Why Haven't AIS Receivers Gone Down In Price?

[MonacoMike]

A few years ago I purchased a Standard Horizon GX2150 (now GX2200) with built in AIS receiver. They retail for around $399. I thought that the competition would begin there and that AIS would be a feature on most better VHF Radios or the price of add on receivers would drop in a few years. Wrong! Add on units are all the other manufacturers offer and they start a $350. Any thoughts why this hasn't taken off?

MM

 

[Henry Boyd]

Mike,

I think AIS has come down, if you look at the price of AIS Class B transceivers. These are now in the 500 to 700 dollar street price range now, down from a 1000 plus a couple years ago. I have the 2150 as well ad my only regret is that I didn't bite the billet and buy the transceiver in the first place. That may play a part in a possible ho-hum demand issue. The other thing is unless you have a clean install, hooking up a 2150 and integrating it with an MFD, heading sensor and smartcraft and other NMEA stuff can add a lot of cost in installation time and hardware for a NMEA multiplexer. For what I paid for the 2150, multiplexer and configuration labor I could have spent on a a class b transceiver and additional VHF antenna.

Henry

 

[MonacoMike]

Mike,

I think AIS has come down, if you look at the price of AIS Class B transceivers. These are now in the 500 to 700 dollar street price range now, down from a 1000 plus a couple years ago. I have the 2150 as well ad my only regret is that I didn't bite the billet and buy the transceiver in the first place. That may play a part in a possible ho-hum demand issue. The other thing is unless you have a clean install, hooking up a 2150 and integrating it with an MFD, heading sensor and smartcraft and other NMEA stuff can add a lot of cost in installation time and hardware for a NMEA multiplexer. For what I paid for the 2150, multiplexer and configuration labor I could have spent on a a class b transceiver and additional VHF antenna.

Henry

The hookup was very simple to my Garmin 440s and exactly the same to my updated 740s. (I know nothing of the electronics on bigger vessels.) So the big multifunction systems are not capable of doing something similar without ancillary electronics?

MM

 

[Gofirstclass]

New electronics often stay up in price until they become a commodity where a fairly high percentage of the users have them. Then they start to drop so they can "capture" those of us who sit back and say "I'll never pay that much for one."

Look at microwave ovens for example. When they first came out in the late 60's they were high as hell. They stayed high for several years, then the price started to drop like a rock once sales numbers slowed just a bit. Happened with desktop computers, laptops, tablet computers, etc. It's a simple supply/demand function.

 

[Henry Boyd]

The hookup was very simple to my Garmin 440s and exactly the same to my updated 740s. (I know nothing of the electronics on bigger vessels.) So the big multifunction systems are not capable of doing something similar without ancillary electronics?

MM

I have a Ray c80, radar, gps, heading sensor, 2150 and smartcraft. The c80 only has one input and 1 output NMEA0183 channel. NMEA 0183 is a pretty primitive networking system in that a separate input port is required for each device sending data. As a result there were too many NMEA devices to connect. It required a multiplexer to sit between all of this stuff and absorb all of the data traffic, bundle it together and inject it all into the one c80 NMEA input. It basically becomes one device. On data coming out of the C80 for smartcraft, and DSC location data for the VHF the mux had to split it into two ports. That added about $ 600 to the install cost in labor and something like $ 350.00 for the multiplexer. There also was a baud rate issue as NMEA 0183 is at 4800 baud and AIS is at 38400.

 

[MonacoMike]

Wow Henry, Sounds like I hed it super easy.

Thanks, MM

 

[trit21]

I think that the main reason it really hasn't taken off is why do you need it? AIS transmitted are used primarily by large ocean vessel for the collision avoidance and tracking of large ships via satellite comms. Why would a recreational boater need to know that information? Radar can pick up large container ships and even determine speed and direction. If you can't avoid a large container ship then maybe you shouldn't own a boat. I have seen AIS on some private yachts and I can see that but on a boat that can stop on a nickel (compared to a container ship) turn and avoid the larger ships I just don't see the need. IMO. Please let me know why you bought the AIS and what your expectations were and are and if it works for you. I would be interested in knowing.

 

[Boat Guy]

True, it really hasn't caught on mainstream. But I think that primarily because of price. If it was $150 dollars, I bet a lot of boaters would purchase it. The advantage is being able to see targets w/o running radar and getting specific information about the vessel. Further, if you are transmitting, you are safer. Ships will know where you are and they will be able to see your last position if you disappear.

I have it... Is it necessary? ...no... But, I boat alone a fair amount of time. So, it's another tool for safety.

 

[Henry Boyd]

I think that the main reason it really hasn't taken off is why do you need it? AIS transmitted are used primarily by large ocean vessel for the collision avoidance and tracking of large ships via satellite comms. Why would a recreational boater need to know that information? Radar can pick up large container ships and even determine speed and direction. If you can't avoid a large container ship then maybe you shouldn't own a boat. I have seen AIS on some private yachts and I can see that but on a boat that can stop on a nickel (compared to a container ship) turn and avoid the larger ships I just don't see the need. IMO. Please let me know why you bought the AIS and what your expectations were and are and if it works for you. I would be interested in knowing.

