  7. comsnark

    comsnark New Member

    Apr 10, 2007
    NJ Shore
    SeaRay SunSport
    5.7LX
    Jeb Bush for a few years?


    but seriously. . . . at least we would get either 2 or 6 years of fiscal responsibility in the meantime :)
     
  8. rondds

    rondds Well-Known Member SILVER Sponsor

    Oct 3, 2006
    Jersey Shore
    2001 380DA
    Merc 8.1s (2008)...Hurth ZF 63 V-drives...WB 7.0 BCGD (2013), Garmin 8208 & 740 MFDs, GMR 24xHD dome
    People in this country have short memories. This debacle SHOULD teach us a very valuable lesson, like the Great Depression taught our parents and grandparents. Problem is it will not stick. As soon as things return to some semblence of normalcy, Americans will return to their old ways of over extension and waste. Someone alluded to the famous quote in an earlier post - Those who ignore history are doomed to repeat it." I fear we are headed the way of the Romans.

    On a lighter note, our fearless leader-elect will save us all with the most costly inaugural shin-dig ever (in a time when Congress bitches out auto execs for not flying commercial), bigger government and lots of freebies!! And he is in a no-lose situation. If we happen to get out of the deep wide hole during his reign, he's the Savior. If we don't, it's his immediate predecessor's fault.

    Because of these two factors, I think the Thing's Will Get So Bad Under Liberal/Socialist Rule That We'll Return To Reagan-omics Theory will (sadly) be disproven.

    Yeah, I'm a "glass half empty" kinda guy!

    Geeze Gary, did you really have to go and dredge up this depressing old relic of a thread?
     
    Last edited: Jan 16, 2009
  9. fc3

    fc3 Well-Known Member TECHNICAL Contributor

    Nov 12, 2006
    Northern NJ
    1999 Sea Ray 330DA
    Twin 7.4 MPI (310 propshaft HP) V-drives
    Twin Mercury Marine marinized 7.4L L-29 V8s
    Cast iron block w 4-bolt mains
    4.25x4.00 bore & stroke
    The actual quote by George Santayana is "Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it." The wording changes the meaning a bit, but close enough. Some people learned the wrong lessons from the Great Depression. My grandparents learned hard work and self-reliance. They learned that you have to take responsibility for yourself and your family. That's what they taught me. My wife's grandmother, on the other hand, learned to always vote for democrats, no matter what because "They took care of us." When Cheryl was 18 her grandparents took her to vote and made her vote the party line. Oh well.

    Best regards,
    Frank
     
    Last edited: Jan 17, 2009
  10. rondds

    rondds Well-Known Member SILVER Sponsor

    Oct 3, 2006
    Jersey Shore
    2001 380DA
    Merc 8.1s (2008)...Hurth ZF 63 V-drives...WB 7.0 BCGD (2013), Garmin 8208 & 740 MFDs, GMR 24xHD dome
    My grandparents learned BOTH lessons you mention from the Depression and Roosevelt's New Deal. The take-home message is "take responsibility for yourself!"
     
  11. billandamy

    billandamy New Member

    Oct 22, 2007
    Southwest CT
    2008 205 sport. MonsterTower wakeboard tower.
    5.0 mpi (260 hp) alpha one drive with 19p ss prop.
    Ahhh....thus why I dont vote anymore. :smt001

    In reality, it doesnt matter a frog's fat arse who is in office. In the end, we all assume responsibility for ourselves and our lively hoods.

    They will always change the rules of the game (whether you DO vote or not, whether you vote dem or pub, by the way)...keeping your piece in play regardless of the rules is what separates the winners from the losers. :thumbsup:
     
  12. fc3

    fc3 Well-Known Member TECHNICAL Contributor

    Nov 12, 2006
    Northern NJ
    1999 Sea Ray 330DA
    Twin 7.4 MPI (310 propshaft HP) V-drives
    Twin Mercury Marine marinized 7.4L L-29 V8s
    Cast iron block w 4-bolt mains
    4.25x4.00 bore & stroke
    From AP:
    Oil prices fell to below $36 a barrel Monday as investors eyed a slew of U.S. corporate earnings this week for signs of weakening consumer demand amid the worst recession in decades.

    Light, sweet crude for February delivery was down $1.32 to $35.19 a barrel by midday in Europe in electronic trading on the New York Mercantile Exchange.
     
