Water between hull and deck: How concerned should I be?

[doubleg]

I'd just like to say I've just last year gone through a similar problem.
I had a 460 with ingress in the balsa core in most of below the waterline hull. - a little in the sides of the hull as well. The finding of such an extensive problem with delaminating was sickening. Mine was a demo boat 2000 model but delivered to me 03. After a few heated conversations and me airing my frustration Searay really came to the party. They sent people all the way out to Fremantle in Australia at their cost to inspect the problem. They then spent the next 3 months putting a whole new bottom on the boat and reglassed the sides. It looked brand new when completed and I could not fault any of the work that was carried out locally and inspected by Searay. During this process I decided that I didn't want a boat that had such extensive repairs and they traded it back at fair market value and I purchased a 48 Sundancer at a price that was too good to refuse - there happened to be a demo 48 in town- they really looked after me on the price. I can have nothing but praise for Searay and the local dealer as well. Neither walked away from the problem and they still have one very happy customer - me. This is my 5th Searay.

Good luck - I hope it turns out as good as mine did.

 

[Dave S]

Based on my own personal experience, as long as I felt the dealer and the company (Sea Ray) was working with me to solve the problem in question then I am willing to work with them. Sea Ray and most of their dealers have a pretty darn good record of taking care of things for customers from what I have seen in perusing boat forums over the last 6 years.

My approach is to ask a lot of questions. I then analize problems to see if I understand them and then I make sure the dealer (and Sea Ray if necessary) understands them as well. And I use my "sixth sense" to determine if I am being led around by the nose or if folks are being honest with me. Only when I feel I am beng taken advantage of do I get on the defensive. When faced with that situation, my next step is escalating thru the chain of command calmly and methodically. I also have used this approach to problems during my business career and it worked for me. It sounds like this is your approach too Dennis. Let us know what happens.

 

[islandhopper00]

Dave for the record, I don't have any issues with our dealer. In fact they have been very helpful. Our bunch does what they can do within the limitations of Sea Ray. I did start out friendly and nice and never recieved the proper attention that I felt I deserved. Oh well. I'll fix it myself.

Doubleg, That's great for you but what about the guy who buys the 460?
Will all the details be disclosed to the new perspective buyer? When more issues pop up will they be ready to be so accomodating with the now used boat owner?

I'm not just trying to flame Sea Ray, it's the whole boating industry. You guys can keep thinking it's little ole me causing problems but remember, I didn't cause the problems. I have to react to them. I just don't think I should have to beg for service, because the builder did or didn't do something correctly.

 

[RobF300]

my post of facts seems to have been skimmed right over by everyone :huh:

your problem is SIMPLE, the only problem you have is that the people working on the boat are not thinking outside the box and only looking for something so blatently obvious as if it would hit them in the head

 

[270SLX]

Wow . . .

For the record, the guy working on my boat does a great job mostly. The "cancer" isn't cured but at least the scar is invisible at this point.

I haven't missed much time from work over this. I'm on salary, so it's my employer who's out about 1 1/2 hours of my services. I will say that I've had a bit of anxiety and depression. No loss of consortium. [But the wife does ask "will our boat sink?" and "should we take (our grandsons) out on the boat until we find out what's wrong with it?']

At this point, I don't have a dispute with Sea Ray. They're "looking into it". I'll give them a couple more days to look into it and then I'll call them again. Hey, if they have several 270s with the same issue, they've got a lot to think about.

If I do have a dispute, yes, they'll be more ready than I.

I bought Sea Ray for their reputation of solid hulls, among other reasons. That's all I want and, if I get that, I won't have a worry about resale value. And, by the way, I would fully disclose the issues to a prospective buyer. I have to live with myself.

I do agree that boats ought to be built with the same quality as cars like Toyotas. I've owned four Toyotas since 1980, had one new car issue and four minor repairs. I would buy a Toyota if they said they'd give me a $200 discount if I bought it without a warranty. Sea Ray is ISO 9000 meaning that all production processes have documented work process steps to ensure consistency in meeting quality requirements. If they follow a six sigma philosophy, my boat had enough new boat defects for about 397 boats. Those are all fixed now due to the good work of my dealer backed by the SR warranty. If I'm naieve in thinking SR will continue to take care of me, so be it.

Have a little faith.

Dennis

 

[Turtlesboat]

Amen

 

[Asureyez]

A huge reasons to run like hell

You live in Iowa and it freezes there. Your hull has taken in some amount of water inside the "sandwich" and that moisture/water is going to freeze during storage. Subsequent problems are potentially equally concerning. Sea Ray will attempt o make spot repairs to get past this issue, and their warranty period leaving you naked and without a chair when the music stops.

My response to your circumstance would be to get Sea Ray's fix done ASAP and trade the boat back to the dealer for a different model. While there are "Lemon Laws" for cars there aren't any such consumer protections for boats.

If you keep the boat I'd negotiate hard for extended hull warrantee dealing specifically with hull delamination, cracking and freeze damage due to water intrusion.

I'd trade this boat back to the dealer if he'll take it. I bet he won't, and if I'm right that will be a huge "tell" as to his faith in Sea Ray's fix and how you should deal with Sea Ray.

 

[270SLX]

Yep, here in Iowa we can expect lows of 10 to 20 below. I'm writing down a lot of questions for SR. Among them is "how will it survive freeze/thaw cycles if the hull insulation is watterlogged?"

I was able to enjoy the boat over the weekend. But, with a lot on my mind.

Dennis

 

[270SLX]

Update: Sea Ray informed me today that they are sending a team to investigate the problem with my boat and fix it on August 15. There's no way, of course, to know what "fix it" means until we know the root cause and the extent of damage. And, I don't know how long I'll be without a boat. But, to me, this means that Sea Ray is standing behind its product. Again, we can only go forward one step at a time and this is a big step in the right direction.

I'll stop by to see the work in progress.

While my boat's in the shop, maybe I'll have to take my inflatable kayak out. Or, do some landscaping.

This thread, by the way, turned out to be something I didn't quite intend. In the end, I expect it to be a great Sea Ray customer service story.

Dennis

 

[Dave S]

Great news Dennis. :thumbsup:

 

[widowmaker]

Sorry to hear of your dilemna. Jeremy had issues with his 28 SD and the Sea Ray techs came and fixed things for him. I hope you have success and resolution soon!

 

[First Born]

Sorry to hear of your dilemna. Jeremy had issues with his 28 SD and the Sea Ray techs came and fixed things for him. I hope you have success and resolution soon!

Widowmaker, funny you should mention that. I went looking for his posting of it to PM 270SLX, but I think it may have been on the SRO days. If they are sending the techs out (which I think Frank had hinted would be the next step, he may have even used the words magicians), I have a feeling you will be impressed, from what Jeremy told us of his experience. Good luck with it sir!!!

 

[SeaRide]

Dennis,

I'm glad SR is sending their factory Techs. out to look over your 270. The factory team has been spotted at one of our local marinas in years past :thumbsup: . Great group of gentlemen.