Only partially right. AIS transponders must also be used by any commercial vessel carrying passengers, and larger commercial fishing vessels as well as tugs towing, or not.

Radar will give you a blip on the screen. But that blip provides no other data, and depending on the target's construction may be misleading. For example many tin fishing boats bounce back a larger reflection than a large sailboat. AIS provides vessel name/size/course/speed/ IMO Call sign/MMSI #. So if you are in fog, AIS allows you to get on the VHF, and call a vessel by name and find out its intentions, rather than getting on the VHF and trying to hail "the purple splotch in front of me". Also keep in mind in a fog situation the helm of a commercial vessel is worried about a lot of things. If you have AIS, that is one more display of his you are going to pop up on, and one more alarm you will trigger. And while he may not be able to get out of the way he can get on the radio as well and tell you to get out of his.

Radar is line of sight dependent. AIS while being based on VHF is also to a lesser degree. Sitting on our mooring I can see AIS targets 2 NM away down river in Ipswich Bay. If I turn my radar up to sufficient range to "see" that far I get nothing but solid return from the river bank, trees and hills between us and the ocean. A more practical example; you are headed down the Hudson River in NY harbor about to pass the tip of Manhattan. With radar you can not see any downstream traffic in the East River because of the high rises between you and there. However with AIS you can tell if there is a tug towing a barge full of trash containers coming down the East River on a converging course with you.

Henry

 

[MonacoMike]

I think that the main reason it really hasn't taken off is why do you need it? AIS transmitted are used primarily by large ocean vessel for the collision avoidance and tracking of large ships via satellite comms. Why would a recreational boater need to know that information? Please let me know why you bought the AIS and what your expectations were and are and if it works for you. I would be interested in knowing.

In my case I am sometimes in the area of commercial ships and barges, my boat is not equipped with radar so having the AIS linked to my plotter puts the AIS transceiver traffic right on my screen with a big red flag. Also, now that I primarily boat on the southeast end of Lake Michigan where large commercial traffic is rare having the plotter signal me to any AIS traffic is helpful. Often it will put the target on my plotter way before I can see it.

Oh, and one more thing, thanks to the idiot sailboater that leaves his transceiver on 24/7 we also have an advance warning when getting in range of my home port...

MM

 

[trit21]

My point is 90% of the boat traffic, recreational boaters, don't transmit AIS so you are only avoiding larger commercial ships. AIS target being displayed before you can see it on a recreational boat is useless. It is probably 5 miles away on open water and even if it is around the corner you can't see, your boats are so maneuverable and so quick, there is no reason for a collision. I understand what AIS does but I just don't see the need for a recreational boater in the under 50' ever needing this. Again, there are only a limited amount of boats using it and the real problem is the summertime weekend warrior that doesn't know how to drive a boat that is the biggest worry for collision.

 

[Boat Guy]

Tom, I was heading south in the Chesapeake north of the Bay Bridge. A tanker was on the south side. My buddy saw it and told me not to be concerned because it was anchored on the other side. We were prob. 10 miles away from the bridge. I pulled up AIS and showed him that slow tanker was running at 18 knots.... The same speed we were running. Sure, I could avoid it without AIS. Still, those things move faster than you think. The wake was the biggest wave of the day and we were running in 3'-4' out of the east with plenty of wind.

Another nice thing is you can see where your friends are if you are meeting up. You can also monitor them if they run into a problem.

Believe me, I'm not suggesting every boat have it. Nor am I suggesting it's a necessity.... I know how cluttered my chart would be if AIS hits were all over it. Still, I like it.

 

[Henry Boyd]

If you only boat where commercial traffic is miles away, or on a lake where it is non-existent, AIS is of questionable value. If however you boat in a busy harbor full of fast moving ferries, commuter and tourist boats, that are going in multiple directions and piloted by people who believe recreational boaters don't have any rights at all, then AIS is literally a life saver.

Henry

 

[trit21]

Offshore Florida and bahamas trips so we see plenty of container ships running 30+knots, I understand. OP was was why has price not come down and why is it not on every VHF sold. I don't know anyone in our marina that has it, at least the people I talk to anyway. Too much clutter. I can monitor my friends with MMSI if I wanted to, again I don't. Call them on the radio and ask them even. Maybe if every single boat had a transmitter, then it would be useful but there are just too many people that it is just a toy and not real useful YET.

 

[River_Rats]

well as for the GX2150 I just set it up with my Lowrance HDS 10. there is nothing extra to buy, connect 3 wires for NEMA 0183. MFD to VHF and I now can see AIS on my MFD. Cost for me was $225 for the new VHF that needed updating anyway due to my other radio didnt have DSC. And anyone with out DSC in this day and age well that speaks for its self.

 

[tdschafer]

I think I have the GX 2150 also. I bought it when Jim at BOE had it on clearance. I installed it last year but had trouble getting the display to layover on my Garmin 3006c. I gave up & will tackle it again in the spring. I'm going to subscribe to this thread & may tap you guys for some help when I get back at it!


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Todd