  13. rondds

    rondds Well-Known Member SILVER Sponsor

    Oct 3, 2006
    Jersey Shore
    2001 380DA
    Merc 8.1s (2008)...Hurth ZF 63 V-drives...WB 7.0 BCGD (2013), Garmin 8208 & 740 MFDs, GMR 24xHD dome
    And yet gasoline jumped about 6 cents from Friday to Monday. Please explain that to me - yeah I know, it's cold out. IT'S FRIGGIN JANUARY - OF COURSE IT'S COLD!!!!!!!!!!!! What the hell does that have to do with the price of GASOLINE which is piling up??!!

    This just in:

    A Nigerian Prince sprained his ankle during a tiger hunt and oil prices spiked to $38/barrell on speculation that he won't be able to make clear decisions due to the pain in his ankle and the narcotics he is currently taking.
     
  14. timinfla2

    timinfla2 New Member

    578
    Sep 22, 2008
    Can one of you Jersey boys knock off that Paulson clown and put in Frank here in charge of the monetary health of the US?

    I'd also recommend getting rid of all GSE's, i.e. Fanny/Freddie, and Privatize Social Security & Medicare.
     
  15. timinfla2

    timinfla2 New Member

    578
    Sep 22, 2008
    I agree to the extent that both parties have thier hacks and for the most part are corrupt as the other. I'm even more disgusted at the GOP for turning their backs on conservatives to the point that we elected a guy who, in his words, is not 'up to speed on economics' in a recession. Screw them all, I say.
     
  16. fc3

    fc3 Well-Known Member TECHNICAL Contributor

    Nov 12, 2006
    Northern NJ
    1999 Sea Ray 330DA
    Twin 7.4 MPI (310 propshaft HP) V-drives
    Twin Mercury Marine marinized 7.4L L-29 V8s
    Cast iron block w 4-bolt mains
    4.25x4.00 bore & stroke
    Call Dom. He's the man with all the connections. But Paulson is history tomorrow. Even Dom can't work that fast. Starting tomorrow we get a new guy who is experienced with tax evasion. Hope they legalize it! Sounds like the government is in a forgiving mood about not paying taxes, which sounds great to me!

    Yeah, I'd go for some program killing too.

    Best regards,
    Frank
     
  17. comsnark

    comsnark New Member

    Apr 10, 2007
    NJ Shore
    SeaRay SunSport
    5.7LX
    Ok. . .let's see. . .if demand is down 3% from this time last year with gas at $1.89 (I posted a link in a thread a week ago). . . and before the recession hit demand was down 3% with gas at $4.25. . .

    It seems logical that if gas goes up to $3.00. . .demand will drop no more than an additional 3%. . but if the price is up 50%. . . . . .

    Of course I just made this up. I know nothing about economics or the "laws" of supply and demand. I am not claiming to know anything.
     
  18. fc3

    fc3 Well-Known Member TECHNICAL Contributor

    Nov 12, 2006
    Northern NJ
    1999 Sea Ray 330DA
    Twin 7.4 MPI (310 propshaft HP) V-drives
    Twin Mercury Marine marinized 7.4L L-29 V8s
    Cast iron block w 4-bolt mains
    4.25x4.00 bore & stroke
    Check the refineries. Either they are doing maintenance or switching production to make different products. Not my field, but I'll bet the reason is there.

    Best regards,
    Frank
     
  19. comsnark

    comsnark New Member

    Apr 10, 2007
    NJ Shore
    SeaRay SunSport
    5.7LX
    "Check the refineries".

    Which one? Which region? There are a bunch. Refineries in Louisiana don't supply California. Washington state refineries don't supply the East Coast. If prices are rising coast to coast, while crude oil prices are stable/dropping, that implies that there issues across the country. And it is not like an entire refinery comes always comes offline at once (although it is not uncommon for this to happen).

    But this is a fair argument to make. . . I have made the same argument elsewhere. It's just that I am getting cynical regarding the "supply/demand" curve as it applies to many commoditites.
     
  20. rktktpaul

    rktktpaul New Member

    189
    Oct 4, 2006
    Chicago, Illinois
    185 Sport
    Mercruiser 4.3l TKS w/ Alpha I Gen II
    Here is an article I came across.

    "Meltdown 101: Oil futures have been plummeting _ so why are prices at the pump going up?

    By JOHN PORRETTO | AP Energy Writer 4:50 PM CST, January 15, 2009

    HOUSTON (AP) — You may do a double-take as you pass your local gas station. Chances are, the price you pay at the pump has jumped markedly in the past couple of weeks, even as crude prices have fallen.

