sundancer 280 1989 to old?

[guus]

Hi All!

I'm going to look at a sundancer 280 with build year: 1989

i have no experience with polyester/fibreglass motorboats so i could use some advise because i have no idea what i should be looking for when i'm going over for a test ride.

asking price is around 16.000 USD and yes, the boat is almost 30 years old.

one of things i wonder about is, how long does polyester take to degrade? is a 30 year old sea ray still good in that respect? i read stories saying polyester itself never dissolves but it can de-hydrate and loose firmness.

it has 2 x 205pk Mercruiser engines and they told me one is already rebuild. and both allegedly are in good working order. Since this is not the first owner selling the boat there is no certainty about the hours they ran.

last thing i already know is a problem, it has no bimini top, only the harbour canvas to close off the boat.
this means that if it rains while on the boat i would have no rain protection.

i already looked on ebay and boat canvas sites but i cant find a top cover for this model and year anywhere.
does anyone know if a top form another model perhaps also might be a good fit?

thanks a lot for you input!

 

[gdavis67]

I certainly wouldn't be concerned about the age of the vessel - we have a 1990 390EC and the hull structure is still in excellent condition. The best advise, and you will hear it often in response to your question, is to get a full professional marine survey by an experienced surveyor. Try to find one in your area that has experience with this age boat and with the Sea Ray brand as they will know the typical problem areas associated with that hull. Have the motors checked as part of your survey: compression test, leak down test, possibly oil test. Check the lower sections of the hull compartments where the stringer lie for evidence of water. Walk the decks thoroughly for soft spots and pay particular attention around any hatches or other openings. The picture of the bilge would indicate the previous owner has taken good care of the boat, but looks can be deceiving. The small cost of the survey can save thousands of dollars later in unplanned repairs. As far as the bimini top, you are probably going to have to have a custom top made for that age boat. There are not any pre-made top companies that I know of that will sell a complete top for a boat of this age. It is an expense, but well worth it. The new top, if done right, will last 10+ years and add immediate value to your investment. Good luck on the purchase and listen carefully to your surveyor.

 

[guus]

Thanks a lot gdavis!

i think i'll just go with a surveyor as you suggested... then i'll know for sure.

 

[Little Ducky]

With my untrained eye that boat looks great.

Any interior pictures?

 

[guus]

i have two more:

 

[Little Ducky]

Someone really loved that boat.

Hope the survey looks just as good as the pictures.

 

[cfd95]

Thats was the first kind of boat i looked at a few years ago.
Survey came back bad.
The whole front deck from the windshield to the bow was rotted from water saturation.
Those big side windows always leaked.
For 16K i would have a survey done.

 

[guus]

well, it has these spots of tiny (gelcoat)hair cracks in the body all over. not sure if its a cosmetic problem that can be solved easily.
also all the.. what once used to be chrome-ish.. trims have faded. looks like it cant be polished because its looks like silver painted plastic and not actual metal. same goes for rubber seals like the one under the windshield.

also one of the throttle cables to the engine is shot. cable itself probably not expensive but might be a lot of work replacing.

i think the engines are still ok, one block is supposed to be fairly new.

what worries me the most is that most parts are probably about to fail out of old age and it seems almost impossible to get any original parts for this old beast.

are there any aftermarket parts being made for this boat?

If i buy it i think i will be its last owner and its fairly costly to have it scrapped also.

 

[NorCal Boater]

well, it has these spots of tiny (gelcoat)hair cracks in the body all over. not sure if its a cosmetic problem that can be solved easily.
also all the.. what once used to be chrome-ish.. trims have faded. looks like it cant be polished because its looks like silver painted plastic and not actual metal. same goes for rubber seals like the one under the windshield.

also one of the throttle cables to the engine is shot. cable itself probably not expensive but might be a lot of work replacing.

i think the engines are still ok, one block is supposed to be fairly new.

what worries me the most is that most parts are probably about to fail out of old age and it seems almost impossible to get any original parts for this old beast.

are there any aftermarket parts being made for this boat?

If i buy it i think i will be its last owner and its fairly costly to have it scrapped also.

Guus, Your profile doesn't say where you live but from the pictures you must be in an area where there are boat service professionals.

From the look of the pictures that boat "appears" to be in fantastic condition. It looks to have been well taken care of. First, don't get too wrapped up about the age of the boat. I've seen 5 and 10 year old boats that don't look that nice. Second, hairline cracks in fiberglass boats is a way of life. All fiberglass boats, of any age, will get them eventually. You say they are "all over the body." Can you explain what you mean by "all over?" Are there are cracks in the hull that look like spider webs with the cracks radiating from a center point? If yes, these could be impact points and could indicate a problem below the gelcoat. Again, a professional marine surveyor can answer these questions.

Third, without pictures of the trim I can't answer or give an opinion. If it is the stainless steel hardware (cleats, hawsers, railing, hinges, etc.) they do dull with time and can be polished.

Get the survey done. Here in the US our purchase process goes like this....