    The average national price for a gallon of unleaded gasoline rose seven-tenths of a cent overnight to $1.799 — well below the $3.05 average of a year ago but up nearly 14 cents in the past month, according to the auto club AAA, the Oil Price Information Service and Wright Express, a company that tracks transportation data.

    At the same time, the price of crude — which accounts for about 60 percent of gasoline's cost — has been on a steep decline. Oil futures tumbled below $34 a barrel Thursday after trading as high as $50 a barrel just 10 days ago.

    So what gives? When oil made its extraordinary fall in recent months from a record high above $147 a barrel in July, gasoline followed suit. Why not now?



    Here are some questions and answers about the connections between oil and gasoline prices.

    Q: Why aren't gas prices falling at my local service station right now?

    A: While oil and gasoline prices very often move in the same direction, there's usually a lag between crude's decline (or rise) and that of gasoline. Analysts say the ongoing uptick is gasoline prices is likely tied to oil's sharp rise at the end of last year, when fighting between Israel and Palestinian militants raised concerns about supply disruptions in the oil-rich Middle East.

    Q: If that's the case, now that oil has retreated to below $40, shouldn't gasoline get cheaper?

    A: It should — and it might — but other factors are at play.

    For one, the companies that process crude into products such as gasoline are sharply cutting production, in part because demand has fallen off so much. Less production means less supply, which tends to push prices up.

    The gasoline producers are trying to make some money in the wake of a dismal 2008. When crude prices were so high in the first half of last year, refining margins — the difference between what refiners pay for crude and what they get for products they make from oil — were dismal. In the latter half of the year, margins improved as oil prices receded, but refiners continued to struggle because people were simply driving less and buying less gasoline.

    Companies that refine oil are publicly traded. If they don't turn a profit, they won't be around long.

    "Refiners are not going to continue to sell gasoline at a discount to crude oil," said Ben Brockwell, director of data, pricing and information services for the Oil Price Information Service. "It simply hasn't paid to produce gasoline."

    Q: But doesn't that mean they're simply inflating the price of gasoline?

    A: That's the opinion of the nonprofit group Consumer Watchdog, which tracks the industry closely and has consistently called for greater regulation of refineries.

    Consumer Watchdog says production cuts at refineries in California, for example, have far exceeded the state's drop in consumption.

    "The refinery cutbacks are for purely financial reasons," said Judy Dugan, the organization's research director. "Now is the time for government to insert sharper oversight and regulatory controls of the refining industry."

    Q: How does my local station set gas prices? Does it follow orders from corporate headquarters to keep prices as high as possible?

    A: One thing many people don't realize is that major oil companies own fewer than 5 percent of gas stations. Exxon Mobil Corp., for example, said last June it was getting out of the retail gasoline business, following other major oil companies who've been selling the low-margin businesses to gasoline distributors.

    Most stations are owned by small retailers — and many say they took a beating last year when crude prices spiked because they were unable to raise pump prices fast enough to keep pace.

    That's exactly why some stations raised prices quickly after oil futures jumped late last year: Not because the more expensive oil had made its way through the production process, but because they saw an opportunity to make some money after struggling with paltry profits for months. So the usual lag between oil and gas prices may not have occurred this time around at some stations — they wanted to raise prices, and they didn't feel like waiting.

    Gas station owners face a balancing act: They must try to maintain a price that allows them to afford the next shipment of gasoline, but they're also trying not to give the competition an edge.

    Quinn Cassidy, an independent gasoline retailer in Slidell, La., said his profit margin on a gallon of gasoline has improved significantly since the summer, when he and others sometimes made pennies per gallon. Now, because of crude's descent, he says he can make 25 cents to 30 cents a gallon — and he makes no apologies for trying to keep the price as high as possible while remaining competitive.

    "Why isn't it OK for me to make money?" Cassidy said.

    Q: Are gas prices going to go up even more this summer?

    A: Probably, but how much depends on whose forecast you use. Remember that summer is driving season, and gasoline prices always climb when thousands of people begin to take sun-inspired road trips.

    Tom Kloza, chief oil analyst at the Oil Price Information Service, predicts prices will move sideways over the next few weeks before they begin to climb in the spring, reaching $2 to $2.50 a gallon. He said he doubts prices can get much higher than that given how weak the economy is.

    In another forecast, the U.S Energy Department has said gasoline prices will likely average $2.37 a gallon through 2009."
     

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