1. Make an offer subject to a professional marine survey and a Sea Trial. (I would not offer $16,000. I might offer $14,000)
2. The seller can accept or bring a counter offer. (maybe he comes back and says he'll take $15,000. If he won't accept an offer subject to survey, go find another boat. He is hiding something)
3. Go for a sea trial (test ride). Have the surveyor go on the ride. He should know if the boat is performing properly.
4. If you are happy with the Sea Trial both parties agree to proceed.
5. Have the survey completed.
6. If the survey finds problems with the boat you can now, (a) walk away from the deal, (b) accept the boat as is, (c) ask the seller to correct the issues found in survey, (d) negotiate a lower price that reflects repairs that are needed. The seller may not agree to all repairs but may be willing to accept some. Example....he is not going to fix hairline cracks.
7. Once agreement is reached, money exchanges hands and you own a boat

Again, don't get too concerned about the age of the boat. Be more concerned about the condition of the boat. Does the seller have any service records? Was the boat used in fresh water or salt water? Don't be concerned about the lack of a bimini top or other canvas. That can all be made or purchased.

I've been boating for 50 years and that appears to be the cleanest 1989 280da I have ever seen. I would be tempted to buy it based on the pictures alone.

One last bit of advice....don't get emotional about the purchase. Keep your thoughts on the fact that this is a business transaction.

Good luck. Let us know what happens.
Shawn

 

[NorCal Boater]

A couple more things.... Mercruiser still makes parts for the engine/outdrive so you will have no issues there. Also, there are thousands of after market parts available for this boat. Check eBay, go to eBay Motors....Parts & Accessories....Boat Parts. Now enter Sea Ray in the search line and you will get tens of thousands of parts and accessories available.

Don't over think this. If well taken care of, and this boat appears to have been, the parts will last a long time. Do a search on this forum for 280 Sundancers and you will find the "Official" page for this model. there will be lots of good info there.
Shawn

 

[hillsideshortleg]

We have the same boat and absolutely love it. That boat reminds me of ours when we bought it. Absolutely no regrets.

 

[JVM225]

That’s a great boat. Don’t worry about the age. I sold my 87 300 Sundancer in less than 24 hours two years ago.
Definitely have a survey done.
It looks like a nice boat so it’s worth going to the next step (a survey) with.

 

[boatman37]

Ours is a 1986 and engine/outdrive parts re very easy to find. I haven't had to buy and Sea Ray specific parts but unless you break something like a window or something not sure you would need anything Sea Ray specific.

Agreed on the survey. If the stringers and transom are rotted the boat is likely worth maybe a few thousand dollars and you will be wishing you hadn't bought it.

These era Sea Rays are well built. We bought ours in June 2015 and it has been flawless. We had the original canvas but it was beat up so we went to a local shop and got a whole new Sunbrella camper top for about $2100 and it was well worth it. Makes all the difference in the world.

 

[dvx216]

Expect to pay around 3 to 4 grand to put a camper top if not more depending on where you are .Don't fall in love with any boat before you do your homework . Looking on Boat Trader price seems a little high considering it has no tops and you didn't say anything about running gear. Tops and running gear alone add up real quick.

 

[guus]

reporting back,
i let it go, the owner confessed the boat ran into a pier or something and the railing got severely bent. he had it bent back but i think it didn't do anygood to the integrity of the construction of the boat. much like you wouldnt buy a car with a chassis that might have been warped by an accident.

now i got my attention on another boat that seemed to be a bit underpriced. after some inquiring i got a single picture explaining why.

seems like something that can be fixed but my question is, is it likely damage like this has deeper complications than meets they eye?

 

[NorCal Boater]

Anything can be fixed....but at what cost. Not sure of the boat model there but that does not appear to be a factory installed cleat. Someone installed it and my first impression is they did not install it with an adequate backing plate.

How is the rest of the boat? Is that the only bad spot?
Shawn

 

[guus]

Anything can be fixed....but at what cost. Not sure of the boat model there but that does not appear to be a factory installed cleat. Someone installed it and my first impression is they did not install it with an adequate backing plate.

How is the rest of the boat? Is that the only bad spot?
Shawn

not really sure, they were honest with this picture. if it really is a custom installed cleat i guess it wasnt attached to any structural parts. explains why it failed. but why would anyone do this? asking for trouble no?

anyway, its a long drive to see it... so hesitating to make the trip.
got some pictures:

 

[NorCal Boater]

Looks like about a 1994 250 Sundancer? Little smaller than the 280. Not sure why someone would put a cleat there. Stupidity?

From the pictures it looks OK. You can ask if they have any service records available and lots more pictures. If you like what you see take your favorite lady and go see it. Make a weekend trip out of it. I think I would also find out if there are any others in that area to see as well. What country are you in?
Shawn

 

[guus]

Hi Shawn,
I'm from Amsterdam, holland.
thx for your input, much appreciated.

you were close, its a 230 from 1995.
but its a long drive and i found another one much closer.

its a 270 from around 1987/1988 with a very smart looking exterior.

as i understand from looking around, a lot of folks say an older sea ray might even be a better choice than a newer one since back in the day sea ray would build them to last and from some point in time the started to compete with cheaper brands and therefor also started to manufacture their product with a little less quality.

they are asking around 22.000$

what do you think?

 

[NorCal Boater]

WOW! the interior of the boat is beautiful. Compared to the same boat here in the US I would say the price is a bit high BUT....if the rest of the boat is as nice as the pictures and mechanically it is in good shape I would say make an offer. What does it have for engines?
Shawn